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Two Super -6's together!!!

pierre smith

Well Known Member
Wow,
I can't remember ever seeing two Super -6's side-by-side on the ramp together, ever.

Yesterday, Bob Mills showed up at Chico with Mike Starkey and parked next to Steve Barnes and his wife, in "The Barnes Stormer" as I watched in amazement.

Flying north side by side with Mount Shasta in the background, we took some neat pics of Steve, which I'll post later, then the race was on......WOT soon saw us push the long-nose -6's past 200K and eventually showing 208-209 TAS knots at only 3500'....that's over 240 MPH!! Needless to say, I could almost see the left fuel guage move:D and pointed it out to Bob, who just grinned. The two planes stayed remarkably close together at speed as well.

I'm at the lobby of the Best Western, Fremont, Ca. on this slow-as-molasses 'puter and will be back 'home' this weekend.....pics later...promise.

Regards,
 
Pierre, was great to meet you, your son and his family, Bob, and Steve and Margy.

I am going to put up a couple of shots -------- hopefully I can remember/relearn how to post photos:mad::mad::mad:
 
Photos, hopefully

Well, Picassa made another change to their program------"update" they call it.

Anyway, I need to study things more to direct post photos here.

In the meantime, this should get to the shots.
 
Super Sixes

Pierre, I had a great time, your visit was the catalyst that brought the sister ships together. We got some great shots of Bob's Super Six as well. The best part was getting to make three new VAF friends. Thanks Pierre, Bob, and Mike.
 
Not trying to start anything, I promise! But the RV-7 VNE is 230mph. The -6 is even less. Any negative characteristics at 240? I have to say that is amazing. My -7 wide open will only indicate 180kts (207mph)
 
Not trying to start anything, I promise! But the RV-7 VNE is 230mph. The -6 is even less. Any negative characteristics at 240? I have to say that is amazing. My -7 wide open will only indicate 180kts (207mph)

"negative characteristics" - don't know about this part, but I believe these Super 6's have 540's not 360's which give them the power to do 240.
 
Mike are these the only flying super 6's?
I only knew of 1, now I know 2.
Too bad they are on the other side of the country.
I would have love to have chased my big brothers around the sky for a few minutes.
Thanks
 
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Super Sixes

There are 4 of these magnificent birds flying. mine The Barnes' Stormer, Bobs the Super Six, the original 4seat one in Las Vegas and a 3 seat one in Calgary. There is rumored to be a 5th one with TIO470 (I'm not familiar with that engine) somewhere in the South East, soon to fly.
 
Mike are these the only flying super 6's?
I only knew of 1, now I know 2.
Too bad they are on the other side of the country.
I would have love to have chased my big brothers around the sky for a few minutes.
Thanks

Mike, I dont know a lot about that, but in conversation yesterday, it was mentioned that there is another in Las Vegas, and one in Canada that has a couple of jump seats in the baggage comp----although I dont know if the Canadian one is from the same design, or a parallel creation-----ALA Dragonfly and Q2

The plane was designed and built by a guy named Tom Hallendorf, who just happens to be a member of our local EAA.

Hopefully Bob will jump in here, he knows a lot more about the history of these things than I do. IIRC, he has a bit of info in a prior thread.

By the way, if you ever find yourself in the Sacramento area, I would love to see your super 8;);)
 
Beautiful....

There are 4 of these magnificent birds flying. mine The Barnes' Stormer, Bobs the Super Six, the original 4seat one in Las Vegas and a 3 seat one in Calgary. There is rumored to be a 5th one with TIO470 (I'm not familiar with that engine) somewhere in the South East, soon to fly.

I would be curious what airframe or flight control mods you made if any. Nice...
 
texas

I believe there is one super 6 in Texas, the gentleman was finishing it up at KLZU here in GA and he moved to Texas to keep his job at the airline. Not sure what airline...
Best
Brian
 
I believe there is one super 6 in Texas, the gentleman was finishing it up at KLZU here in GA and he moved to Texas to keep his job at the airline. Not sure what airline...
Best
Brian

That was a Super 7, Scott Solberg's. Im intimately familiar with that one. Some of my blood is in it.:eek: Its at 5C1 near San Antonio now.

As for the Super 6's, great to hear that 4 are flying. I had no idea. Thanks for posting that. That makes them VERY unique RV's and worthy of attention.
Cool.
THanks
Mike
 
Just back....

.....from two weeks at Las Vegas/Northern California......yawwwwn!! jet lag 'n such.

Had a great time meeting Bob Mills, Steve Barnes and Mike Starkey at Chico.
Here are some pics of the ragtag bunch at Chico.

Left to right....Steve, Pierre, Bob and Mike
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Both airplanes side by side..

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Steve with Mt. Shasta in the background..

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Regards,
 
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I would be curious what airframe or flight control mods you made if any. Nice...

Getting to this thread a little late in the game, as I was traveling to Norfolk for an AOCS (Navy) classmate's 28 year retirement, and then straight out to an airline trip (cold and windy here in Dulles!).

It was really great to meet Pierre, Mike, and Steve, and do some fun flying!

It was also interesting to talk Super Six stuff with the gang. From the discussion, it appears that, as has been mentioned, the 4 Super Sixes we know of (in apparent order of build) are:

The Rocky Mountain Rocket, built and owned by Carl Brownd, now residing in Las Vegas.

The Hallendorf Super Six (Rocket Six), built by Tom Hallendorf, now owned by me (4th owner), now home plated at Reno-Stead.

The Barnes Stormer, built and owned by Steve Barnes, of Santa Rosa, CA.

The Canadian Super Six (don't know the builder's name or location). Steve just sent me a couple pix of it, and here they are:

First one is airborne, second is looking over the front seats to the baggage area, which has two rear-facing seats, and appears to have a mod that opens a little leg room for the back-seaters to stretch their legs out...interesting!

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Steve may have more info on that airplane.


As for mods, the Barnes Stormer and Rocket Six have many similar mods, and some slight differences.

Steve's is a tip-up, and mine is a slider. Both have been lengthened in the baggage area...Steve's by 10", mine by 8". Steve added a baggage door in the side of the fuselage as well. Batteries are in the rear of the fuse, for W&B. The wings on both were clipped 3.5" on each side, much like the Rockets, which reduces the bending moment at the wing, and allows similar g-loading limits to other RV's at the higher GW, or so I have been briefed (my limits are 1900# max GW, 1550# aerobatic GW...it has a 1230# EW). The struts are HR titanium struts, which make them stand a little taller, providing clearance for the Hartzell 80" props. Thicker skin was used on the fuse, wing and ailerons (.032), and the second owner of my airplane re-skinned the tail at some point, also with .032, after seeing some cracks on the empennage. During my first condition inspection and during my panel upgrade (which had me upside down in almost every nook and cranny of the airplane), my A&P (who's helped build and re-build a couple RVs) noted some extra corner doublers on some of the underlying structure, and it appears that some beefed up members were also used (longerons and stringers, though I don't have good detail or confirmation on that). Vne discussions got my attention as I was buying the airplane, and the original steam airpeed installed in my airplane had a red-line of 260 mph. Of course, Vne is TAS, and the fastest I've seen level is 215 KIAS, 225ish KTAS at 8500 MSL (about 260 MPH). That was on the Dynon, but I was still calibrating it, so I'm a little suspiscious that it was reading fast back then). The day we flew with Pierre, we saw 209 KIAS/218KTAS at about 3500 MSL, which penciled out to 251 MPH TAS. The GPS showed 218 kts GS as well, with a direct X-wind, so it seemed like a pretty good airspeed. There were no "ill-effects" noted at all...smooth throughout. And that's plenty fast for me...no need to be a test pilot or push the flutter regime tests on my part! I normally fly at 55% (185 KTAS) to 65% (195 KTAS) power settings...sometimes just a bit higher to get 200 KTAS. Fuel flows at 9500 MSL are in the neighborhood of 10.5 gph at 55%, 12.5 gph at 65%, leaned 50 ROP at those lower power settings (I don't have GAMIs, so I've not gone to LOP ops on the ol' VM1000...want to baby the engine a bit!)

Hope that's not too verbose of a discussion! The airplane is really sweet to fly, and that day with the boyz was a real joy!

Kahuna, wish you could have been there, as I've looked at your site many times, and your airplane looks as good as they get! A future project of mine is prop-clocking, as discussed on your site, and I'd love to talk that over with you! Steve and I discussed this, and both of us feel we experience the same vibration issue you discuss so well and were able to alleviate with your hard work on your Hartzell set up on the IO-540. Maybe we can plan a meeting of all the "Supers" someday down the road!!

Thanks for the interest guys, and Pierre, Mike and Steve, it was truly a pleasure!! And thanks for posting and e-mailing the pix Pierre!

Cheers,
Bob
 
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Interesting slider mod too....

....since it appears to go at least a foot further back than mine.....I just looked. ....to make it easier to get in the back. Nice. I wonder if we can find him and get him to post, Bob.

Regards,
 
No negative characteristics

Not trying to start anything, I promise! But the RV-7 VNE is 230mph. The -6 is even less. Any negative characteristics at 240? I have to say that is amazing. My -7 wide open will only indicate 180kts (207mph)

I know a guy with a RV-6A what recently flew his short tail plane at 210 KIAS at low altitude but in smooth air and it was smooth as glass - careful to make a slow pull-up.

Bob Axsom
 
....since it appears to go at least a foot further back than mine.....I just looked. ....to make it easier to get in the back. Nice. I wonder if we can find him and get him to post, Bob.

Regards,

Pierre,

Good eyes and good catch on that. I looked at some pix of mine (I'm still on the road) and it goes back quite a bit farther than mine as well. In looking at the pix above, it looks like the canopy rails are mounted further inboard on the cockpit rails, and the phenolic blocks are mounted outside of the canopy rails and further aft. I wonder if he had to use a longer center rail down the back of the fuse as well. This set up would also make it really easy to load bags, like the slider/tip-up mod we talked about in Chico. I also wonder if he has noted any strength or movement issues with that set up. Pretty neat though!

Steve just sent me his name and he is in the VAF white pages. I'll give him a holler and see if he'll chime in.

Cheers,
Bob
 
Another Super Six

Working on a Super 6 I bought this summer. Airframe and engine mostly done.
Up to my neck in avionics, wires and panel parts. Hope to be flying in spring.
I've got a 2400' grass strip 7 miles south of DCY in south Indiana if you want to drop in. Glad to see some other Super 6 guys out there. I'll post some pics
when I can figure out how.

Bill
 
That aircraft was built by Bengt Follinger. He built it in Thunder Bay, ON, as I recall, and he now lives in Calgary, AB.

Thanks Kevin, you're spot on, and Bengt is in Calgary now. He just called the other night to say hi, and I've been meaning to add a few notes from our conversation. Very nice guy, and a really creative and innovative builder.

Pierre, we talked about his canopy and a few other things. Here's pix for ref:

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For the canopy to move all the way aft, Bengt flip-flopped the canopy rails, so he could have the rollers on the outside. At the front of the cockpit the rails hang over the edge of the fuselage rails and into the cockpit about 1/2" or so. He said that might make it tight for two wide-shouldered guys, but it has not been a factor for him. On the lower pic, you can see that there is just enough space between the phenolic blocks and the rail to allow the canopy roller brackets to slide between the blocks and the rail. He did use an extension on the aft center rail to allow the canopy to slide further aft.

He has a pretty neat center console, with nice handles for the throttle and mixture. He originally had the Catto 3-bladed FP prop shown in the top pic, but now has a two-bladed FP prop (can't recall which), as you can tell from the airborne pic from my earlier post. His wings are not clipped at all...standard length, and he carries 52 gals of gas (Steve's BarnesStormer does as well)...I'm jealous of that! :)

In the bottom pic, the knob on the aft pax compartment wall is a vent knob, which controls a NACA vent for the back seats. The round vent in the footwell on the right (of the pic) is an air vent to the aft fuselage, to allow better flow-through ventilation for the back pax. After air exits out to the tail section, I believe it vents overboard through another vent in the side of the fuselage (and he's getting ready to change that to a vent in the bottom of the fuselage). The access panel you can see a reflection of in the other footwell allows access to the ELT.

Some pretty creative stuff, and it was fun talking with Bengt. We discussed the possibility of getting the Super 6s, 7 and 8 together sometime, so who knows, maybe we can have an "International" meeting of the "Supers" (and anyone else that wants to join!)

Hmmm, after plotting the location of the 7 known Supers on a geo midpoint calculator (found at: http://www.geomidpoint.com/), the geo midpoint falls about 35 miles east of Leadville, CO. We could gather the boys and get the "Leadville, Highest Airport in North America" certificate too!

Sooooo...what say you all to a git together in Leadville this spring, after the thaw, and before the boomers are up! Carl (S6), Steve (S6), Bengt (S6), Bill (S6), Scott (S7), Kahuna (S8), let me know if you're game, and what time-frame might work for you. I'll kick it off by saying the first or last week of April would be good for me, but I'll flex to any month/days that might work for all...if we can pull this off!

Of course, anyone and everyone would be invited, and Pierre and Mike, you'd have to be there!

Cheers,
Bob
 
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Super 6 Jamboree

VERY nice looking plane and panel Bill! When do you anticipate flying the newest beast?


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Cheers,
Bob

Id like to think 1st part of April then paint mid summer. Just have to see how
my schedule for working on it goes. Sounds like a great get together. Had
a friend fly from Indiana to Leadville in a Tripacer. Hope I can do it a little faster. :D
Thanks for the pic posts.

Bill
 
Id like to think 1st part of April then paint mid summer. Just have to see how
my schedule for working on it goes. Sounds like a great get together. Had
a friend fly from Indiana to Leadville in a Tripacer. Hope I can do it a little faster. :D
Thanks for the pic posts.

Bill

Keep us up on the progress...we should do the git together when you're out of Phase 1, so we get the whole Super family there!

Cheers,
Bob
 
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Hi Bill......

....I noticed the floor mounted rudder pedals, so is this airplane '90's vintage?

Another question.....is the motor mount basically the same as for a 360? Seems that the accessory section would be close since in reality, only two cylinders were added and a longer crank and cam, to add up to 540 cubes.

Regards,
 
....I noticed the floor mounted rudder pedals, so is this airplane '90's vintage?

Another question.....is the motor mount basically the same as for a 360? Seems that the accessory section would be close since in reality, only two cylinders were added and a longer crank and cam, to add up to 540 cubes.

Regards,

I'm the 3rd owner. The records I've found shows the second owner bought the kit from the original owner in 2003 and built the whole plane. So parts of it is probably a 90's kit. Mike Wonder, an A&P in Bloomfield, IN built the plane and hung the engine so I cant answer your question on the engine mount. Mike has built a number of RVs, restored some others and works on commercial airliners sheet metal. This was to be his last RV so he wanted the works. I think he succeded. Unfortunatly he lost his medical and then the plane went under water in a flash flood. We bought it this summer and have been working on wiring, avionics, servos, etc since then. Having a great time with it so far. Cant wait to get it in the air.

Regards, Bill
 
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