Cies Fuel Sender System

[Selmax]

CIES Inc., Oregon, has a patented technology (Patent 6,508,119) for providing fuel level indication in analog and digital applications using a unique sensor system. As built in Cirrus Perspective since years they might have an excellent reputation concerning accuracy of fuel level indication.

http://ciescorp.com/CIES_In_1./Fuel_Sender.html

Any experience with CIES fuel senders in a Vans already?

Pit

[649PF]

I spoke with Cies today. They said that that press release was premature and that they do not have a product for any RV.

However, he asked me to send him photos and drawings of the tanks and that he would look into the possibility of using/modifying one of thier existing senders for me.

This issue has been a concern to me. Vans is adamantly against CapSends in my 10 and builders are strongly against vans floats. I wish/hope for a better option...SOON!

[ppilotmike]

Originally Posted by 649PF

Vans is adamantly against CapSends in my 10

I'm building my 10 with cap sends, as have/are several others. Why would Vans be "against?" Please expound.

[649PF]

The arguments against were...

1) More expensive
2) Much more difficult to repair
3) Impossible to clean/maintain

I was planning on using CapSends as it seems most builders have made that choice. I was advised by Van's to check into how many of these systems are actually flying as opposed to being built. The Cies system seems to cure 2 or 3 of those problems while providing MORE accuracy. There are woefully few options for the RV when it comes to fuel senders. I'm hoping this changes.

[fuellevel]

Sorry to have been silent - We are working the RV project semi-actively. We carefully did the mechanical design as seen on the blogpost we did www.fuellevel.blogspot.com. Our first thought was to use the circuit card from the TSO sender with the digital frequency for the Garmin G1000/G2000 system. - First no other MFD accepts that signal except Garmin and JPI on the 930, Second - it was going to be priced as much as a certified unit

So we are finalizing a sender circuit card for a much larger market - this circuit card uses all the technology we developed for the Cirrus Aircraft but multiple outputs are supported and it is not FAA approved.

Resistance, Voltage, Frequency and RS-486 are supported - so no compatibility issues with any gauge

We need to test fit an aircraft and establish a pricing structure for the RV market -

You can help

[Bubblehead]

I'm not sure this solves the main issue with fuel senders. On my RV-8 with normal float type senders

1) anything above 15 gallons is something between 16 and 20 gallons
2) anything below 4 or 5 gallons is something between 0 and 5 gallons
3) with the Vans gauges anything between 5 and 15 is, well, something between 5 and 15 gallons but I could never be really sure.

SkyView gives pretty accurate readings between 5 and 15 but the limitations of the senders make 0-5 and 15-20 dead zones. The Cies sender may make things less sensitive to ripples, waves, accelerations, banks and pitch but most of that is damped out in SkyView and other modern systems anyway.

Am I missing something or is this a solution in search of a problem?

[fuellevel]

The only analogy to draw here, as there are no RV Pireps, is that current production or retrofitted Cirrus SR20 or SR22 have these installed -

In these aircraft - fuel level became newsworthy .

Flying
Plane and Pilot
Aviation Consumer

The solution did find a problem with Cirrus and other OEM's and an appreciating audience.

By any and all standards we don't have issues like 1,2 or 3 -

What we report is an accurate fuel level remaining and it matches a computed fuel level remaining from an accurate fuel flow transducer and instrument. If there is a discrepancy fuel level to fuel remaining - you are losing fuel (Vented, Bad Cap, Fuel pump leak)

I am running a performance tests to solve an interesting multi tank fuel level issue - My stick gauge is repeatedly measuring the same displayed fuel value - during vibration I get a peak to peak average -

If the senders in your aircraft have a dead zone that is not a characteristic of all senders nor is it a universal to all senders regardless of how they derive the fluid level.

Our senders have floats but our measurement method is entirely different to any float sender you have held - This is not your average float sender. Watch the attached video and you will see what we are talking about. Using this technology is a CiES patent for fluid measurement

http://youtu.be/ww3IsROsbwc?t=1m20s

Send a Van's member by - we'd love to show what we can do

[fuellevel]

As we have made quite a bit of progress on other fuel level sending markets, that now allows us to offer a non-FAA certified circuitry for the RV fuel sender. The circuitry component is designed for harsh automotive / truck / heavy equipment environment and will be fine for aviation. The remainder of the sender, the physical portion, maintains our aviation component standard.

http://http://www.ciescorp.net/vans-rv-fuel-level.html

Let us know and we will kick the program into gear

[Dean Pichon]

You had me at "hello". I've been flying my -4 with the senders supplied by Van's for 13 years. As far as I am concerned, they serve only to keep the fuel from draining out the holes I cut in the tank to mount them. Some years ago, I mated them with an EI gauge that allowed me to program out the non-linear nature of the floats, but the results were still not satisfying. For years, I have been relying on my EI fuel totalizer to manage my fuel status. A couple of questions:

Is the interface (bolt pattern) the same as the SW senders that came with my kit?
Can I use my existing EI gauge, or will I need a new one?
When will the system be available?
How much will it cost?

Regards,

[Evolution10]

I am interested as well. I could not open your link? Are you now in Bend (thought you where near the Redmond airport)?