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View Poll Results: What do you want the 15 to be?
Two Seats 85 46.20%
Four Seats 63 34.24%
Six Seats 11 5.98%
Low and slow 45 24.46%
As fast as the rest (Just high wing) 67 36.41%
Tandem 20 10.87%
Side-by-side 93 50.54%
Gas guzzer with huge payload 22 11.96%
Light and efficient, 200 ft takeoff roll 68 36.96%
This poll is stupid 50 27.17%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 184. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 08-12-2021, 05:15 PM
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FresnoR FresnoR is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 482
Default Poll, What do you want the 15 to be?

So many threads out there, let's take a poll:
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  #2  
Old 08-12-2021, 05:44 PM
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Jaypratt Jaypratt is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Hicks Airfield, Fort Worth,Texas
Posts: 1,789
Default 4 seats?.

You rarely see a C180 land with 4 people.. the cabin usually has 1 or two people, and their gear..
The 180 is the standard to go by. If Van’s takes a look at the C180 and improves on it. They will have a great airplane.
Let it lose 2 cylinders, and ,, 400 pounds. Keep the size and looks. It will still load 1000 pounds. 60 gallons of gas. 2 people and gear. Winner!
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Last edited by Jaypratt : 10-14-2021 at 08:53 AM.
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  #3  
Old 08-12-2021, 06:07 PM
tgmillso tgmillso is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Launceston, Tasmania, Australia
Posts: 841
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“Some people say, "Give the customers what they want." But that's not my approach. Our job is to figure out what they're going to want before they do. I think Henry Ford once said, "If I'd asked customers what they wanted, they would have told me, 'A faster horse!'" People don't know what they want until you show it to them. That's why I never rely on market research. Our task is to read things that are not yet on the page.”
-Steve Jobs


I guess we all get a kick out of speculating, but frankly this type of market research is akin to populist politics rather than having leadership that history will look back on as being visionary.

Tom
RV-7, that wishes it was a zero emissions battery electric derivative.

Last edited by tgmillso : 08-12-2021 at 06:10 PM.
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  #4  
Old 08-12-2021, 07:18 PM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 4,775
Default Poll

Sorry, but I suspect the decisions have been made.
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Donated 12/01/2021, plus a little extra.
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  #5  
Old 08-12-2021, 07:30 PM
Brian_G Brian_G is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: Canadian, TX
Posts: 15
Default

I wonder how representative the current Vans Air Force population is of the market for the RV15 anyway. Most of us here have already self selected into fast sport planes vs big tire high wings, so do they try to appeal to their current customer base or expand into the STOL crowd that would otherwise be over on the Kitfox and Rans forums about now?
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  #6  
Old 08-12-2021, 07:51 PM
Utah-Jay Utah-Jay is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Heber City
Posts: 24
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_G View Post
I wonder how representative the current Vans Air Force population is of the market for the RV15 anyway. Most of us here have already self selected into fast sport planes vs big tire high wings, so do they try to appeal to their current customer base or expand into the STOL crowd that would otherwise be over on the Kitfox and Rans forums about now?
You expand business by reaching to new customers, so reaching beyond the typical RV crowd would be expanding the business I should think. Some of the RV crowd will buy into the 15 though for sure. I registered for the site because of the RV-15
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  #7  
Old 08-12-2021, 08:42 PM
Grum.man Grum.man is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Statesville, NC
Posts: 38
Default

Logic would say it will be a 2 place and not a stol plane. Now it's just a matter of how big of an engine they feel is right and how fast. My guess is they will skip the Rotax size for 150+ hp based on the bulk of their current customers. Probably start with a 2 place to feel the market out then bring a 4 place later.
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  #8  
Old 08-12-2021, 08:50 PM
scsmith scsmith is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Ashland, OR
Posts: 2,974
Default

A poll of extremes makes it hard to get a good measure of how people feel.

Instead of just '2 seat' vs '4 seat', what about 2+2, meaning back seat big enough for 2 kids, but easy to take out to put lots of gear in instead?

Instead of 'as fast as the rest' vs 'low and slow', what about an in-between? Fast enough to be able to get to the back country efficiently from some distance away, and slow enough to be able to use a lot of the back country once you get there, but probably not gravel bars and sand dunes? So, something in the 130 kt range for cruise, and under 50 for landing.

It is this middle ground that seems to me to fill a niche that is not well served right now. Want a super-capable big hauler? Buy a C-180. Want to land on gravel bars? Buy one of the multitude of cub-clones.

But, what do I know?
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  #9  
Old 08-12-2021, 09:05 PM
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jcarne jcarne is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Worland, Wyoming
Posts: 1,984
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian_G View Post
I wonder how representative the current Vans Air Force population is of the market for the RV15 anyway. Most of us here have already self selected into fast sport planes vs big tire high wings, so do they try to appeal to their current customer base or expand into the STOL crowd that would otherwise be over on the Kitfox and Rans forums about now?
Haha yep, these polls/discussions are the definition of bias. Another good example I can use in the classroom.

That being said, they are entertaining as it's fun to speculate/want.
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  #10  
Old 08-12-2021, 07:40 PM
BillL BillL is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 6,326
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tgmillso View Post
“Some people say, "Give the customers what they want." But that's not my approach. Our job is to figure out what they're going to want before they do. I think Henry Ford once said, "If I'd asked customers what they wanted, they would have told me, 'A faster horse!'" People don't know what they want until you show it to them. That's why I never rely on market research. Our task is to read things that are not yet on the page.”
-Steve Jobs
This was my experience completely!! Steve Jobs got it right, why haven't others?
People don't buy things - they buy functionality. Add functionality at lower total cost and you have a replacement product. It is not the magic people might think, nor is it quick. Not even electronics.

The average life of a car is 18 yrs. So, if one wanted California to be an all electric car population on the roads, and only electrics were sold beginning today, 50% of cars would be electric in 18 yrs.
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