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Ugh ... Oil Filter Shortage got me

bkervaski

bkervaski

Hellloooooooo!
Testing
Well, I had a few, gone through them, down for condition inspection and ... zero oil filters to be found, which was expected.

So, I went after a Challenger Permanent Oil Filter (CP48110C) and am coming up short.

Anybody have a source for the Challenger Oil Filter for the IO-390?

Thanks for any help :)
 
There was an article by I believe Paul Dye on the Kitplanes website regarding the actual manufacturer of the Challenger filter, K&P I believe. Check out the article it may be of some help.
 
Tempest 48110

When we are running short on filters for Base Leg Aviation, I check Amazon. You can see who is selling them ( most recently plane spares). Then I go to the website of the seller and usually find them cheaper there-at least for 6 or 12 packs. However the cost now is almost double what it used to be.
 
carolsyracuse said:
When we are running short on filters for Base Leg Aviation, I check Amazon. You can see who is selling them ( most recently plane spares). Then I go to the website of the seller and usually find them cheaper there-at least for 6 or 12 packs. However the cost now is almost double what it used to be.
Click to expand...

Thanks, Carol :) There's definitely some gouging going on due to the shortage.
 
If you can find someone to sell it to you - I think you want the K&P C4 housing and an FE15 filter element.

The C4 has the hex fitting and safety wire holes. The FE15 has 3/4-16 threads.

If you tell the seller it’s for an airplane, they will either send you to Challenger and/or tell you they can’t sell it to you. If you tell them it’s for a race car, they might.

There is information in that article that the filter elements are different from Challenger vs. K&P, but I have been unable to verify that anywhere else.
 
oil filters

got my k&p s15a anodized black $199 free shipping in less than 5days from usaoilfilters.
 
K&N HP-2004 if made in USA version, safety wire holes, $17 or Wix 51068 $9, either work if you have an adapter with a 3/4-16 nipple sticking out of it. Clamp on safety wire with the Wix if you desire.

Both bypass a few PSI before most aircraft OFAs, IF your adapter bypasses and before most aircraft filters. Really their only hit other than thinner cases and baseplates.

YMMV.

I like the S15 just fine, likely going that way in a few years.
 
K&P S15 reusable oil filter

KatanaPilot said:
If you tell the seller it’s for an airplane, they will either send you to Challenger and/or tell you they can’t sell it to you. If you tell them it’s for a race car, they might.
Click to expand...

Got my S-15 from ECS Tuning for $159. Had to buy the 3 nipple separately (can't remember where.....) to adapt it to my O-320. Only thing they asked me was where can we ship it? I might have told them it was for my Audi....;) but I think that was so they could make sure I was ordering the right unit. There was a little delay as the demand was high at the time but otherwise came without issues. Nice unit. Holes drilled for safety wire. Comes with an installation/removal tool. Extra gaskets ordered at the same time. Gaskets are said to last 2-4 oil change. Read Paul's KITPLANES article.
 
Roadjunkie1 said:
Got my S-15 from ECS Tuning for $159. Had to buy the 3 nipple separately (can't remember where.....) to adapt it to my O-320. Only thing they asked me was where can we ship it? I might have told them it was for my Audi....;) but I think that was so they could make sure I was ordering the right unit. There was a little delay as the demand was high at the time but otherwise came without issues. Nice unit. Holes drilled for safety wire. Comes with an installation/removal tool. Extra gaskets ordered at the same time. Gaskets are said to last 2-4 oil change. Read Paul's KITPLANES article.
Click to expand...

I agree

I got mine from ECS tuning for the same price but it took almost 8 weeks because of being on back order (probably from so many experimental airplane owners buy them :rolleyes:)
FYI, the filter comes with one extra gasket.
 
Anyone have an idea if the K&P S15 (non-Challenger) version will be difficult to remove access wise from a straight back toward firewall position on an O320 on an RV9 mount? I know it comes with its own removal/installation tool. Just not sure whether I’ll have enough room to get a socket or torque wrench onto the tool in the event the filter sticks back into the firewall recess at all.
Thanks for any thoughts. Thanks to Paul also for the great Kitplanes writeup.
 
alpinelakespilot2000 said:
Anyone have an idea if the K&P S15 (non-Challenger) version will be difficult to remove access wise from a straight back toward firewall position on an O320 on an RV9 mount? I know it comes with its own removal/installation tool. Just not sure whether I’ll have enough room to get a socket or torque wrench onto the tool in the event the filter sticks back into the firewall recess at all.
Thanks for any thoughts. Thanks to Paul also for the great Kitplanes writeup.
Click to expand...

I installed one on our RV-6 which has a firewall recess (primarily to accommodate the prop governor). The standard replaceable filter was always close to the plane of the firewall, and it took some careful maneuvering to get the wrench on the stud. The S15 is shorter, and was therefore easier to install. Can;’t speak directly to your configuration, but for us, the S15 made things qualitatively better….

Paul
 
I'm running the K&P S15 on my IO360, my buddies have the same S15 on a 320 and a 390. I'm 4 oil changes in and absolutely LOVE these filters, they work great and are not hard to clean. I actual prefer the cleaning vs cutting open the one time use filter to get the grit out of the filter to get a good look at EVERYTHING that was caught in the filter and magnet pickup.
 
bjdecker said:
...K&P rebranded...
Click to expand...

The K&P S-15 doesn't have a 17mm nut on the top and the one linked above does, so pretty unlikely to be a K&P re-brand. Have no idea which is better, but would appear they are not the same part.
 
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lr172 said:
The K&P S-15 doesn't have a 17mm nut on the top and the one linked above does, so pretty unlikely to be a K&P re-brand. Have no idea which is better, but would appear they are not the same part.
Click to expand...

You are correct insomuch as the S-15 doesn't have a nut. However, the FE-15 (which sits inside the S-15) will work with the C4.

Attached from the K&P website.

Edit: added parts breakout for the S-15.
Edit: The C4 housing is special -- only available to Challenger and other OEMs now
 

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lr172 said:
The K&P S-15 doesn't have a 17mm nut on the top and the one linked above does, so pretty unlikely to be a K&P re-brand. Have no idea which is better, but would appear they are not the same part.
Click to expand...

My understanding is the Challenger is K&P for aviation, the filter is the same, but the housing is different because of the "nut" on the back and holes for safety wire. The K&P used a tool to tighten it down and you can drill holes on the top most fin to get your safety wire into it. Functionally the same.

Again, my understanding and I can confirm the K&P works just fine to replace the 48110 filters I needed the threaded stud that can be purchased with the filter or elsewhere to save a couple bucks
 
Hangar 1271 said:
I am using a Flo PCS4 on my IO-360-M1B, and my neighbor is using the same filter on his 390. On Amazon, comes in black, stainless steel, and combination, for about $112, has a 17 mm nut and a safety wire hole. Works great so far (admittedly, only a few hours on it at this point). I also have one on a Rotax 912.

https://www.amazon.com/PC-Racing-PC...mzn1.fos.18ed3cb5-28d5-4975-8bc7-93deae8f9840
Click to expand...


https://www.amazon.com/PC-Racing-PCS...7-93deae8f9840
...K&P rebranded...


Brian/David. Will it accept a 3/4-16 nipple so I can use the Flo PCS4 on my O-320
 
First, the PCS4 is not a rebranded K&P. They are separate companies. Second, The Challenger is the S-15 for aviation but the S-15 will work as long as you don't tell them it is for an airplane. I got them to talk to me by telling them it was an airplane engine on an airboat. They have some marketing (K&P and Challenger) agreement not to step on each other. Third, I chose the PCS4 because it has the nut, which I like, and safety wire hole and I didn't want to drill a hole in a fin. There are some others with the nut and hole that are cheaper (about $60) but they were Chinese and I preferred a US manufacturer. If anyone tries to tell me these are also made in China, I'll just cover my ears and hum for a while. I prefer not to know.

The PCS4 takes a 3/14 16 nipple. If you need a 10 Champion filter, you can put the nipple in the filter out of an old Champion or Tempest filter. If you want, you can loctite the nipple into the engine and convert to an 08 filter. All options work the same.

There is some really great info on filters on VAF. There were a couple threads where a few of the people actually had credentials to be authoritative in their opinions. I learned a lot and it made decisions easier.
 
I had ordered some filters from Aircraft Spruce well before Oshkosh, and ended up getting them mid-October. I was going to try the Napa filter mentioned for the airplane, but it didn't have the 3/4-16 nipple. I tried ordering one of the nipples off of Amazon (they are a couple of bucks), but guess what? They won't ship them to California! I guess a simple steel pipe with threads is some sort of environmental threat. Not the first time Amazon has denied me a product here. I'm sure other suppliers would provide them here.
 
bruceh said:
I tried ordering one of the nipples off of Amazon (they are a couple of bucks), but guess what? They won't ship them to California! I guess a simple steel pipe with threads is some sort of environmental threat.
Click to expand...

California says oil is bad . . . I guess that means oil filters, too.
:rolleyes:
 
All this discussion has got me thinking about the benefits of this style of re-usable filter. However, I know the paper does a great job of hanging on to particles for later investigation. Curious if others have found that the SS screen behaves similar. I am a bit concerned that the particles will not stick to the mesh and just be floating around in the oil surrounding the screen and will get lost as I take it apart. Not sure how I would strain that oil to find out what the filter has been stopping with this method.

Anyone out there have any real world experience? In my thinking, the filter not only protects the oil but also serves as a historical marker of the debris being produced.

Larry
 
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Warren M- How much filter area difference between the Challenger/K&P S15 and the PCS4?

This looks like a no brainer as I do not enjoy the cut/clean/collect/inspect of a paper media filter can- though I find the task mandatory DIY.
 
The K&P is easier to clean (to me) than the cutting of the throw away paper filter. There might be some loss of material when the filter is removed and the oil drains, but I cant believe the loss is much different from the paper.

It's very easy to get every last piece of grit (use this to reflect, carbon and metal stuff) out of the stainless filter element, I have a plastic tub I fill half way with gas, drop the filter in, cover it and shake it all up. A few blasts of parts cleaner inside the filter gets the last few bits of grit out of the filter and into the tub. let it sit for a couple minutes then pour off the gas as the get settles to the bottom. (soft tooth rush can help final clean up of the filter element)

Once the gas dries up you have all the grit left in the tub, a good magnet across the bottom can quickly sort out the magnetic metals from the non.

A little gas poured into the filter housing, swirl it around and the grit comes out of the housing and you now have "all" the grit in the tub.
 
The PCS4 filter has a magnet imbedded in it to catch metal. Should make finding any metal easier than a paper filter.
 
Convinced to try

Oil filter prices almost doubled in the last year or so, not to mention their inavailability...
The above sentence and you guys convinced me into trying a reusable oil filter.

I went with the PCS4 as it was easily available in Canada.
Has the nut for torquing, hole for safety wire and a magnet.

Ordered yesterday, received today !!!

Will test it at next oil change in 20ish hours air time.
 
riseric said:
Oil filter prices almost doubled in the last year or so, not to mention their inavailability...
The above sentence and you guys convinced me into trying a reusable oil filter.

I went with the PCS4 as it was easily available in Canada.
Has the nut for torquing, hole for safety wire and a magnet.

Ordered yesterday, received today !!!

Will test it at next oil change in 20ish hours air time.
Click to expand...


….. I ordered a PCS4 today as well O320.
 
riseric said:
Oil filter prices almost doubled in the last year or so, not to mention their inavailability...
The above sentence and you guys convinced me into trying a reusable oil filter.

I went with the PCS4 as it was easily available in Canada.
Has the nut for torquing, hole for safety wire and a magnet.

Ordered yesterday, received today !!!

Will test it at next oil change in 20ish hours air time.
Click to expand...

Eric,

Where did you purchase in Canada?
 
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lr172 said:
All this discussion has got me thinking about the benefits of this style of re-usable filter. However, I know the paper does a great job of hanging on to particles for later investigation. Curious if others have found that the SS screen behaves similar. I am a bit concerned that the particles will not stick to the mesh and just be floating around in the oil surrounding the screen and will get lost as I take it apart. Not sure how I would strain that oil to find out what the filter has been stopping with this method.

Anyone out there have any real world experience? In my thinking, the filter not only protects the oil but also serves as a historical marker of the debris being produced.

Larry
Click to expand...

I use the Challenger/K&P filters on both the 7 & 10. I clean the elements in an ultrasonic cleaner and then dump the fluid from the ultrasonic cleaner through a couple of fine mesh paint strainers. There is also a magnet on the element that usually has a very small amount of sludge.

Doing this along with oil analysis every couple of oil changes is hopefully adequate.
 
moosepileit said:
Warren M- How much filter area difference between the Challenger/K&P S15 and the PCS4?

This looks like a no brainer as I do not enjoy the cut/clean/collect/inspect of a paper media filter can- though I find the task mandatory DIY.
Click to expand...

A little under 1/2 inch in HT.
 
I put my K&P in a glass jar with a little gas - shake it wells to drop everything out, and pour it through a coffee filter. Pretty easy to see exactly what you're dealing with that way.
 
I have been using coffee filters as a strainer for years for my Champion paper filters. It is amazing how fine of residue the coffee filters catch. You can see stuff in the coffee filters that you cannot see by just visually inspecting the paper from the champion oil filters. Using coffee filters is one step closer to oil analysis.
 
Nice!

KatanaPilot said:
I use the Challenger/K&P filters on both the 7 & 10. I clean the elements in an ultrasonic cleaner and then dump the fluid from the ultrasonic cleaner through a couple of fine mesh paint strainers. There is also a magnet on the element that usually has a very small amount of sludge.

Doing this along with oil analysis every couple of oil changes is hopefully adequate.
Click to expand...

Agreed!

Curious as to what ultrasonic cleaner you use. Coffee filters or paint strainers seems to be the way to go. I love that there is that cute little magnet in the housing to catch that stuff you want to know about..!
 
Confused - normal

I was taught to always looks at the color and decide in the 25 - 50-hour range when it looked very dark to change it also known as looking at the condition. This is from the Challenger data on knots to u. Color or time ?


Q: Should I change my oil and oil filter when the oil turns black?

A: Ashless dispersant oils are designed to get dirty so that the engine stays clean. Just how fast the oil turns black depends on many factors including condition of the engine, dirt load of oil filter, oil temperature, normal air mixture, type of fuel and frequency and duration of your flights. Change your oil filter on a calendar or engine time, not according to its color.
 
PCS4 - Amazon

For Canucks, the PCS4 is available on Amazon.ca site for a $40.00 premium over the Amazon.com site. It's probably a wash with customs. I have not found a Canadian source for the K&P S-15 filter. Any leads appreciated.

Cheers, Sean
 
Flo PCS4

Here's some photos and details of the critter.
Overall height: 3" 7/16 including nut and gasket

Diameter: 2" 15/16
Weight: 11,3 oz (320 g)

Filter element height: 1" 3/4
Diameter: 1" 7/8
(measures are approximate)

Impressions: seems built with quality materials and well made.
There's a spring loaded ball acting as by-pass if needed.
Very easy to disassemble and assemble.
 

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Could someone rig up a bypass sensor and figure out if 40 degree f 20w50 or 15w50 will bypass at idle rpm flow and say 60psi on the aircraft oil pressure sensor?

Since the Kitplanes article thread and this one, that's my testing concern vs legacy paper filter media.

We likely see bypass either in the standard aircraft filters or the OFA at 11-13 psi diff and some with a viscosity valve in lieu of vernatherm will have different numbers.

I think automotive filters bypass lower, typically 8 psid- at that is likely 30 weight or less viscosity and only mid 30 psi and possibly lower gallons per minute flow.

Might need a sealed, clear cutaway, which may not be easy to see. Or, like the old master Luscome and RV-6 zero thrust glide tests by the late Prof. Jack Norris A thin wire continuity break to a light or sensor.

Sorry for the long google links, 1 is a Purdue pdf, the second old aeroresources pdf.


https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...MQFnoECA8QAQ&usg=AOvVaw3S4Ipgx-83lSMIkXXTaO3A

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...MQFnoECBUQAQ&usg=AOvVaw3H5YOtN9NUVHMx3hHLByld
 
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I have one of the PCS4 oil filters. It appears to me that the o-ring is a standard flat type, not the quad ring type o-ring used on K&P filters. I’m not sure they would be interchangeable.
 
As I mentioned, I have 2 PCS4 oil filters. On one box the installation instructions said to torque to 20-25 ft-lbs. On the other it said 15 ft-lbs. I called the tech support and found they reduced the torque as people were having difficulty removing the filter at the higher torque. They recommend 15 ft-lbs and recheck the torque after first use. They claim the first use burns off the oil used on the gasket for installation and after that and it won't come loose. I still put on a safety wire.
 
If it walks like a duck...

I'll just leave these here - you can form your own opinion.

PC Racing/FLO/ PCS4B on the Left, K&P FE15 from the S15 on the right in each picture...

The FE15 is longer than the PCS4B by 3/8"
The FE15 filter material has a smaller/tighter weave than the PCS4B -- held each up to the light to compare.
The FE15 has a tube like structure inside behind the screen.
Both have a 3/4-16 threaded receptacle
Both have a pressure bypass at the bottom of the filter (spring loaded ball)
Both have a RE-magnet pressed into the filter body
Both have an O-ring as the primary seal - S15 is an X-profile, the PCS4B is square -- similar to Champion/Tempest.

Disclaimer -- I am not affiliated with K&P, but I am using an S15 on my RV-7 w/ Lycoming IO-360-A1B6.
 

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