What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Green Laser Attack

larrynew

Well Known Member
Green Laser Attack at KBAZ

We were attacked by a green laser during approach and landing at KBAZ last night. I say attacked because it lasted for several minutes during the approach and landing to rwy 13, for those familiar with New Braunfels.

F5F16AAC-3E76-4F71-930D-3D741BB12460.png

In 39 years of flying, I’d only seen brief flashes that I assumed were lasers. Nothing to affect safety of flight. This was a serious safety of flight issue. A Challenger jet landing ahead of us told us of the laser and that they had contacted ATC but we were already dealing with it before their alert. After landing, I called 911 to report it and they said they had already been contacted by San Antonio ATC. I filed the initial FAA laser incident report after we got home. I haven’t received the detailed report request from the FAA yet.

I’m posting this to consider, “what would you do?”. The screen shot is from a video my wife took while looking “through” her phone at the laser while avoiding looking directly at it. I had my head down and one hand up trying to block the extremely distracting flashing.

The weather was clear but I was using Garmin’s synthetic visual approach on the GTN650 and displayed on the G3X. The “highway in the sky” boxes on synthetic vision were a big help as I was avoiding looking out of the cockpit. I was thanking my flight instructor for his advice to treat every night flight as semi-IFR. I also had the Max-Viz IR camera display as I use it during night landings to look for deer on the runway but by about 200’, the laser had stopped. I did consider diverting.

One thing I will definitely consider if this ever happens again is to turn off all my lights. After we landed, my wife asked how were they able to see us to aim the laser. In the heat of the moment, I didn’t think of that obvious solution.
 
Last edited:
...One thing I will definitely consider if this ever happens again is to turn off all my lights. After we landed, my wife asked how were they able to see us to aim the laser. In the heat of the moment, I didn’t think of that obvious solution.
Great idea - no idea if it will make it a lot harder for the idiot with the laser to find you but it should. I've never used one of these lasers, so I guess there's not enough light to actually use it like a flashlight to find the aircraft. I guess the best course of action is to climb and circle over the laser source so that LE can find the laser. I saw a video of this on YT and it was great to see them come grab that knucklehead. "i dIdn't knOw It wOULd bOthEr thE pILOt..."
 
LASER Threat

This is an ongoing and serious issue in the commercial aviation world. My company requires a medical evaluation after any serious laser event, and we are required to report the event to the company and the FAA via an FSAP.

The other issue, besides the obvious distraction during flight, is the possible lasting damage that a laser can cause to your vision, especially the green lasers. Worth the effort to visit you doc to ensure you're still in good shape. From one of "our" pubs:

"Ophthalmologic symptoms reported after "laser strikes" include blurry vision, pain or a foreign body sensation, spots or halos in the visual field, sensitivity to light and eye fatigue. In a majority of reported cases, these symptoms resolve within 12 - 24 hours.
You should not resume flight duties until these symptoms have resolved and your vision has returned to normal.
If symptoms last beyond 24 hours, have your eyes checked by an ophthalmologist or optometrist. They will pay special attention to the retina, the visual receptor tissue at the back of the eye, to evaluate for evidence of permanent damage."

It's also vital that you report every encounter in real time if you can with ATC. I was on final to Lindberg Field, San Diego one night and we were lazed from a location in town. During the approach, I was interacting with ATC and the Sheriff helicopter on frequency, talking their eyes onto the target. Before we even landed the helicopter reported that they had the offenders in custody!

In another encounter:

"In June 2018, an individual from the Federated States of Micronesia(FSM v. Rawit, Criminal No. 2017-1517) was convicted and sentenced to prison for actively pointing a laser at a B737 while making an approach to Chuuk. This was possible through the information provided by the crew and the investigative work with the FBI and local authorities."

I do like the idea of going lights out. Of course declaring an emergency might be prudent at that point.

Be safe!
 
The interesting thing about your pic is that there appears to be 2 sources for the laser. That would be very concerning if that were indeed the case.
 
source

It looks like the source of the laser is the beach. the other spot appears to be the canopy reflecting the laser illuminating the phone/camera.
 
The interesting thing about your pic is that there appears to be 2 sources for the laser. That would be very concerning if that were indeed the case.

Definitely just one source. The video was 3 minutes and it was frequently reflecting off the cowl.
 
It looks like the source of the laser is the beach.

If you’re familiar with New Braunfels, the source was the South East corner of the RV park just south of Buc-ee’s on the east side of I-35 or a house in the neighborhood that’s immediately adjacent to the SE corner of the RV park. I let 911 know the location.
 
Last edited:
If you’re familiar with New Braunfels, the source was the South East corner of the RV park just south of Buc-ee’s on the east side of I-35 or a house in the neighborhood that’s immediately adjacent to the SE corner of the RV park. I let 911 know the location.

I figured it was from those apartments under the final to 13 (FM1101 & Creekside)...
 
Bill is spot on. Unfortunately, this is fairly common out here in the airline world.

Lasers can damage your eyes at range. Do what ever it takes to block the light and avoid looking at it. Your head's down move was the right thing to do!

Fly safe,

Vac
 
Bill is spot on. Unfortunately, this is fairly common out here in the airline world.

Lasers can damage your eyes at range. Do what ever it takes to block the light and avoid looking at it. Your head's down move was the right thing to do!

Fly safe,

Vac

Note, ‘not looking at it’ can still result in retina damage, it just won’t be in the normal focal region, so not as noticeable. But next time you have a good eye exam, it will be noted that you have a blind spot in your peripheral vision. Best to hold your hand up and physically block it.
 
Question. Is there a colored vinyl sheet that could be used to absorb the green laser to help block it? For instance I have a pair of glasses that are very good at blocking blue light. Green blocking glasses would be good to have for night flying if they were available.
 
There are laser safety glasses I’ve used at work. You need to pick the glasses for a particular range of colours and they mess with your colour vision badly. I think green lasers are around 540nm and the glasses cost around $300 in small order volumes.
 
I used to have a laser company as a client. They had a sign in the lab that read "Do Not Look Into Laser With Remaining Eye."

Dave
 
Ok

There are laser safety glasses I’ve used at work. You need to pick the glasses for a particular range of colours and they mess with your colour vision badly. I think green lasers are around 540nm and the glasses cost around $300 in small order volumes.

So when encountering a laser hit, at night, airplane lights off, laser glasses on, IFR, head down until at Decision point. Would that be red, green or white panel illumination? Am I missing anything?
 
Another option if you're not low on fuel is to break off the approach and put the threat behind you. Turn off all external lighting of course. Then come back in for another go at the approach.

Diverting is another option, fuel and divert airport(s) permitting. There's no VFR approach in general aviation that's worth damaged eyes.

If you're equipped and feeling saucy, overfly the bad guy and mark his lat/long with a user waypoint in your GPS. Give it to FBI when you land and have the satisfaction of sending another jacka$$ to jail.
 
Gash beat me to it.

Unless you're equipped to neutralize the incoming, break off engagement and regroup for another plan. Speaking from experience
 
Missed approach

Wouldn't it be prudent to go around and or land elsewhere?
Just asking. I don't know.
I do own one. Used it once. I was going to use it to shoot a level line for a job. Dang thing was so bright, I tossed it. I've seen one in the hands of a skilled astronomer at Davis Mountain. He was pointing out constellations. Yes, the beam is very bright.
 
Had this happen to me in the RV-8 last year. Took the wife up to watch 4th of July fireworks, and had someone lase us on RTB. I shut the lights off and proceeded back to the airport. Then got lased again on final when I turned on my landing lights. Turned the lights back off and proceeded overhead the pointer spot, got a lat/long that I relayed to ATC.

Checked it out with a FLIR the next time I flew the jet, but it was a neighborhood. No way to break out the individual house, and they were smart enough not to lase the jet. Bummer.
 
They do red, green and even blue lasers. I’ve been lazed at work with a blue one. I found a form to fill out (either an FAA form or FBI, I do t remember) and there was something about if your provided information leads to an arrest, there is a $10,000 reward!
 
Overblown

I’ve been illuminated by green lasers untold many times. IMO the “threat” is virtually non existent. You are VMC and not that close to the ground. If it is bothering you, don’t look at it. I found that most times it happened I looked at it because it’s kind of a cool effect. There have been no documented cases off eye damage due to laser illumination of a pilot.

-Andy
 
We had two in a C-130 in Ohio eye damaged circa 2014. Amslar grid test holes, real damage.

Crossing north Egypt on a clear night years back, you'd be lit up 100 times. One or two would be much more intense. NVGs between your eyes and the source helped.

"Eyes in" was an effective response in crew aircraft. Darken and mark point if you can.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...military-laser-shone-into-cockpit-at-heathrow

https://apnews.com/article/9835d2af768945d0b1b3a3a55c9147e1

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26735237/
 
I’ve been illuminated by green lasers untold many times. IMO the “threat” is virtually non existent. You are VMC and not that close to the ground. If it is bothering you, don’t look at it. I found that most times it happened I looked at it because it’s kind of a cool effect. There have been no documented cases off eye damage due to laser illumination of a pilot.

-Andy

I used to think the same thing until I got hit directly in the eye with a green laser while making a night overhead a couple of years ago. The approach and landing were otherwise uneventful but it was startling, and worse, it left my eye feeling a bit strange for several weeks afterward.

Skylor
 
Lazars can damage vision. Not all of them, but there's always the one person who has a big lazer and wants to see what happens.

An acquaintance of mine got lazar'd. He felt fine initially, but vision started deteriorating later that day. He had to book off work for a few days and see a doctor. Everything did come back to normal, but it was scary for him. Nearly lost his career.
 
Back
Top