VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

-POSTING RULES
-Advertise in here!
- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

Keep VAF Going
Donate methods

Point your
camera app here
to donate fast.


Go Back   VAF Forums > Model Specific > RV-12/RV-12iS
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 07-15-2008, 08:54 PM
JerryG150's Avatar
JerryG150 JerryG150 is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Bradenton, Florida
Posts: 348
Default New FAA Policy on Amateur Building Released

The FAA released it's new policy on EAB. Here's the link...

http://eaa.org/news/2008/2008-07-15_overview.asp

http://www.eaa.org/news/2008/2008-07-15_policy.asp

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/2008/E8-16093.htm

Maybe someone can explain what this means to me building an RV-12.
__________________
"Time, be careful how you spend it ... cause it isn't going to last."
VAF #1037
Reserved N124JG for RV-12
"12 for Jerry G.
http://jerryg150rv12.blogspot.com/

Last edited by JerryG150 : 07-15-2008 at 08:57 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 07-15-2008, 09:14 PM
Geico266's Avatar
Geico266 Geico266 is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Huskerland, USA
Posts: 5,861
Default

Build on Jerry G.
__________________
RV-7 : In the hangar
RV-10 : In the hangar
RV-12 : Built and sold
RV-44 : 4 place helicopter on order.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 07-15-2008, 09:40 PM
mrt890 mrt890 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Friday Harbor, Wa
Posts: 300
Default 51% Rule Change

JMO but this probably limits the 12 to E-LSA only.

MRT890
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 07-15-2008, 09:41 PM
Peterk Peterk is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,378
Default

Larry is right Jerry. As long as you plan on building an ELSA...so far so good. The new plan wants am-builts to prove that they actually fabricate 20% of the aircraft (not just assemble)...that might be tough with the 12...except they are attempting to get certified as an SLSA which would give us permission to get an airworthiness cert with "no major portion requirement". See 8130.2F (141)(c)(2). You will still have to get a 16 hour repariman's cert to inspect it and certify it for your DAR.

Keep in mind it has to be built to Van's approval - no changes - until you get your airworthiness cert...then you can change it.

Anyway...thats the way I see it...if I'm wrong...someone please straighten me out...thanks

Pete
wings done...waitin on the fuse
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 07-15-2008, 10:20 PM
kevinh's Avatar
kevinh kevinh is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: San Mateo, CA
Posts: 1,419
Default

Actually - looks pretty reasonable to me. Whew!
__________________
-kevinh, Track my RV-7A, flying, alas, sold in 2013 after 450ish hours. (I'm now building something different)
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 07-16-2008, 05:55 AM
tomcostanza tomcostanza is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 292
Default

Quote:
To ensure consistency and standardization concerning amateur-built kit aircraft evaluations, the FAA proposes to clarify how much
fabrication and assembly must be performed by the amateur builder. The
FAA is proposing that an amateur builder fabricate a minimum of 20
percent of an aircraft and assemble a minimum of 20 percent of the
aircraft.
[RANT]
This, for example, is so ridiculous, it could only be written by someone knowing little to nothing about the process (read bureaucrat). What does this mean? How do you measure 20% of the fabrication? Is it 20% of the length, 20% of the weight? If you have 30 ribs, does the builder fabricate 6 of them? The ribs (and most other parts) of a Van's kit are "fabricated" on a CNC machine. The fabrication consists of putting a piece of aluminum in the machine and pressing a button. If I go to Van's and push the button, do I qualify as having "fabricated" the part? Do I need to buy yet another tool to fabricate it? Or, do I need to fabricate it with a hammer and hand brake? And if I do, how less safe is that part, compared to a CNC fabricated part?

These kits are designed so that someone with above average, but less than expert skills can build an airplane that is safe and affordable (barely). I agree that there is a problem with the existing situation, but I fear that this cure will become worse than the disease.

Your tax dollars at work.
[/RANT]
__________________
Tom Costanza
RV-7A Fuse
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 07-16-2008, 06:42 AM
Jamie's Avatar
Jamie Jamie is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 2,295
Default

The FAA is defining "fabrication" as the following:

Quote:
"Fabrication is defined as ?to construct a structure or component from raw stock or materials.? This excludes rebuilding or restoring activities.?
If amateur builders must fabricate 20% of the aircraft I don't think even the existing slow-build kits meet this criteria.
__________________
"What kind of man would live where there is no daring? I don't believe in taking foolish chances but nothing can be accomplished without taking any chance at all." - Charles A. Lindbergh
Jamie | RV-7A First Flight: 7/27/2007 (Sold)
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 07-16-2008, 07:17 AM
170 driver 170 driver is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Walterboro SC
Posts: 155
Default

Thank goodness Van got all his kits grandfathered,,,I feel sorry for the people building other kits though,,,looks like their paperwork might be alot more to prove the fabrication part.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 07-16-2008, 07:52 AM
Mel's Avatar
Mel Mel is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Dallas area
Posts: 10,916
Default All previously listed kits are "grandfathered".

Quote:
Originally Posted by 170 driver View Post
Thank goodness Van got all his kits grandfathered,,,I feel sorry for the people building other kits though,,,looks like their paperwork might be alot more to prove the fabrication part.
Van didn't get "his" kits grandfathered. All kits that were on the list got grandfathered.
__________________
Mel Asberry, DAR since the last century. Over 1,000 certifications accomplished.
EAA Flight Advisor/Tech Counselor, Friend of the RV-1
Recipient of Tony Bingelis Award and Wright Brothers Master Pilot Award
USAF Vet, High School E-LSA Project Mentor.
RV-6 Flying since 1993 (sold)
<rvmel(at)icloud.com>

Last edited by Mel : 07-16-2008 at 08:18 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 07-16-2008, 07:52 AM
Geico266's Avatar
Geico266 Geico266 is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Huskerland, USA
Posts: 5,861
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 170 driver View Post
Thank goodness Van got all his kits grandfathered,,,I feel sorry for the people building other kits though,,,looks like their paperwork might be alot more to prove the fabrication part.
That is the key, Van's kits are grandfathered.

Mostly, this FAA "clairification" is to put a hurt on hired builders, and speculation builders. Like anything there are ways around it. We'll just have to see how creative "builders" get. Maybe the new assisted builders sloagans will be something like "Four Weeks To Taxi".

I think this is a good thing. The FAA could have come down with a much bigger hammer. I see this as just getting the attention of professional homebuilders.
__________________
RV-7 : In the hangar
RV-10 : In the hangar
RV-12 : Built and sold
RV-44 : 4 place helicopter on order.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:50 PM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.