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  #1  
Old 10-02-2021, 12:34 PM
rockwoodrv9 rockwoodrv9 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Meridian ID, Aspen CO, Okemos MI
Posts: 2,858
Default Slow Flight

I am working to finish my license in my plane and had a great flight today. I am still pretty much all over the place in steep turns and S turns, but getting the pattern, landings, and slow flight down pretty good. I am REALLY lucky to have Terry Lutz as my instructor.

We were able to set the AofA today which required slow flight. Today I was able to keep pretty study slow flight at 70, 60, and 50. The full flaps stall is 43k. I cant believe how well the plane flew at 50 and 55. Even the site out of the cockpit wasnt bad.

I have a couple questions for you experienced 9 pilots.

Pattern and landing speeds. I was slowing from cruise speed to 85 for flaps on downwind using 2 notches. As I turned on base, slowed to 70 -75 and added 3rd notch to full. Drove it to the runway at 65-70 over the runway and slowed down to about 60 - 65 on touchdown.

Does that sound reasonable or am I a little fast? Maybe 60 over the threshold and touchdown about 55?

Any other procedure or flying tips you want to offer, I am all ears!

Thanks
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rockwoodrv9a
Williamston MI
O-320 D2A
Flying N376E
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  #2  
Old 10-02-2021, 01:59 PM
alpinelakespilot2000 alpinelakespilot2000 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,728
Default

1.3-1.35 Vso or Vs1 (depending what landing configuration is being used) is what I found works best for me. At solo weight that means my full flap final approach is about 54kias, no flaps about 65kias.

Since everyone's IAS is likely different, be careful about using other peoples speeds. Figure out what your stall speed is in the configurations and weights you fly and go from there. Good luck.
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Steve M.
Ellensburg WA
RV-9 Flying, 0-320, Catto

Donation reminder: Jan. 2022

Last edited by alpinelakespilot2000 : 10-02-2021 at 02:04 PM.
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  #3  
Old 10-02-2021, 02:08 PM
rockwoodrv9 rockwoodrv9 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Meridian ID, Aspen CO, Okemos MI
Posts: 2,858
Default

Steve, you have my exact engine and prop combo. Thanks for the info. I understand every plane is different but it is nice seeing what others do. Hope you guys have a good winter up there!
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rockwoodrv9a
Williamston MI
O-320 D2A
Flying N376E
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  #4  
Old 10-02-2021, 03:14 PM
Flying Canuck Flying Canuck is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Red Deer, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 581
Default

You're using similar speeds to what I use, maybe 5KT faster. My best results come when I'm below 65KT on final, at or below 60KT crossing the numbers. I stall at about 44KT with full flaps. I don't look at my speed when I flare until I look at the logs later. More often than not I'm running 55-58KT at touchdown.

I struggled with my landings initially and that was 100% due to having too much airspeed left over the runway. The 9 has a speed that if you are above it when you try to flare, you just go flying again. Much below that speed you get sink, even aggressive sink if you pull back too much. Since this is right when your eyes are outside, the actual speed at that moment isn't important - you just need to have it under control before the flare.

I've been training for my IFR rating this year and when shooting an approach I pretty much need to use higher speeds (>100KT to start of descent, 80-85KT for the descent down to minimums) and reel them in on very short final. I've become pretty good at going from 75-80 with 150' left to 60KT crossing the threshold 30 seconds later. However I've got a constant speed prop that helps a lot. Learning that airspeed control takes a lot of familiarization with performance in the whole 55-85KT range. You can't practice enough and every flight is a lesson if you let it.

One recent lesson for me came when I was coming into a high altitude grass strip a few weeks ago and paid more attention to keeping the nose up than my airspeed and stalled and dropped in from a couple of feet. Happened in an instant, just a hard jolt with the grass taking most of it. Only took 10 seconds of too much back pressure to go from 55 to 44KT and I had no idea it was slowing that much because I got tunnel vision. I did manage to protect my nose wheel and pant though. Watching the video that someone took of that landing was eye opening, especially since the left wing clearly stalled first.

Enough rambling. Enjoy your training and your new plane.
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Claude Pitre
RV-9A #91081, C-GCPT
Dynon SkyView HDX, IO-320 and WW 200RV C/S. Flying as of August 6, 2018

Added GPS 175 and authorized for IFR April 1, 2021

Interactive map of all of my flights here
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  #5  
Old 10-02-2021, 04:01 PM
MacCool's Avatar
MacCool MacCool is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: central Minnesota
Posts: 764
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Iím on final approach with two notches of flaps and 60-65 kts over the fence. Start the flare to bleed of speed and gently settle with nose up at about 55-60 kts. I try to carry enough speed into the flare so that if I am too high or get a gust, I have enough room to keep pulling back of the stick to touch down gently, or in the event I have a gusting crosswind, Iíll have some room to kick some aileron and opposite rudder to touch down on one wheel. In the event I donít need that, Iíve found that itís still slow enough that the remaining energy bleeds off promptly.
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IO-320D1A (factory new), C/S
IFR equipped
AFS 5400/3500, G5, IFD440 navigator,
bunch of other stuff
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  #6  
Old 10-02-2021, 04:20 PM
Finley Atherton Finley Atherton is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: AUSTRALIA
Posts: 775
Default

Try using the Flight Path Marker (bumblebee) to improve the steep turns. Practice keeping it on the white line during turns to get the feel for the correct stick position attitude etc.

My speeds with a Hartzell CS prop.
Put in 2 to 3 seconds of flap (about 1/3 flap??) at the start of the base turn, slow to 65 kts for base.
Put in full flap at the start of the turn to final slow to 55 to 60 kts max.

Fin 9A
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  #7  
Old 10-03-2021, 10:01 AM
Steve Steve is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Roy, Utah
Posts: 1,232
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MY ASI is set to mph so it's 90, 80, 70 for downwind, base, and final. Those numbers convert to 78, 70, 61 kts. Keep in mind flap operating speed on the 9 is 90 mph or 78 kts.
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RV-9A
Utah

Last edited by Steve : 10-03-2021 at 10:06 AM.
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  #8  
Old 10-03-2021, 10:53 AM
Flying Canuck Flying Canuck is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Red Deer, Alberta, Canada
Posts: 581
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Keep in mind flap operating speed on the 9 is 90 mph or 78 kts.
That's for the full 32 degrees of flap extension. 15 degrees is 100 smph or 87 kts.
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Claude Pitre
RV-9A #91081, C-GCPT
Dynon SkyView HDX, IO-320 and WW 200RV C/S. Flying as of August 6, 2018

Added GPS 175 and authorized for IFR April 1, 2021

Interactive map of all of my flights here
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  #9  
Old 10-04-2021, 01:08 PM
airguy's Avatar
airguy airguy is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Garden City, Tx
Posts: 5,590
Default

Running a constant speed prop helps a LOT to slow it down and bleed energy, I'm usually over the fence between 65 and 70 knots with full flaps and zero power, enough down angle to maintain that airspeed, and then park it at an altitude of about 6 inches until she won't stay there anymore. I fly it onto the runway by feel and don't even look at the airspeed after I flare it in, but I've stolen an occasional glance inside to know that I'm touching down in the 52-54 knot range as the wing gives up.
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Greg Niehues - SEL, IFR, Repairman Cert.
Garden City, TX VAF 2021 dues paid
N16GN flying 900 hrs and counting; IO360, SDS, WWRV200, Dynon HDX, IFD440, G5
Built an off-plan RV9A with too much fuel and too much HP. Should drop dead any minute now.
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  #10  
Old 10-04-2021, 01:49 PM
sailvi767 sailvi767 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Charlotte NC
Posts: 1,388
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Canuck View Post
You're using similar speeds to what I use, maybe 5KT faster. My best results come when I'm below 65KT on final, at or below 60KT crossing the numbers. I stall at about 44KT with full flaps. I don't look at my speed when I flare until I look at the logs later. More often than not I'm running 55-58KT at touchdown.

I struggled with my landings initially and that was 100% due to having too much airspeed left over the runway. The 9 has a speed that if you are above it when you try to flare, you just go flying again. Much below that speed you get sink, even aggressive sink if you pull back too much. Since this is right when your eyes are outside, the actual speed at that moment isn't important - you just need to have it under control before the flare.

I've been training for my IFR rating this year and when shooting an approach I pretty much need to use higher speeds (>100KT to start of descent, 80-85KT for the descent down to minimums) and reel them in on very short final. I've become pretty good at going from 75-80 with 150' left to 60KT crossing the threshold 30 seconds later. However I've got a constant speed prop that helps a lot. Learning that airspeed control takes a lot of familiarization with performance in the whole 55-85KT range. You can't practice enough and every flight is a lesson if you let it.

One recent lesson for me came when I was coming into a high altitude grass strip a few weeks ago and paid more attention to keeping the nose up than my airspeed and stalled and dropped in from a couple of feet. Happened in an instant, just a hard jolt with the grass taking most of it. Only took 10 seconds of too much back pressure to go from 55 to 44KT and I had no idea it was slowing that much because I got tunnel vision. I did manage to protect my nose wheel and pant though. Watching the video that someone took of that landing was eye opening, especially since the left wing clearly stalled first.

Enough rambling. Enjoy your training and your new plane.
I am curious if you have the AOA system and tones activated on your HDX. It could prevent the situation you described.
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F-1 Rocket
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