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  #1  
Old 12-06-2016, 04:53 PM
nvscott777 nvscott777 is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 3
Default Inflight Dual Dynon Skyview Screen Failure

Has anyone had their Dynon Skyview Screens Crash and go black while in flight?

Military GPS outage at exact time of Duel Dynon Skyview screen failure.

Complete Inflight Dual failure/crash of Dynon 10? Skyview Touch Screen SV-D1000T and 7? SV-D700 Screen.

Garmin 430W continued to operate in dead reckoning mode at time of military GPS signal jamming/failure.

Separate ADHRS for each Dynon Screen.
Separate back up batteries for each Dynon Screen.

Sent this to Dynon along with the data I downloaded from the Dynon Skyview system.


November 3, 2016
KJER Jerome, Idaho VFR direct to KRTS Reno, Stead

Departed KJER in the afternoon of November 3. Clear/VMC conditions.
Approximately 8 to 10 minutes into flight
Flying through Jarbridge MOA
Just south and abeam Restricted 3202
In communication with military Cowboy Control.
GPS was NOTAMed to be shut down by military activity in the Jarbridge MOA.

Dynon Skyview and Garmin 430W operating normally with Dynon autopilot engaged.

Upon loss of GPS signal.
Complete Dual failure of Dynon 10? Skyview Touch Screen SV-D1000T and 7? SV-D700 Screen.
Both screens went blank with a momentary small color band line at the top of the screens.
Dynon autopilot was engaged at time of system crash and went hard left and nose down and autopilot servos were erratically pulsing.
I disconnected autopilot that had initiated a left bank and nose down at time of failure.
Both Dynon screens crashed and went completely blank.
Within 20 seconds both Dynon screens started to re-boot in the same manner and sequence as when power is initially turned on.
Both Dynon screens came back up with ?unknown position? and gave a message:
SYS EVENT 3: SEE SETUP
SYS EVENT 5: SEE SET UP
NO ADS-B OUT: GPS LOST

SV-D700
POSITION SOURCE 2 FAIL
GPS 1 FAIL
NO ADS-B OUT: GPS LOST

Both Dynon screens re-booted and once they recovered from the crash they operated normally without a known GPS position until clearing the Jarbridge MOA wherein they regained GPS signal and operated normally with all GPS functions.

At time of GPS signal loss and Dynon Skyview system Crash:
Garmin 430W continued to operate in Dead Reckoning mode.
Garmin 430W did not crash and did not go blank.
Garmin 430W does not have a backup battery power source.

Other general aviation aircraft and commercial airliner aircraft all advised loss of GPS signal in the area.

Aircraft ship?s power was normal throughout the event with no loss of any other system.

Data file uploaded at completion of remaining flight of 1:14, and sent to dynonavionics.com/docs/upload.html

I had previously seen a SYSTEM EVENT 5 Message on the 7? SV-D700 Screen prior to this total system crash event.
This System event 5 message corresponded with the upload of a Dynon update.

Each of my Dynon Screens have separate ADHRS and separate battery back ups.

Both Dynon Screens sent back to Dynon for replacement of internal Hard Drives.
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  #2  
Old 12-06-2016, 05:03 PM
Mike S's Avatar
Mike S Mike S is offline
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Location: Dayton Airpark, NV A34
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Scott---well, first off glad you got the plane down safely.

I cant address the inflight failure you had, but as this is being brought up as a safety issue, let me drift the thread just a smidge.

I have had one EFIS screen go black in flight-------not fun.

This is exactly why I installed the funny round things in my panel when I was building the plane, and even after updating to newer, faster, larger and more capable glass-------the funny round things still live in the same place.

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Last edited by Mike S : 12-06-2016 at 05:36 PM.
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  #3  
Old 12-06-2016, 05:05 PM
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CubedRoot CubedRoot is offline
 
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Wow, this is a bit alarming, and surprising that they both failed at the same time, even considering the fact you had dual ADHRS and backup batteries.

Subscribing to follow this, and hopefully you'll get some feedback as to what happened.
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  #4  
Old 12-06-2016, 05:15 PM
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Raymo Raymo is offline
 
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Location: Richmond Hill, GA (KLHW)
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Default

Glad everything worked out for you. Can you clarify the following?

* Separate ADHRS for each Dynon Screen.
(normally a primary/backup AD-AHRS are wired into the network via splitter on the same network cable. Do you have two or three primary AD-AHRS?)
* I disconnected autopilot that had initiated a left bank and nose down at time of failure.
(via circuit breaker or other means since the EFIS was offline and would not likely have responded to the normal AP disable button)

I agree, this is disconcerting.
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  #5  
Old 12-06-2016, 06:00 PM
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BCP Boys BCP Boys is offline
 
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Default Crazy

First I'm so glad that things turned out okay and thankfully you are safe. The crazy thing that stands out is the number of other aircrafts that reported losing GPS signal !!! Where is this MOA? I'm staying the heck away from it
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  #6  
Old 12-06-2016, 06:01 PM
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Jesse Jesse is offline
 
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Location: X35 - Ocala, FL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raymo View Post
Glad everything worked out for you. Can you clarify the following?

* Separate ADHRS for each Dynon Screen.
(normally a primary/backup AD-AHRS are wired into the network via splitter on the same network cable. Do you have two or three primary AD-AHRS?)
* I disconnected autopilot that had initiated a left bank and nose down at time of failure.
(via circuit breaker or other means since the EFIS was offline and would not likely have responded to the normal AP disable button).
Both ADAHRS talk to both screens equally. There is no way to have a dual screen Dynon, each with its own ADAHRS, unless the screens are not connected, which I have never seen done.
On the auto pilot, the brains arsomewhat in the servos themselves. The auto pilot disconnect switch wires to both servos, telling them to turn off.
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  #7  
Old 12-07-2016, 05:59 AM
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Raymo Raymo is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse View Post
Both ADAHRS talk to both screens equally. There is no way to have a dual screen Dynon, each with its own ADAHRS, unless the screens are not connected, which I have never seen done.
On the auto pilot, the brains are somewhat in the servos themselves. The auto pilot disconnect switch wires to both servos, telling them to turn off.
Thanks, Jesse. That is what I thought about the ADAHRS. Forgot that the disconnect goes straight to the servos themselves.
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RV-7A - Slider - N495KL - First flt 27 Jan 17
O-360-A4M w/ AFP FM-150 FI, Dual PMags, Vetterman Trombone Exh, SkyTech starter, BandC Alt (PP failed after 226 hrs)
Catto 3 blade NLE, FlightLines Interior, James cowl, plenum & intake, Anti-Splat -14 seat mod and nose gear support
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  #8  
Old 12-07-2016, 09:24 AM
Joe Joe is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Independence, OR
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvscott777 View Post
Has anyone had their Dynon Skyview Screens Crash and go black while in flight?

Military GPS outage at exact time of Duel (sic) Dynon Skyview screen failure.
I have had that happen one time on the ground with Dynon system software version 14.2.1. It had to do with "airspace altitudes in Map" according to Dynon
and they promised a fix in v15. However, I'm delaying installation of v15 until it's more reliable.

What version of the Skyview software are your EFIS's running?

So apparently continued flight is possible without GPS :-)
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  #9  
Old 12-07-2016, 09:59 AM
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tomkk tomkk is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe View Post
... However, I'm delaying installation of v15 until it's more reliable...
fwiw, I've been running v15 without any problems. ymmv ...
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  #10  
Old 12-07-2016, 01:21 PM
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dynonsupport dynonsupport is offline
 
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We take reports like this seriously, and when Scott approached us with his data a month ago we did a thorough analysis of the events and his data. We've also had a recent conversation with Scott to make sure we didn't miss anything here.

We seeing a slightly different set of events in the datalogs that Scott sent us than he wrote here, and we've spoken through them with him about them. We definitely agree that the SV-D1000 experienced an in-flight restart. The exact root cause isn't easy to determine, but the display had previously alerted that it had detected an internal fault that could cause this issue. More on that in a bit.

We think that the SV-D700 experienced a shorter duration loss of information as the system reconfigured itself without the SV-D1000, and that that autopilot disconnected when the SV-D1000 restarted without the normal annunciation because of the display failure. We don't have evidence that the servos continued to drive the servos as Scott has indicated, but we're still researching this. There is room for us to improve the ability for the remaining display to annunciate disconnects and mode switches in these cases, and we're looking into that too.

All of those things said, our data/understanding may be imperfect here, and Scott's workload was higher during this sequence, so I don't want to get into a debate about the exact sequence. We'll continue to use reports and accompanying to improve our products in cases where capabilities are lost. I would like to mention a few things that all pilots equipped with SkyView might find useful.

Scott's displays annunciated SYSTEM EVENT messages in both in the flight described here and in previous flights. These there are newer alert messages that we've added in recent software versions that can occur when SkyView self-detects a hardware or software fault of some kind. Some of these are critical and are annunciated as such. Others - like system event 5 and system event 3 - are not critical, but should still be addressed/troubleshot with Dynon. Even though these non-critical events need not ground the aircraft, they do indicate that the system may not be as reliable as normally expected. We'll be looking at whether it makes sense to change the language on these events to provide a better indication to the pilot.

There is an optional reversionary mode capability that SkyView offers that we'd encourage pilots of multiple-screen systems to configure. This allows the sole remaining display in a multi-screen setup to reconfigure itself to show a particular screen configuration. In this case, if it were enabled, the 7" display in the aircraft could have reconfigured itself to show PFD/EMS/MAP (or various other sub-combinations that you can choose, based on your preference) automatically when the 10" display restarted. This is a valuable workload-saving tool that can really help in the event of a display failure or restart. Set set-up and configure, go to SETUP MENU > SYSTEM SETUP > SCREEN LAYOUT SETUP > REVERSION MODE on your SkyView system.

Finally, we encourage every pilot / builder to think hard about their aircraft and mission to determine what level of redundancy is right for them. Whether you choose a single display, multiple displays with multiple ADAHRS, or a primary single or multi-screen system that is backed up with a backup EFIS or other instrument(s) will depend on how you plan on using the aircraft, your personal minimums, etc. Think hard about what you would do if X failed in-flight, and whether the equipment and tools you have remaining satisfy your requirements.


Michael Schofield
Dynon Avionics
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Last edited by dynonsupport : 12-07-2016 at 07:00 PM.
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