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Removing a recalcitrant fuel drain

LettersFromFlyoverCountry

LettersFromFlyoverCountry

Well Known Member
Anyone got a foolproof way of removing one of these babies when stuck?

fuel_drain.jpg


I've got to drain the fuel out of a tank to fix a leak but I'll be darned if I could get it (or its partner) to budge. They went in when it was a lot warmer; it's a lot colder up in flyover country now.

I'm a little worried -- a lot worried, actually -- about breaking the darned thing off; that's how reluctant it was to turn when I put a wrench on it.

Also, can you confirm this is a typical "righty tighty, lefty loosey" deal?
 
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Socket or Box wrench

Bob find a socket that will fit it or a box wrench so you won't accidentally round off the edges and strip it. :eek: You could warm it up a little with some hot water then just use some steady pressure and it should come right off. ;) At least that's what I would probably do. :)
 
Try This

Use a six point socket or tubing wrench. Heat it up enough with a heat gun to melt some candle wax into the threads. May be hard to do with all that "coolant" on the other side of the sheetmetal. Or try "PB Blaster" penetrant. Way better than other stuff. Good luck.
 
Alternative

Use a siphon hose to get as much as you can out of the tanks, and then disconnect the hose to the mechanical fuel pump and use your electric pump to pump out the rest - should pump out at a rate of ~30 gph or better, and you should have ~5 gallons or less per tank to pump so about 20 minutes with the electric pump should do both tanks. Connecting a battery charger before starting the pumping will keep the battery in reasonable condition.

Then you can leave the fuel drains alone.
 
SMO said:
Use a siphon hose to get as much as you can out of the tanks, and then disconnect the hose to the mechanical fuel pump and use your electric pump to pump out the rest - should pump out at a rate of ~30 gph or better, and you should have ~5 gallons or less per tank to pump so about 20 minutes with the electric pump should do both tanks. Connecting a battery charger before starting the pumping will keep the battery in reasonable condition.

Then you can leave the fuel drains alone.
Click to expand...

Good idea, but when it comes time to replace the o-ring on that quick-drain, he'll still have a problem :eek:
 
LettersFromFlyoverCountry said:
Also, can you confirm this is a typical "righty tighty, lefty loosey" deal?
Click to expand...

Reminds me a time not long ago when I was trying to remove a plumbing fixture under a sink. Try as I might I could not get it to budge until after significant wasted time I realized that I was looking at it backwards and was tightening it the whole time.
 
This may sound silly but lefty loosey is right but only if you're laying on your back looking at the fitting from below. I would put slip joint pliers on the fitting to keep it from twisting the rivets loose while wrenching on the drain. A few scratches on the fitting would be better than damaging the tank. Some heat would definitely help. Good luck.
 
rv9aviator said:
This may sound silly but lefty loosey is right but only if you're laying on your back looking at the fitting from below. I would put slip joint pliers on the fitting to keep it from twisting the rivets loose while wrenching on the drain. A few scratches on the fitting would be better than damaging the tank. Some heat would definitely help. Good luck.
Click to expand...

Yep, just take a propane torch and gently.............wait...................
 
Replaced CAV-110

Just had to do this on my plane. My tanks were quick build and the drain valve would not retract. When I tried to remove them, they didn't budge. I used some good old WD40 and waiting overnight. The next day, using a 1/2" ratchet I was able to get them off. Replaced with a new set, and all is good.
 
I use a tiny bit of fuel lube on the threads when installing the drains and never have a problem removing them. (at least not yet!)
 
stuck fuel drain

had the same problem with a Cherokee. turns out I was just scared to apply enough torque. Use the right wrench so as not to round off flats, and be brave. It will turn.
 
Ron Lee said:
Reminds me a time not long ago when I was trying to remove a plumbing fixture under a sink. Try as I might I could not get it to budge until after significant wasted time I realized that I was looking at it backwards and was tightening it the whole time.
Click to expand...

I am assuming, lying -- laying? -- on my back that "loosey" turns the most forward part of the drain nut inboard... left.
 
Use only a six point socket... The drain is steel and the flange is aluminum so it should not gall when removed.... Dave
 
Fuel Drains

Hi Bob,

From the picture it appears that you used some proseal on the fitting. No problem. The issue comes from dissimilar materials and the tendency of most to over tighten initially. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN!!!! (for everyone:))

If you used pro seal, try to remove as much as possible. Next, with a heat gun heat the aluminum around the fitting. Try to avoid the brass. Use the appropriate socket and try to loosen with a counter clockwise application. It should break loose. If not, try to move it slightly with a tightening motion. This will sometimes break it loose so you can now go counter clockwise and remove.

If it will still not break loose, get out your torque wrench and find what the fitting is actually torqued to. You'll see just how bad you ham fisted the fitting. You'll shock yourself. (I know this feeling:eek:)

Still not loose, get some help and have someone heat the area while you work the wrench. You should be successful.

Finally, occasionally, bad stuff happens. If the fitting breaks off there are methods to remove the broken pieces. Absolute worst case, you have to drill out the tank fitting and replace. Not the end of the World, but a little more work. This could probably be done w/o removing the tank. A little more work if you have to remove the tank. Worse case, 4-5 hours of work.

Good luck, keep us posted.
 
LettersFromFlyoverCountry said:
I am assuming, lying -- laying? -- on my back that "loosey" turns the most forward part of the drain nut inboard... left.
Click to expand...

Lying on your back...looking up, you turn it counterclockwise.

Before doing this, get advice, but I use a cheater tube to get adequate torque. Do use a loosening agent first. Give it time to work.
 
PB Blaster

gets my vote. It's penetrating oil in an aerosol can. Spray it good and come back in the morning. If still won't come loose, place a socket wrench on it and tap the wrench handle gently with a piece of wood or plastic mallet. You just want to shock it a little. Then respray Blaster and wait a few hours - rinse and repeat until it comes loose. Patience.....
 
Replacement CAV-110 better?

In line with this thread, is there something better than the Vans CAV-110 drain valve? Some other valve that won't calcify or corrode? I have been thinking about installing more "flush-type" drain fittings, so I've been looking at catalogues to see what's available. However, I'm tempted to follow Vans protocol with CAV-110s since they came with the kit... Suggestions?
 
RV7Guy said:
Hi Bob,

From the picture it appears that you used some proseal on the fitting. No problem. The issue comes from dissimilar materials and the tendency of most to over tighten initially. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN!!!! (for everyone:))
Click to expand...

It's not ProSeal. It's dirty Fuel Lube (EZ Turn)

RV7Guy said:
If it will still not break loose, get out your torque wrench and find what the fitting is actually torqued to. You'll see just how bad you ham fisted the fitting. You'll shock yourself. (I know this feeling:eek:)
Click to expand...

If memory serves -- and it frequently doesn't -- the fitting was leaking when the plane went into service and it was tightened only enough to make it stop.
 
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ppilotmike said:
In line with this thread, is there something better than the Vans CAV-110 drain valve? Some other valve that won't calcify or corrode? ...... Suggestions?
Click to expand...

See if Post #8 here is your answer:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=93593

"FYI Saf-Air fuel drain valves are also available in STAINLESS STEEL, and eliminate the rust on the outside and on the inside (which will cause leaks). Just ask for CAV-110SS. Gene"

Verify materials compatibility with the RV.
 
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Move the plane out side have fan on have fire extinguish procedure in place.
Have two tool one on part one flange hold tool so you can two fist them and squeeze together. Wala
Bill
need to pay for next year.
 
Ron Lee said:
See if Post #8 here is your answer:

http://www.vansairforce.com/community/showthread.php?t=93593

"FYI Saf-Air fuel drain valves are also available in STAINLESS STEEL, and eliminate the rust on the outside and on the inside (which will cause leaks). Just ask for CAV-110SS. Gene"
Click to expand...

Ron,

Thanks. I had been reading that thread before, which is what made me start looking at catalogues. However, I've heard stainless steel reacts negatively when in contact with aluminum, and the flange holding it in the tank is aluminum. Is this incorrect, or am I missing something?
 
I do not know. Hopefully people smarter than I will answer. (Will also update my previous post)
 
i have had success using an air or electric impact wrench.and a 6 point socket. and (important), a back-up wrench as previously suggested.
 
So you're suggesting putting a pipe wrench on the flange at the same time. Being circular, you'd have to give it a pretty good squeeze which I would think act as a clamping force against the valve, which tends to exacerbate the problem, no? Also, the flange is going to end up looking like crud.
 
Do what a plumber would do, use a chain wrench add a piece of leather 1st.
With out some kind of opposite torque applied to flange you could damage the surrounding of the flange.
Have some one hold the flange wrench with some ccw pressure on it, then some one with a 6 point box end wrench hold cw opposite pressure than tap 6 point on end with small 14/16oz brass hammer or 2x2 you want to hit sharp fast blows like a impact wrench. No sparks be safe. Don't used a impact wrench unless you practiced a lot on it first.
You could try a ss clamp then a pipe wrench on that, seen somebody do this and it worked for them.
Bill J


"LettersFromFlyoverCountry*RV-7A N614EF*Join Date: Jan 2005Location: St. PaulPosts: 3,318So you're suggesting putting a pipe wrench on the flange at the same time. Being circular, you'd have to give it a pretty good squeeze which I would think act as a clamping force against the valve, which tends to exacerbate the problem, no? Also, the flange is going to end up looking like crud.__________________"
 
LettersFromFlyoverCountry said:
Anyone got a foolproof way of removing one of these babies when stuck?

I've got to drain the fuel out of a tank to fix a leak but I'll be darned if I could get it (or its partner) to budge. They went in when it was a lot warmer; it's a lot colder up in flyover country now.

I'm a little worried -- a lot worried, actually -- about breaking the darned thing off; that's how reluctant it was to turn when I put a wrench on it.

Also, can you confirm this is a typical "righty tighty, lefty loosey" deal?
Click to expand...

Ron Lee said:
Maybe not. I think that he wants fuel removed from the tank to make a leak repair. Removing the drain is one, not the only, method.
Click to expand...

Now we've gone from using complicated methods for removing a fuel tank drain to not even being able to agree on the original post! :D :D
 
Saying that we are pole vaulting over mouse droppings is not fair. The original post is reasonable and frankly a wise one by the poster. He had a concern and rather that just do the guy way and press forward...with the possible result of damaging something and requiring far more work to repair, he asked the best way to do something.

Is that any different that wondering how to repair a leaking drain? There the poster got good advice on the O-ring and NPT plugs. It also reminded me that I never procured an NPT plug (or drain O-rings) for my travel kit.

Readers learned about putting fuel lube or similar on the threads of the drain plus other useful info.

So maybe we did pole vault a bit but mucho useful info was provided.
 
The fuel drain has now been removed thanks to the advice of wise people.

Thank you very much for the advice. But, even more important, thank you for the entertainment this thread provided.

Some of you guys never fail to crack me up. Seriously, though, in my next life I'm going to come back as a VAF member with all the answers who has forgotten all of his roots of tackling homebuilding tasks, delivering the always-clever rhetorical noogie for even asking such dumb questions. Oh, man, it's going to be so cool fitting in!

Just for the record: The reason I didn't want to pump out the fuel to empty the tank -- yes, I thought of that -- was that I didn't want to take the bottom cowling off, which required me to take the intersection fairing off, which required me to take the wheel pant off, which required me to take the gear leg fairing off, which required me to ... well... never mind.
 
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42 Posts?

42 posts to remove a tank drain, educational and entertaining.
One more wise crack won't hurt,:D
 
OKAV8r said:
Please don't leave us in suspense...
What did you choose from the multitude of tricks provided?
Click to expand...

Well, first I took Ted Chang's advice. I learned this a long time ago: Ted Chang rocks. He also made me appreciate, again, the power of the opposable thumb, which is just above kitchen microwaves in my list of great inventions.

Then, I bought some PB Blaster, which I'd never heard of before, which RV legend Bernie Ockuly, who has an opposable thumb by the way -- recommended, mostly because he's an Ohio guy and he does his part to support the Cleveland economy and I figured if I could drain this tank AND help the economy of Cleveland, well, that's a better day's work than just banging out messages on an internet forum about some fool who wants to be sure he's turning a fitting in the proper direction.

Then I took the socket wrench that people suggested and applied torque, while keeping in mind Darwin Barrie's assurance that even if things go badly, there's a fix for it.

Then I turned it and .... it came OFF.

Then I uttered a defiant two word shout, followed by a comma, and the name of someone who might or might not have contributed to this thread.

It was an awesome moment! I wish you all could've been there.
 
Fantastic

LettersFromFlyoverCountry said:
Well, first I took Ted Chang's advice. I learned this a long time ago: Ted Chang rocks. He also made me appreciate, again, the power of the opposable thumb, which is just above kitchen microwaves in my list of great inventions.

Then, I bought some PB Blaster, which I'd never heard of before, which RV legend Bernie Ockuly, who has an opposable thumb by the way -- recommended, mostly because he's an Ohio guy and he does his part to support the Cleveland economy and I figured if I could drain this tank AND help the economy of Cleveland, well, that's a better day's work than just banging out messages on an internet forum about some fool who wants to be sure he's turning a fitting in the proper direction.

Then I took the socket wrench that people suggested and applied torque, while keeping in mind Darwin Barrie's assurance that even if things go badly, there's a fix for it.

Then I turned it and .... it came OFF.

Then I uttered a defiant two word shout, followed by a comma, and the name of someone who might or might not have contributed to this thread.

It was an awesome moment! I wish you all could've been there.
Click to expand...


Great response.

Now I won't be skered to remove mine to drain the fuel when I dive into my fuel valve replacement project....on some rainy day that is, in AZ.
 
Rather than draining fuel one could also go flying and burn the fuel. Blow one tank and return to the airport with minimum fuel, less to drain and a heck of a lot more fun.
 
Norman CYYJ said:
Rather than draining fuel one could also go flying and burn the fuel. Blow one tank and return to the airport with minimum fuel, less to drain and a heck of a lot more fun.
Click to expand...

Thought of that, too. I'm in the middle of polishing the plane and I'd finally convinced myself to stop flying and get it done instead of my "polish one panel and then go flying" method. Actually, i discovered the weepy rivet as I was making my way down the underside of the wing.

Hey, that's a lot of fun, too, polishing the underside of a wing. :p
 
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