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  #1  
Old 09-12-2021, 03:15 PM
Tcheairs Tcheairs is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Covington
Posts: 85
Default High Oil Pressure and High Oil Temp

I've been having a problem with my oil pressure relief valve (Titan XIO 360 with 140 hrs TT). I had been running 45 psi in cruise flight and attempts to raise the oil pressure with the PRV (pressure relief valve) adjustments were not successful. Removed the PRV and cleaned the seat, spring and ball. Re assembled and still no increase in cruise pressure, however cold starts (85 degrees ambient temperature) produced 55 psi at idle and 75 at engine runup to 1700 and 100 degrees oil temp. So, I suspected a weak spring in the PRV which weakened with oil temperature rise to 185*. (All of my EMS temp and pressure values have been verified with mechanical gauges.) and I tightened it to within 2 or 3 threads of full travel. Flew to my destination still looking at 45psi oil pressure.

But today on my return trip, after takeoff and during climb to altitude, the oil pressure pegged at 99 psi on my Dynon D-100 and oil temperature rose to 210* resulting in a nervous turn back to the airport. Oil pressure came back down to about 80 psi at idle. I have never seen these high values before and that pretty well shoots down my weak spring theory and obviously the PRV kicked in with overkill.

So, I guess I need to bite the bullet and order a new Oil pressure relief valve since mine seems to have gone "nuts". Other ideas? Comments? Thanks

Last edited by Tcheairs : 09-12-2021 at 03:25 PM.
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  #2  
Old 09-12-2021, 04:14 PM
birddog486 birddog486 is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: WI
Posts: 158
Default

still sounds like an indication problem, where did you hook up the mechanical oil pressure gauge?
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  #3  
Old 09-12-2021, 05:26 PM
Tcheairs Tcheairs is offline
 
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Location: Covington
Posts: 85
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Mechanical gauge hooked up directly to oil pressure outlet on top rear of engine just behind # 3 cylinder. This is a continuation of a series of my posts on this problem. I'll send you a link so that we don't have to start at square 1 with the questions. Verified actual mechanical pressure. Also verified accuracy of VOD transducer with air pressure..This problem goes far beyond all of the actual indication questions. The indications on the EMS have been verified as accurate.

https://vansairforce.net/community/s...d.php?t=198929

Last edited by Tcheairs : 09-12-2021 at 05:29 PM.
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  #4  
Old 09-13-2021, 06:36 AM
Rjk921 Rjk921 is offline
 
Join Date: May 2019
Location: Swartz Creek, MI
Posts: 10
Default

Any chance you have a restriction in the breather line? A friend had similar symptoms and didn’t find it until the front seal failed.
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  #5  
Old 09-13-2021, 06:39 AM
Tcheairs Tcheairs is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Covington
Posts: 85
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I haven't checked the breather line. going to pull the sump screen however and see if there is anything in it..
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  #6  
Old 09-13-2021, 07:31 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
Posts: 6,517
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Let me confirm. You were getting 15 at idle and 50 at cruise for a long time. You took apart and reassembled the relief valve and the next flight, you got 75 at idle and 45 in cruise? Followed by a whole bunch of inconsistent OP readings?

If the only change was this, I would have someone with experience look at the relief valve, as this is the likely culprit. I would consider a sticking OP sender, however, it was very consistent UNTIL you took apart the relief valve. That really points to something going on in the valve.

Was the mechanical gauge installed during the above flights or did you put the old sender back for the flights?

Was there a round cage sticking out of the case that holds the ball centered over the hole? Did the inside of the relief assembly have a bore that was just large enough to hold the ball or was it larger, where the ball could move around? Also post a pic of the relief assembly (on the engine is fine). When I had the mismatched relief assembly on my 540, I would get high readings at idle and lower readings at full power and it was somewhat intermittent, with occasionally higher readings at full power.

I am thinking the ball was pushed off the the side and held there, giving low readings across the board. After reassembly, the ball was now on the seat and you got the high idle pressures. As soon as the RPMs come up, the ball goes off to the side and pressures drop. However, this time it is doing what mine did and pop back onto the seat when the RPMs drop. The reason it is doing this NOW, is that you have made the spring tighter, so it can't get permanently pushed off to the side. The tear apart allowed the ball off the edge, where before, tightening the spring just further locked it to the side.

Larry
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Last edited by lr172 : 09-13-2021 at 07:45 AM.
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  #7  
Old 09-13-2021, 07:45 AM
Tcheairs Tcheairs is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Covington
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No cage on PRV...ordered a new one from Superior this am. Also ordered the LL11713 heavy duty spring just in case. Going to pull the oil sump screen just to make sure there's not something else going on. Thanks.
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  #8  
Old 09-13-2021, 07:47 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
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Location: Schaumburg, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tcheairs View Post
No cage on PRV...ordered a new one from Superior this am. Also ordered the LL11713 heavy duty spring just in case. Going to pull the oil sump screen just to make sure there's not something else going on. Thanks.
Re-read post, as i added. Also, if you are getting 75 psi at idle, your problem is NOT a weak spring. The fact that you saw 100 PSI at high RPM would indicate no issues with the sump. Please answer the questions I asked.
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Last edited by lr172 : 09-13-2021 at 07:49 AM.
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  #9  
Old 09-13-2021, 07:51 AM
lr172 lr172 is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Schaumburg, IL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lr172 View Post
Re-read post, as i added. Also, if you are getting 75 psi at idle, your problem is NOT a weak spring. The fact that you saw 100 PSI at high RPM would indicate no issues with the sump. Please answer the questions I asked.
Your relief system MUST have some way of holding the ball centered over the tapered seat, otherwise you get high psi at idle and low psi at high RPM. It is either a cage attached to the crankcase OR a relief assembly with a bore small enough to hold the ball centered. They make two different relief assemblies. One with a small bore to hold the ball and one with a large bore to fit over the cage on the case. I am guessing you have the latter, with no cage on the case. This would explain your most recent OP readings.
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Last edited by lr172 : 09-13-2021 at 07:59 AM.
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  #10  
Old 09-13-2021, 07:58 AM
Tcheairs Tcheairs is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2021
Location: Covington
Posts: 85
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I think your question I missed concerned the mechanical gauge. It was connected while on the ground. The engine was ground run to 2000 rpm and the mechanical gauge agreed exactly with the Dynon D-100 EMS in the cockpit. I also verified the reading of the electrical transducer by applying 60 lb of air pressure and it agreed exactly with the reading on the EMS. My PRV does NOT
have a cage.

I'm unable to send you a photo of it because I don't know how to post photos on this forum. Requires a web address for the photo and my photos don't have a HTTP address. If you want to PM me an email address, I'll send you a photo of the valve.

thanks for your input.
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