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Drills and drill speeds

K

kamikaze

Well Known Member
Looking at air drills to start on my 2 demo projects.

The theory on required RPMs seems to suggest needing up to 8000 RPM when cutting aluminium (As per manual section 5, and other places on the web), depending on bit size (#40 = 7796 RPM).

However the Van's manual on tools says a drill motor in the 2500-4000 RPM range is recommended.

There are 6000 RPM models out there, from Sioux and others, for the same or very similar price as the slower ones.

1) Why this apparent contradiction? you need speed X, but we recommend something much slower?

2) I'm tempted by the faster ones ... seems to make sense all around to me ... am I missing something?

Thanks!
 
The most unused tool I have is my pneumatic drill. I never use it any more. The air drill is noisy as heck and doesn't do any better than the electric.

I got a lithium powered Ryobi set for Fathers Day last year. Drill and driver with a charger and two battery packs. Haven't used the air drill since, and I don't miss it one bit. An air drill might make sense in a factory environment, but I would spend that money elsewhere.
 
drill

There is something wrong with your drill if its noisey. Buy a cheap drill andyou get what you paid for.
A Sioux is a great drill and about 1/3 the weight of any electric.
300 rpm is optimal.
EBay has tons of used ones. A 45 degree will be useful also but takes threaded bits.
 
Drill speeds

There are machining tables that list maximum speeds and feeds of drills in various materials. The key here is "maximum". There's nothing wrong with drilling a hole at less than the maximum speed, in fact in many cases it's easier to control the drill at lower speeds especially as the point breaks through at the end of the hole.

I have five drill motors: a 3/8" pistol grip air drill (3300 rpm), a 3/8" 90 degree air drill (rpm not listed), a 3/8" corded electric drill (2100 rpm), a 3/8" cordless drill (rpm not listed), and a collet chuck 90 degree air drill (rpm not listed).

The one I use the most is the cordless drill, but each have their place. I place more importance on a good variable speed trigger for better control, especially when starting the hole, than maximum speed.

Buy a good quality brand name.
 
drill

True and a quality drill will give you speed control via the trigger.
I rarely go to full speed when drilling.
 
I've got three air drills and one cord electric drill that I use.

The highest-speed Sioux air drill always has a #40 bit in it.

The old yellow Ingersol Rand air drill always has a #30 bit. This one doesn't get used as often as the others. It has a non-feathering trigger.

The reversible Sioux air drill is available for whatever else I want to put in it.

I sometimes use the electric drill because it's lower speed. Good for countersinking.

I think paul mosher may have meant 3,000 rpm in his posting above. 300 would be very slow for the small bits.

My drill press usually gets set to 1,600 rpm or 2,800 rpm for the smaller bits like #40 or #30. Those would cut better at a higher speed but that's all the old drill press has.

Dave
 
I have an air drill purchased when I was installing A/C systems in VW beetles in 1975. It still works great. It's about the same side as the compact Sioux and smaller that any electric drill. The speed is totally controllable, balance is good, light in weight, and fits in tight areas(2500rpm). I have tried the battery powered drills with the big battery butt and they are fine for a second unit, but not as comfortable overall and 90% is done with the air.

If you are concerned about the air line, get the tiny couplers and super flexible hoses from Avery or others. I don't have the small couplers, but the air hose should be quite flexible or get another one.

Get and use what helps you make the job easy.
 
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Drill bits

+1 on the Sioux. +1 on the corded 3/8" VS reversible. +1 on the bench drill press.
What hasn't been mentioned is the importance of quality bits and single flute cutters.
No matter what drill, a bad bit will make a mess.
 
Air drills and battery drills have different missions, in my opinion.

When doing a LOT of holes (meaning skin, anywhere) an air drill is a dream. As was said earlier, get a good one. That generally means a feathering trigger that allows good speed control.

When doing just a couple of holes (or drilling out rivets) I use a battery drill. This meant that once the fuselage skins were done and the tasks moved to the interior, I used the air drill less and less and the battery drill more and more.
 
Air Drill Speeds

Back to the beginning of the post and the original question:

I also noticed the speed discrepancy and had the same questions as the OP. From the little I know, 3600 RPM will be about right for the aluminum on these aircraft. The 6000 RPM is more appropriate for composite materials.?.

I have recently purchased the 3600 RPM Sioux from Brown's (hard to beat that price).

Having used cordless drills since they first came out with the huge batteries to the smaller more compact ones available today, I can assure you that the little Sioux is much more comfortable for extended periods. Seems that even with a small cordless about the time that a battery needs to be replaced my wrist starts getting sore. Of course moving a cordless around a jobsite is easier than carrying around a compressor!

Would the trigger be easier to control on the 3600 RPM vs the 6000 RPM because of less/more speed range? Maybe that's a consideration? Anyone?
 
Based on the advice and comments here, I ordered a Sioux 1412 from Brown Tool. It arrived over the weekend and I took some time to compare the three drills I have now.
  • The Northern Tool drill (2 lb. 1 oz) runs at 1800 RPM, which is really too low to be ideal for building. It?s a little noisier than the Sioux, with a lower pitch ?growling? sound. Trigger control is good, not perfect, but the speed is well controllable. For $50 it?s not a bad tool, though a higher speed version would be better.
  • The Sioux drill (1 lb. 9 oz.) runs at 3600 RPM max, with a higher pitched sound, not quite as loud, less irritating. It?s substantially more comfortable in the hand than either of the other two; the grip angle is better and it's more contoured.
  • The Ryobi Li cordless drill (4 lb.) has by far the best speed control and torque of the three. It?s also very quiet, has the speed needed and has a keyless chuck. It?s simply a joy to use, but it is a little heavier than the other two and will tire out your wrist quicker. You don?t have to manage an air hose, and with two battery packs I?ve never had to stop working because I ran out of juice.
I?d say if you?re on a tight budget, any drill will work. A corded drill would be my last choice for obvious reasons. If you have a good quality battery powered drill, it will work fine. If you decide to go with a less expensive air drill, it will work fine. If you?ve got the tool budget for the nice Sioux palm drill, go for it. It?s marginally nicer than the other two. It does get pretty expensive, though, if you want it with a keyless chuck ? approaching $300 from the least expensive source. I found a very nice keyless chuck on Fleabay for very little money, and it only takes a couple of minutes to swap out the chuck.
 
Buy the Sioux drill. I had a cheaper drill when I started my demo project but I finally got fed up with it. Now that I have the Sioux it works great and is light weight. I have a cordless drill that I sometimes use when I don't feel like turning on the compressor but its way too heavy for this type of work.
 
This is Boeing's recommendations and what we teach if you're interested. We do a little bit of drilling in aluminum (and other materials) :D

 
Well, my Sioux WAS nice...

My Sioux was nice while it lasted. I got to use it for a couple of weeks, but haven't seen it since I dropped it off 10/21 for warranty repair. That's eight weeks now, and the guy just told me it's going to be another week or two. :(

I set it on a saw horse support bar, and it slipped off and fell maybe 12-14" to the floor. After that it ran slowly and had no torque at all. Called Sioux, they said it was a warranty repair. Dropped it off. The guy says he replaced the rotor vanes, but then when he was reassembling it found that the rotor itself was machined wrong and the bearing was tilted. So... it's a great little tool, too bad it's been in the shop most of the time I've owned it. I'm back to the Ryobi now.

[Edit: Not being critical of Sioux, really... but apparently the place I picked to do the warranty repair sucks.]
 
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I ended up going for a Nova drill from Pan American Tools:

http://www.panamericantool.com/novar-compact-pistol-grip-drill.html

First air drill I've ever used so I can't really compare, but sure seems nicely built and solid. I've used it on the toolbox project so far, with Pan American's drill bits, works like a charm, didn't strike me a particularly loud either.

It has good reviews and is half the price, good enough for me to learn with ... Buy it from Cleaveland and you get a lifetime warranty for slight premium in the price. If Mike & Co feel that's OK, I figure it must be a good enough device, so I bought it from Pan Am directly for a few bucks less.

I like to buy from specialized places when I can ... so having a supplier that focuses only on these kinds of tools is nice ...
 
Looks like you have all the answers you are looking for in response to your questions about drill speed.
As to what kind of drill?
I have several air drills and a couple of electric ones.
Built my first RV with the cheapo HF drills.
Bought a Sioux Drill for my RV 10. Can't believe I built an entire airplane with those Fred Flintstone tools.
I only used the Sioux on my 10 and the electric drills on Sundays or evenings
to keep the noise to a minimum.
The Sioux is one of those really fine tools you just don't want to put down,
or drop it, and it uses just a fraction of the air the Flintstone tools use.
 
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