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Feedback GDL 39

FLYIN9A

Well Known Member
Thinking about going to Garmin GDL 39 or 39 3D. ANYONE HAVE EXPERIENCE WITH THIS SETUP ON ANDROID. DOES IT WORK ON ANDROID OR SHOULD I GO AHEAD WITH THE IPAD. Is there any Ipads it works better on than others or are they all about the same. Is there any suggested memory minimums etc i should be aware of. ALSO IS THIS SYSTEM RELIABLE AND AS FLAWLESS AS MY CURRENT 496.
 
Joe, I just bought a GDL 39 myself mainly to work with my 796 but I'll connect to the my iPad mini as well. A few things you should consider....
1. Most folks find the iPad is too big for our cockpits so consider the iPad mini.
2. Buy the most memory your wallet allows... it's always handy.
3. This is a biggy.... The iPad does not due very well in direct sun light and there is plenty of sunlight that comes through the canopy (really most tablets don't do well in direct sunlight).
4. If you decide to go Android route, Garmin Pilot is supported on Android.
6. Regarding GDL39, it only works with Garmin Pilot App and no other apps. According the Garmin website it does provide ADSB traffic to your 496 but it doesn't support FIS weather on the 496.
7. The 1 time that I have used my GDL39 it seemed to work great.
 
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Not flawless

I don't have an android, but an iPad mini. My GDL 39 is blue toothed to both my 796 and iPad (with garmin pilot). It works and connects flawlessly with the Garmin 796.
With Garmin pilot on the iPad, most of the time, I have to go into settings
on the iPad and select the GDL on the bluetooth page. Also, many times
I must shut the iPad down completely and restart in order for it to connect
to the GDL 39. Once it is connected, there are no issues. Ensuring the
connectiion of the iPad to the GDL 39 is part of my runup check list.
 
Joe,

I run the GDL39 connected to a Google Nexus 7 (2013 edition). The combination is fantastic. I have an iPad 2, iPad Mini Retina and the Nexus 7, and the Nexus 7 is the only tablet I have ever used that has excellent sunlight readability in ANY condition the RV can encounter. I have yet to have the Nexus 7 shutdown due to heat, unlike both iPad's which have always seemed to shutdown at the worst possible times.

NewEgg is selling the 32 GB refurbished Nexus 7 for $164.99 after $50 rebate (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...hBargains-_-NA-_-NA-_-NA&Item=N82E16834231507). I purchased my Nexus 7 refurbed and it has performed flawlessly.

From both a price and sunlight readability standpoint, the iPad can't touch the Nexus 7. For even better use, make sure to pick up an anti-glare screen protector. I personally use the Tech Armor brand and it works great.

I have been flying behind this for about 6 months without a single hickup in all weather conditions and temperatures.
 
GDL39

I use the battery operated Gdl 39 blue toothed
to my IPAD mini strapped to my knee. It's a nice setup
to use mobil. I personally like the Garmin Pilot app.
It's nice having weather and ADSB. The system works well.
The App has a split screen function or the option for full screen.
I like splitting the moving map with the ADSB target screen.
 
I use Garmin Pilot with a Garmin Glo GPS bluetooth to an Asus Transformer TF700 Infinity. In Super IPS mode I have no problem seeing great detail on the screen in bright daylight. I just purchased a GDL 39 and have only flown with it once. GPS worked just like the Glo. I'm going to install a Delta Pop ADS-B/UAT antenna and a GPS antenna and get the GDL off the glareshield.

Dave
RV-6
 
Love it

I have been using the GDL 39 for a year now and love it. I initially used an android tablet but a few months back picked up the iPad mini with retina display. Thus beats the two android based tablet by a wide margin.

I love the Garmin pilot app. Weather, traffic, charts, etc are great. The traffic info is very accurate. I have used it to join up in a buddy when he is out flying.

Cheers
 
Thinking about going to Garmin GDL 39 or 39 3D. ANYONE HAVE EXPERIENCE WITH THIS SETUP ON ANDROID. DOES IT WORK ON ANDROID OR SHOULD I GO AHEAD WITH THE IPAD. Is there any Ipads it works better on than others or are they all about the same. Is there any suggested memory minimums etc i should be aware of. ALSO IS THIS SYSTEM RELIABLE AND AS FLAWLESS AS MY CURRENT 496.

I run the GDL-39/Garmin Pilot on both Android and IOS. As far as updates are concerned, the android version of pilot seems to lag behind the IOS version, but Garmin keeps the android version fairly current. I don't think you have any concerns there. Either are fine.

As to hardware, the Nexus 7 is superior in the bright cockpit of my RV-8, and its size is about right. I do carry an old IPAD 1 along in my flight bag as a backup, so either will work. The IPAD mini is probably more useful than the full sized IPAD, but I don't believe the screen is as bright as the Nexus 7.

The main drawback on the Nexus 7 (and this may be true on the IPADS as well) is battery life. Garmin Pilot drains the battery pretty quickly unless you keep it on a charger or allow the screen to go into dark mode often. For instance, last month I flew from Ohio to Tx (5.5 hrs flight time) with one fuel stop. The weather was bad on the second leg, but the Nexus 7 was down to about 20% battery life. I had to turn it off and on to keep it useful, mainly because my cigarette lighter receptacle is inop.

-John
 
I have been running Garmin Pilot on a Nexus 7, bluetoothed to the Garmin GDL-39, since it was introduced.

After some teething problems, it has evolved into a bulletproof, wonderful system. Even though we now have ADS-B in/out on our GRT Horizon Hxr, we have retained the GDL-39 for the backseat set up, using the Nexus 7.

Between that app, and the Grand Rapids Technology's EFIS app (that bluetooths to the Horizon, providing us with a complete back-seat EFIS), we are all set.

Here's a pic of it in use with the GRT app in the landscape mode: (Stupid flash. It's usually much more readable!)

10155169_659959107373320_894472253_n.jpg


And here's one running Garmin Pilot in the portrait mode:

1016555_545041938865038_310331479_n.jpg


You can toggle between them with a button push. It's a great set up!
 
I've been running Garmin Pilot on a 32GB iPad with good success. I don't find the iPad to be too big to work with in my -7A. The built-in iPad gps has been generally trouble-free. A couple of times the gps wouldn't lock on but was easily corrected by re-booting the iPad. The iPad uses the WAAS gps signal from the GDL-39 through its bluetooth connection.

I also feed the GDL-39 info into my G3X system. Even though I have the XM capable G3X screens, I never subscribed to XM weather.

While the ADS-B weather depiction is helpful, the weather images in Garmin Pilot on the iPad will sometimes scare the heck out of you or your significant other. I have extensive experience in using the WSI weather website as well as inflight radar. Oftentimes, when I compare the radar images of Garmin Pilot and WSI side-by-side, Garmin Pilot has the intensity colors so ridiculously over enhanced that it's darn near unusable. It's like it's crying wolf and trying to scare you right out of the sky.

Personally, I'm comfortable flying my -7A into and through light precip areas (depicted in green by WSI) and closely skirt the edges of small moderate echoes (depicted in yellow by WSI). Garmin Pilot takes those some intensities and rapidly moves from green to red with moderate WSI echoes being depicted in red. On the G3X, the intensity depictions are a little more realistic. As a result, I rely less and less on Garmin Pilot iPad weather radar depictions because of their unrealistic presentation.

As far as traffic, I only have the ADS-B in from the GDL-39. It has been more helpful than I expected, especially in the large northeast metro areas like New York. The iPad traffic depiction is more helpful than the G3X because of the larger iPad screen size.

Good luck in your choice,

Mike
 
H-m-m-m, I did not know that about Garmin Pilot weather from the GDL 39 and ADS B. Good to know---thanks
 
While the ADS-B weather depiction is helpful, the weather images in Garmin Pilot on the iPad will sometimes scare the heck out of you or your significant other. I have extensive experience in using the WSI weather website as well as inflight radar. Oftentimes, when I compare the radar images of Garmin Pilot and WSI side-by-side, Garmin Pilot has the intensity colors so ridiculously over enhanced that it's darn near unusable. It's like it's crying wolf and trying to scare you right out of the sky.

Personally, I'm comfortable flying my -7A into and through light precip areas (depicted in green by WSI) and closely skirt the edges of small moderate echoes (depicted in yellow by WSI). Garmin Pilot takes those some intensities and rapidly moves from green to red with moderate WSI echoes being depicted in red. On the G3X, the intensity depictions are a little more realistic. As a result, I rely less and less on Garmin Pilot iPad weather radar depictions because of their unrealistic presentation.
Mike

This happened to me today. I bought a GDL 39 and used it for the 1st time this morning to depict weather. I was in the air and noticed a huge cell coming in but when I look out the window it didn't look that bad. I didn't question it and thought it would be best if I head back to the airport. When I got back I looked at weather briefing in the Pilot lounge and it was green with a small amount of mist. The representation of weather on the Garmin Pilot App is certainly something that I have to get used to . Maybe one of the Garmin Pros here on the forums could provide feedback to tone down the imaging to be more realistic. My 796 is at Garmin getting worked on so I didn't get to test that.... does anyone know if the weather imaging on the 796 is the same as the Pilot App? I'm just wondering if the GDL 39 or the APP?
 
Tried the Google Nexus 7 on two different occasions. The bluetooth pairing would work, but the Garmin applications wouldn't. Got an iPad Mini and it worked (and continues to work) without a hitch.
 
Saved your life!

And ........ ??? How?

I'm leaning towards the Nexus/Garmin Pilot app with the GDL-39 so really enjoying the information posted here.
 
I for one, am going to call Garmin Pilot, tomorrow, Monday, and cite this info ( about the weather showing more intense than it actually is) here on VAF and see what they have to say. If it "is" so cranked up, maybe I can get them to tone it down. Will post whatever they tell me tomorrow. Stay tuned
 
Here are some samples

Below are 4 sample of weather tonight over Little Rock, AR. You can clearly see that the Garmin Pilot App significantly enhances the colors. I don't have have XM Weather but I wish I did so I could compare that as well. These are screen shots over a 2 minute time span so not much change (maybe a little)

Garmin Pilot


ForeFlight


Aviation WX App


Weather Channel App
 
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Interesting comparison! I have noticed that Garmin Pilot/GDL-39 weather tends to show false radar returns much more frequently than XM. In other words, it will show rain where there is none at all.

I suppose this is all part of the same problem. It would seem that they just need to dial back the sensitivity a smidge.
 
I see this is AR, but do you know which service best represented the true weather at the time?

To honestly answer your question I would have to say no because I live in Atlanta. I was looking for weather somewhere in the states to do some comparison and that was the nearest weather I found. I have been using ForeFlight since they introduced it and they have a very accurate depiction of what's really out there (this is only my opinion). I would say based on my experience the ForeFlight would be closest to the actual weather since the zoom capability on the Aviation WX is not great. I downloaded the Garmin Pilot as a trial with the GDL39 so I had both on my iPad. I bought the GDL39 to pair up with my 796 but thought I would try the APP to compare it to Foreflight. Overall the App is pretty good and in some features better than ForeFlight (IMHO) but the weather depiction on the Garmin Pilot App is a deal breaker... unless they fix it.
 
Thanks for the response and good to know. I'm also looking at the 796 GDL-39 3D combo to use in the C172 until I finish the 7. My laptop is starting to act up and so was considering a tablet for replacement and in the interim try the Pilot app with a GDL-39 on the tablet. I down loaded the 30 day free trial for my android phone and so far it has worked pretty well (not really good for flying as the screen size is small, but gives a good overview/demonstration of the capabilities).
 
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I'll second the comments on Pilot's "amplification" of weather returns. I was using it to track weather as I was flying commercial back to Boston from Charleston, SC last week. The intensity of returns didn't seem to match what I was seeing out the window, so I went back to using another iPad radar app that uses what seems to be normal NWS reflectivity scaling. I've been using Pilot quite a bit and am on the verge of buying a GDL-39, but I'd like to see a more accurate depiction of weather.

Perhaps the Garmin folks can explain why their weather rendering is different?

Dave
 
I for one, am going to call Garmin Pilot, tomorrow, Monday, and cite this info ( about the weather showing more intense than it actually is) here on VAF and see what they have to say. If it "is" so cranked up, maybe I can get them to tone it down. Will post whatever they tell me tomorrow. Stay tuned

I called Garmin about this Monday morning. Am waiting to hear back from them to see what they say as I also use Garmin Pilot ADS B weather. Will post here whatever they tell me. Might be a couple of days. (Hope this thread doesn't disappear)
 
NEXRAD Data Color Mapping

First we want to say that these are all very good questions. There was certainly no decision to alter the weather depiction to look scarier than it is.

We reviewed all available guidance before deciding on how to map NEXRAD radar reflectivity to the colors shown by Garmin Pilot and our other products which display weather.

Some of the best guidance is provided in DO-267A, Minimum Aviation System Performance Standards for FIS-B Data Link and the Aeronautical Information Manual (AIM).

The radar color table used in Garmin Pilot is based on two factors:
  1. DO-267A Appendix H provides guidance for color tables to be applied to weather radar return energy (dBZ) for FIS-B data. Garmin Pilot follows this guidance and consistently applies the color specification to all radar data displayed regardless of source. This is done so that the user can assume the same absolute intensity values based on the color being displayed for all ground based weather products displayed in Garmin Pilot. Note that these colors are the same colors used when displaying airborne radar.

  2. There is a direct correlation between ATC terminology and the base color palette used in Garmin Pilot. Green shades correspond to ?Light"; Yellow shades correspond to ?Moderate?; Red shades correspond to ?Heavy?; Magenta shades correspond to ?Extreme?.
Section 7 of the AIM identifies ?MODERATE? precipitation (as communicated by ATC) as precipitation which results in a reflectivity of 30 to 40 dBZ. 30 to 40 dBZ maps to the color yellow in DO-267A, so we felt it important to show precipitation in the ?MODERATE? range as yellow. Some internet sources of weather will map precipitation at the low end of this range to dark green.

We also notice that it is not uncommon for FIS-B NEXRAD data to show more red (heavy precipitation) data than shown in SXM weather data, but again we use the same color mapping regardless of data source and will show red when the data indicates it should be represented in this manner.

Thanks,
Steve
 
Thanks for the update

Steve,
Thanks for the update on this. It sounds like this was done based on a lot of research and was intentionally done this way. Personally, as long as I know what to expect and what the colors mean I think it will work out fine. The issue was that the "normal" colors that I'm used to seeing from XM or FIS-B on other Apps didn't match. My assumption and expectation was that these colors were some what universal. Similar to watching the news and seeing Radar images on one channel then flipping the channel to another news cast and seeing the same images (or colors) on another channel. But like I said as long as I know what the color representation stands for it should be fine . . . it's the data that it represents that matters not the pretty colors :D.

Just one more question/clarification Steve: Are these colors only used on the App? So on other Garmin products like the 796 or even the G3X system should we expect these same colors or is this just for the Pilot App?
 
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Just one more question/clarification Steve: Are these colors only used on the App? So on other Garmin products like the 796 or even the G3X system should we expect these same colors or is this just for the Pilot App?

Hello AB,

Yes, this method of assigning colors to NEXRAD data is consistently applied across Garmin products including the Aera 796 and G3X.

Our certified products are actually required to follow DO-267A guidance as part of receiving one or more related TSOs.

Thanks,
Steve
 
Well---Y'all heard the man. Next thing to do, instead of just a few RV er's with Garmin Pilot installed, is have an army of RV er's with Garmin Pilot (installed) go out in real world conditions and report back here. That's what I'm going to do (as soon as I heal up and can fly again)
 
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I can hear it now.

Center, this is RV12WX. How would you characterize that precip at my 12 o'clock. Light, Moderate, or Heavy? :)

Steve
 
I can hear it now.

Center, this is RV12WX. How would you characterize that precip at my 12 o'clock. Light, Moderate, or Heavy? :)

Steve

Interesting that you should mention this. It is actually the opposite, at least in my area. I attended last night a 2 hour Q & A session with controllers from DEN, APA, COS, Ctr and tracon. The DEN controller commented that any GA aircraft with on board weather, including portables, had a better wx. display then they did in the tower. They commonly call aircraft in the air and on the ground to see what they are reporting. DEN is the 3rd or 4th busiest airport in the country and relatively new, so I assume( I know, I know) that the equipment isn't any better elsewhere.

I may have heard this incorrectly, but I believe they also said that their ability to see light precip is so poor that they don't even report it anymore.

It was a very helpful meeting.

Jim Berry
RV-10
 
On my last visit to the local tower they had a PC running off to the side. They apparently use it for a few things but IIRC they mentioned that they often check weather on the PC because it was better than what they have.
 
How does Garmin explain the differences in rendering the weather on the iPad versus the G3X? To my mind , the G3X is more realistic. Is it related to screen resolution?
 
Resurrected ( Dougie, is this OK, resurrecting this? I wanted to keep it in the forefront, because I'm hoping guys with Garmin Pilot ADS B weather will go out and give this a real world checkout. I would already be doing it myself, but I'm recovering from a broken hip and thus can't fly right now)
 
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How does Garmin explain the differences in rendering the weather on the iPad versus the G3X? To my mind , the G3X is more realistic. Is it related to screen resolution?

Hello alcladrv,

Are you comparing the iPad weather to the G3X weather when both are displaying FIS-B weather from the GDL39/39R? They should be roughly the same when doing this.

There is some weather moving through Kansas City this morning, and I am watching it on a 696 with XM weather (GXM40), a 796 with SXM weather (GXM42), a 796 with FIS-B weather (GDL39), and a G3X with a GDU 460 using FIS-B weather (GDL39R). Sorry, I have a bench full of good avionics, but no devices with fruit on the back this morning.

I am seeing good correlation between these weather maps, but as mentioned previously, the composite FIS-B NEXRAD data does seem to generally report higher reflectivity than the satellite weather sources. This can be seen in these two images from the 796. Again, we map colors to reflectivity values the same for all weather data sources, so we just render what the received data tells us to render.

SXM (GXM42) Weather
3015.jpg


FIS-B (GDL39) Weather
2873.jpg


Thanks,
Steve
 
That's one comparison. But, mainly it's the Garmin Pilot iPad weather rendering sourced from both the both FIS-B radar and the radar you get with your iPad connected to the Internet on the ground.

We had some thunderstorms go through our area within the past hour and I again saw the relative over enhancement of the Garmin Pilot radar versus the WSI Pilotbrief app while seated in my living room.

To my eye, the Garmin Pilot app on the iPad shows an over enhanced image regardless of the source relative to other commonly available weather radar services at FBOs, e.g. Accuweather, WSI, Intellicast, etc. Perhaps a comparison at the local airport with iPad in hand would be better than 1000 words from me trying to explain it.

Thanks for your efforts. I'm just to give some honest feedback.

Mike
 
Tablet Question

I took an 800nm trip over Memorial Day weekend, the first since installing a GDL39. Hooked up directly to an AERA 510 and bluetoothed (is that a word) to a Samsung Galaxy running Garmin Pilot. All the weather worked as advertised on the AERA 510 but the Galaxy never did show the radar. I went to the "overlays" and selected "radar ads-b" but it never did show up. Every thing else, metars, winds aloft, sigmets all worked. It always showed several ground stations and the signal strength was good.

I have to assume that I've got something set up incorrectly on the tablet but for the life of me I can't figure it out.

Also, for what its worth from a VFR pilot, I like the depiction of the weather on the AERA. I think maybe I err on the side of caution anyway, but most of the light green that showed contained a little rain where I was.
 
While we are having this discussion there a couple of things to remember. Having the radar view in the cockpit is only one slice of the pie. Metars, TAF, winds aloft, etc give you a more complete picture. You would never want to be completely IFR or at night and try to penetrate depicted weather you guys are talking about in this thread.;) It is not actuate enough for that purpose. That being said having the capability of checking the weather at your destination while sitting at the end of the runway at your home base is really state of the art stuff and super cool!:cool: Knowing the weather is there per your GDL39 and being able to see it visually and running along side of it as well as altering your route 100 mile out to go around it is a great advantage.:D
 
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