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Ipad mini 4 & ForeFlight

BH1166

Well Known Member
Since i have ADSB IN/OUT via EchoUAT/SafeFly WAAS, do I really need a ipad with GPS? I’m thinking of an upgrade of my mini 4 to a mini 6 for increased processor speed, brightness and more memory. I don’t fly other planes, and I have an iFly740B as well as GRT SportSX/SafeFly I don't have/need cell service on the new ipad.

What will I loose in function if no internal GPS? Will I still have a icon moving on the magenta line as I do today?

Thanks
 
I fly with a IPad mini without gps. I have a unit called the Bad Elf Pro and it Bluetooths a gps signal to the iPad. Works great and the blue plane flies the magenta line. The Bad Elf is about the size of a stop watch. I think without some GPS input you will not have the moving Icon. At least mine won’t.


Keith
 
Probably don't "need" the GPS version. I just went through this same decision as I only use my iPad for flying and nothing else (not even web surfing, email etc). It stays at the airport.

In the end I realized a $150 wasn't too bad a one-time price for an extra backup GPS location feature. I ferry aircraft on occasion and also have a few airplanes with different equipment so it was easier in my case.

Last week I ordered a GPS version iPad Mini 6 outright from the Apple store without a cellular plan (these have a multiple-week wait for delivery currently). I have no use for built-in data as I am always near wifi andalso my cell phone can hotspot data to the iPad any time I need it. I see the discounted versions offered by cellular carriers but they require a data contract that eclipses the outright price.

Be advised the iPad Mini 6 is a different form factor and so legacy cases, cradles and knee boards may need to be replaced to accommodate the new dimensions.
 
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The first time you have to troubleshoot the connection between the devices you'll wish you just paid the $150... IMO that's not too much to have a backup GPS.

Plus if you ever have to ditch and walk back to civilization sure would be nice to have a built in GPS to your mapping device.

I have the mini 6 cellular and love it.
 
You DO NOT need a iPad with cell data or built in GPS to have full functionality including location and moving map on foreflight if its input is an Echo UAT with Skyfyx. Echo creates its own mini network and sends GPS, Wx, and traffic to the ipad directly. The cheapest ipad you can find will do the trick. That’s been my setup for ADS-B in and out for the past two years. Works great.
 
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I fly with a IPad mini without gps. I have a unit called the Bad Elf Pro and it Bluetooths a gps signal to the iPad. Works great and the blue plane flies the magenta line. The Bad Elf is about the size of a stop watch. I think without some GPS input you will not have the moving Icon. At least mine won’t.


Keith

It’s probably worth noting that an iPad Mini + Bad Elf Pro totals the same cost as the iPad Mini with cellular/GPS built in.

Personally, for $10/month I find cellular capability on my iPads to be very useful.
 
Input

Don’t have cellular so not sure what works with cellular. I have a Stratus 2S and a Mini 5. I do like that I have the back up gps and moving map info (that comes with cellular I believe), as well as the ADSB In and Wx, but I really like the AHRS. The back op PFD/ADI, is proving to be very accurate and, although I would not want to fly it to mins in crummy wx, it would certainly get me home in case of a full up navigation/electric failure. One more backup, not dependent on ship power, for when times go bad.
 
Note that T-mobile offers no contract prepaid data plan which can be purchased from the Cellular settings page on all the modern iPads with cellular. They have changed the offerings a bit but it’s usually about $10 for 5GB - again prepaid no contract and no SIM card required. If you only need cellular data sporadically it’s a pretty good deal.
 
Note that T-mobile offers no contract prepaid data plan which can be purchased from the Cellular settings page on all the modern iPads with cellular. They have changed the offerings a bit but it’s usually about $10 for 5GB - again prepaid no contract and no SIM card required. If you only need cellular data sporadically it’s a pretty good deal.
Not sure about everywhere, but my provider offers 5 sim cards or e-sims on the same plan for zero extra money. I use one for my phone, one for my tablet, and about to get a 3rd sim to provide data in the hangar for my remote power to the engine heater.

Worth a check to see if your mobile provider will do the same.
 
Note that T-mobile offers no contract prepaid data plan which can be purchased from the Cellular settings page on all the modern iPads with cellular. They have changed the offerings a bit but it’s usually about $10 for 5GB - again prepaid no contract and no SIM card required. If you only need cellular data sporadically it’s a pretty good deal.

That's what I do. $10 for 5GB over 5 months from T Mobile. I've noticed that this deal is not an option on the iPad itself. You have to call to get it or reload.

I use my data sparingly but it's sure nice if for some reason my cell phone doesn't have good service. Whenever I need to reload I buy a $10 T mobile card from Best Buy and they email it to me within minutes. Then I call T Mobile to reload it. It took me a bit to understand what magic words to use with T Mobile so they get me to the right people. They are so geared towards regular monthly cell phone service that sometimes it takes a couple of tries to break them out of that fog and have them realize you are on a prepaid data plan. It usually goes pretty smooth.

Just to clarify if this hasn't been mentioned, why are we talking about cellular service when the question was about GPS? Because on the iPads, if you want a built in GPS you have to buy the WiFi + Cellular units. Thanks Apple.

If you're wanting ADS-B you can't use the GPS in the iPad. You need a more accurate GPS which you install at the time of the ADS-B installation. Sounds like you have all this already so I'd say you're good to go.
 
$10/mo for each puts my three different iPads on my AT&T family cellular and data plan, which is unlimited. $10/mo to Verizon also put my Apple watch (which also has its own GPS) on a similar plan. All connect via bluetooth to my Bose A20's. Generally, it's been my preference to keep some standalone independence for my various navigation instruments.
 
64 or 256 gig iPad?

I fly with a garmin 660 and I love it. I want an ipad for backup. Should i get the 256 gig or will all the data I need fit on the 64 Gig?
 
64 GB is too small to download Foreflight charts and have anything else useful on there, I just sold a 64 GB iPad mini for that reason. I do suggest 256 GB or bigger if you use it outside the cockpit.
 
I too have a larger version of the ipad (512gb). The 512gb is certainly overkill I have all my foreflight, a bunch of movies, work stuff, and everything for teaching ground school and I have 267gb left available. The 256gb version would be the one to go for for flying and everyday life.

As far as cellular option. The cellular option on the ipad is needed to get the integral gps. Yes you can pair the ipad with a third party device for GPS data including your cell phone. The downside is that bluetooth connection can drain the battery on long flights so a battery pack/or charger is wise. The internal ipad GPS doesn't drain the battery as bad. A 5 hour flight with my ipad I still had 25% battery. My co-pilot using his third party GPS needed to plug in a battery pack to his ipad at about hour 3.5-4.

The ipad GPS is good for basic use but does not provide advanced data for the ADAHRS integration with foreflight. If you want that option you will need the third party GPS unit capable of the ADAHRS data
 
It’s probably worth noting that an iPad Mini + Bad Elf Pro totals the same cost as the iPad Mini with cellular/GPS built in.

Personally, for $10/month I find cellular capability on my iPads to be very useful.

Ipad with cellular.. it's all in one package, and with data you got it all.
 
The first time you have to troubleshoot the connection between the devices you'll wish you just paid the $150... IMO that's not too much to have a backup GPS.

Plus if you ever have to ditch and walk back to civilization sure would be nice to have a built in GPS to your mapping device.

I have the mini 6 cellular and love it.

I had a non GPS iPad Mini some years ago and used a Bluetooth GPS dongle.
It would reasonable often loose Bluetooth connection between the 2 and I would reconnect. This usually happened at worst moment of course.
Became so annoying I vowed never in future to get an iPad without GPS. The extra money is well worth the lack of hassle for me.
 
64 GB is too small to download Foreflight charts and have anything else useful on there, I just sold a 64 GB iPad mini for that reason. I do suggest 256 GB or bigger if you use it outside the cockpit.

I have a 64 gig iPad Pro, plus Foreflight, which takes 8.67 gigs with all the Sectional charts on but none of the IFR ones; and WingX, with similar charts, taking 6.23 gigs. Sometimes I use the iPad for email but only on trips. It has a few Kindle books (325.8 megs total), darn few photos and no music, but do have a few movies. I have 34.6 gigs left that could be used for anything.

64 gigs is plenty.

Also, worth noting, you don't need a cellular connection to get the benefit of the built-in GPS. But I've got to add that it's quite handy.

Dave
 
I have a 64 gig iPad Pro, plus Foreflight, which takes 8.67 gigs with all the Sectional charts on but none of the IFR ones; and WingX, with similar charts, taking 6.23 gigs. Sometimes I use the iPad for email but only on trips. It has a few Kindle books (325.8 megs total), darn few photos and no music, but do have a few movies. I have 34.6 gigs left that could be used for anything.

64 gigs is plenty.

Also, worth noting, you don't need a cellular connection to get the benefit of the built-in GPS. But I've got to add that it's quite handy.

Dave

I'll echo Dave's thoughts.

I have an iPad mini for my Glasair. I initially purchased a non-GPS/cellular version because I didn't see a need for it as I planned to use it in conjunction with my echoUAT ADSB system. I discovered that the connection to the ADSB system falls off with some regularity and I'd then lose GPS position at all the wrong moments.

I ended up returning the non-GPS mini and buying one with the GPS. No problems ever since. Also FWIW, I have the 64Mb version and it's plenty for all the Foreflight stuff. The Mini is dedicated to use in the plane as I have a full-sized iPad for personal use. It was a struggle for me mentally to buy anything less than the largest storage capacity as that's usually what I do when I buy computer stuff.

If you haven't dealt with I-devices in the plane before, I've found that it's very important to consider cooling the device. The combination of the power requirements of running a moving map at full-blast brightness along with the need for ship's power to maintain the battery charge causes plenty of HEAT. You'll probably need some combination of a minimal case along with supplemental cooling air to keep the I-device from going into a reduced brightness overheat mode.

EDITED TO ADD: You don't need to SUBSCRIBE to a cellular plan to have the benefit of an internal GPS. You DO have to buy the cellular CAPABLE iPad to get the internal GPS. Apple doesn't sell a non-cellular CAPABLE iPad that also has a built-in GPS.
 
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I have a 64 gig iPad Pro, plus Foreflight, which takes 8.67 gigs with all the Sectional charts on but none of the IFR ones; and WingX, with similar charts, taking 6.23 gigs. Sometimes I use the iPad for email but only on trips. It has a few Kindle books (325.8 megs total), darn few photos and no music, but do have a few movies. I have 34.6 gigs left that could be used for anything.

64 gigs is plenty.

Also, worth noting, you don't need a cellular connection to get the benefit of the built-in GPS. But I've got to add that it's quite handy.

Dave

I agree with capacity. I don't use FF but I do have WingX and FltPlan both installed with all the maps and approaches and the kitchen sinks for the entire USA plus over a dozen other aviation apps (AeroWeather, MyRadar, Stratux, FlightAware, FlightRadar24, AirNav, etc), plus the other 50+ apps (GoogleMaps, GasBuddy, Hotels.com, WhatsApp, PlutoTV, TuneIn, Pandora, Roku) and I have a dozen full length movies on the VLC app, plus I take my own personal videos and pictures, and I still have over 10GB left and mine's only 64GB.
 
I have a 64 gig iPad Pro, plus Foreflight, which takes 8.67 gigs with all the Sectional charts on but none of the IFR ones; and WingX, with similar charts, taking 6.23 gigs. Sometimes I use the iPad for email but only on trips. It has a few Kindle books (325.8 megs total), darn few photos and no music, but do have a few movies. I have 34.6 gigs left that could be used for anything.

64 gigs is plenty.

Also, worth noting, you don't need a cellular connection to get the benefit of the built-in GPS. But I've got to add that it's quite handy.

Dave

...and some famous guy once said, "Who's going to need more than 640k?"...
 
...and some famous guy once said, "Who's going to need more than 640k?"...

I agree more capacity is great, IF the future apps stayed the same size. The problem is future apps will use more space and need more processing speed to operated correctly, so even if you buy a 256GB iPad today thinking "I only need 30GB now and in the next 5 years I won't need many more apps", the same app you use now might not work with the iPad you buy today because its processor is too slow so the developer won't support it. Now you have to buy a new iPad even though you have 200GB still free in your current one.
 
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