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New SB issued 6 May 2016 (SB16-03-28)

Thanks

Really appreciate you posting this, as I'm just days away from riveting on my aileron hinge brackets. I'm sure there are others out there in a similar situation.
Cheers,
Tom.
 
What a disappointing development. Does anyone know how many reports of this type of cracking Van's received prior to issuing the SB?

It sure would be nice if Doug set some sort of database where people could report and share their findings as they execute the inspection portion of this SB:). The data should be available fairly quickly given the direction to inspect before further flight.
 
It would be nice to receive an "inspect before further flight" by an email notice. Not that I'm asking for more SB's.
 
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Concur!

It would be nice to receive an "inspect before further flight" by an email notice. Not that I'm asking for more SB's.

Steve,

I agree.

On another note, I posted up a message over on the General Discussion forum to drive folks over here.

I was just killing time on a Saturday night and rarely check this part of VAF. Would have been weeks before I'd seen it otherwise.

Pretty important SB to be buried off the main storefront, so I gave a heads-up.

Rob
 
SB 16-03-28

Thank you Bernie for posting this, it is really appreciated...

''SB notes that there is a charge if you need parts. '' Amazing that we have to pay for parts to fix a design problems...:rolleyes:

Bruno
 
Welcome

Is this a first for Vans? SB notes that there is a charge if you need parts.

Nope. Welcome to the club. Good news, the SB kits are usually inexpensive. It's the errors installing them that cost.:eek:
BTW, anyone notice the rivet on the bracket in the SB are installed backwards. I suspect most are done per Mil-Spec and installed with the factory side on the forward side of the aft spar. Drilling the shop side will be a bit more tricky.
 
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Quote from SB: It is unlikely that RV-6/6A wings will be affected. If cracks are present in RV-6/6A aircraft, email Van’s Engineering Dept for instructions, with photos of the cracks, for a specific repair scheme.

Curiosity question. What is different about the -6/6A wing that makes it unlikely that cracks would occur?

I'm a non-builder.
 
Quote from SB: It is unlikely that RV-6/6A wings will be affected. If cracks are present in RV-6/6A aircraft, email Van?s Engineering Dept for instructions, with photos of the cracks, for a specific repair scheme.

Curiosity question. What is different about the -6/6A wing that makes it unlikely that cracks would occur?

I'm a non-builder.

Another non-builder question....

What's causing the cracks that are being seen?

Assembly error? Fatigue? Something else?

Which wings are they happening on? QB? SB? Both?
 
Quote from SB: It is unlikely that RV-6/6A wings will be affected. If cracks are present in RV-6/6A aircraft, email Van?s Engineering Dept for instructions, with photos of the cracks, for a specific repair scheme.

Curiosity question. What is different about the -6/6A wing that makes it unlikely that cracks would occur?

I'm a non-builder.

Looks like the -6 wings have the rib flange use the same rivets as the long flange of the aileron bracket.

That doesn't seem to be the case in the -7 and perhaps that allows a little more flexing of the rear spar under aileron loads.
 
Be thankful

Thank you Bernie for posting this, it is really appreciated...

''SB notes that there is a charge if you need parts. '' Amazing that we have to pay for parts to fix a design problems...:rolleyes:

Bruno

Yes, I know we really don't like it when we see these SB's, but on the other hand I think we should be glad they are published. The fleet is really quite large now, and problems will show up, whether they are caused by design or fatigue. This one looks very well thought out with the fix already designed and ready for sale at a small cost. Really nothing wrong with that---we NEED Van's to stay in business. :)
And since we put ourselves and a lot of our family and closest friends in these airplanes quite regularly, I am glad someone is looking out for us and being responsive to findings in the field or on the factory demonstrators. And most likely everyone won't have the problem, but it's certainly worth checking.

Vic
 
Question from the SB, am I reading it correctly that if your wings are built and you have no visible cracking then you disregard but continue to inspect on an annual basis?

NOTE: Completion of the modifications in this service bulletin as a preventative measure (prior to cracks being detected) on wings that have been fully assembled is not recommended
 
I note that the service bulletin does not make reference to remedial action for new wings still under construction. The bulletin states: "Completion of the modifications in this service bulletin as a preventative measure (prior to cracks being detected) on wings that have been fully assembled is not recommended."

The service parts also appear to have been designed for reworking a completed wing rather than new. A doubler plate seems more appropriate for a new spar (like the HS bulletin)

I've requested information from Vans, but would appreciate feedback from other builders. Thanks.
 
Someone should set up a poll to track inspection results.

Would be nice to collect cracks or not, model, total flight time, QB or slow built, crack location if present, time required for the inspection and repair if unlucky, and perhaps something not listed. Would be best if there was a sticky and a pole in each model's forum. That way it could stick around for the recurring annual inspections that hopefully this will require. The fix looks like a real pain.
 
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Question from the SB, am I reading it correctly that if your wings are built and you have no visible cracking then you disregard but continue to inspect on an annual basis?

NOTE: Completion of the modifications in this service bulletin as a preventative measure (prior to cracks being detected) on wings that have been fully assembled is not recommended

Correct ... that's the way I read it.
 
I'd like to see a poll also.
Just checked my RV-8A. No cracks or stress marks of any kind. Easy to do from inspection port. Of course, I'm only 11 hours into my phase1. However, if completed wings need correction, it's going to be a b***h to get a bucking bar in there.

Tom H.
 
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being a non builder if cracks are found on the aileron hinge brackets on the 10 it looks like a labor intensive repair. anyone guess how many hours of labor required?

Alan
N668G
RV 10
 
I just received my wing kit in March (RV-10) and some of the parts in this area were missing including the COM bearings and the aileron hinge bearings. Van's didn't mention any reason but sent them along with some parts that were backordered a few weeks later.

I'm going to check the parts list again to see if the new parts required were included. If not, I hope to convince Van's to send the new parts free of charge, considering that they should be included with new kits (I would hope) and my kit was shipped presumably near the end of the development of this SB.
 
being a non builder if cracks are found on the aileron hinge brackets on the 10 it looks like a labor intensive repair. anyone guess how many hours of labor required?

Alan
N668G
RV 10

It would probably take me 5 hours a wing, especially trying to stop drill a crack... All while working through the access panel.
 
Just went to the airport and checked my 7A. Happy to say no issue to date with 200 hours. Bucking will be real fun though for someone out of practice. Like me! Just wondering if the updated assembly could be all bolted on...
 
Make sure you fit your gust lock(s) when parked overnight, etc., to lessen shock to that bracket and its attachment points.
 
RV-6A, 11 YRS, 720 hours - no defects or cracks found. The 6/6A has a "stub" rib at the hinges with five rivets common to the hinge and rib through the rear spar. This prevents flexing of the rear spar from hinge loads in that area. That is why cracks on a 6/6A would be very unusual compared to the other models.
 
Would it be possible to get the thread title amended to include the SB number? Might aid future searches.

Thanks
 
When doing your condition inspection, you should really be going to Van's SB webpage, not hear to look for SB's.

Good tip of course. My inspection completed 2-27 this year. :rolleyes:
I just inspected mine for the SB today. 500 hrs, slow build. The suspect area looks just as pristine as the day I built it. Logs noted and I am ready for my weekly commute tomorrow AM.
 
N10VC--RV10

1014 hours, 6 years old. No cracks or problems noted.
It takes about 1 1/2 hours in the RV-10 with some help holding the aileron, which was Carol today (even on Mother's Day---what a trooper!). Now I have to go cook on the grill. :)

Vic
 
I have read the SB and have one question, how the heck you stop drill the cracks from inside the wing?
 
Drill guide

That's why you are making the drill guide using the bracket as a template and then making very careful measurements and drilling from the outside to stop the cracks from propagating any further. Take your time and read the SB, or talk to someone who can explain it. You REALLY want to be careful here as you are drilling on the spar.

Vic
 
That's why you are making the drill guide using the bracket as a template and then making very careful measurements and drilling from the outside to stop the cracks from propagating any further. Take your time and read the SB, or talk to someone who can explain it. You REALLY want to be careful here as you are drilling on the spar.

Vic

Thanks Vic. I guess I didn't read the SB that closely. This is going to be a challenge!
 
1 1/2 hours for one plane Vic? You're padding the job..... :)

Then again, maybe it takes on longer on the "Heavy Iron".

Louise and I just finish doing all three of our RV's ( -3, -6, -8), and did it within the second our of Prairie Home on the radio - so about 45 minutes. Just slid around on the creepers pulling covers, inspecting, putting them back on. I started out using my borescope, but quickly decided the resolution wasn't up to the job, and it was tricky to point, so I just reached in with the cell phone and took great Hi Rez pictures. One spot on the -8 was a little suspect, but once I blew it up on the big computer screen, it appears to be a scratch rather than a crack.

I highly recommend using the camera method - quick, and you have results you can save and look at the next time.

Total TIme in Service:

RV-6 ~ 4,000
RV-3 = 530
RV-8 = 1810
 
We just completed the inspection on all three of our RV's. It took Louise and I less than an hour to remove the six covers, take pictures of the suspect area with a cell phone stuck in through the hole, and then put the covers back on. Would have been quicker if I let Louise use a power driver, but I'm old fashioned and use a screwdriver for inspection covers to avoid buggering things up.

I highly recommend using the cell phone camera. Email the Hi Rez to yourself and then use your big computer screen to really look at the picture. I had a scratch that looked like a crack until I blew it up.

Paul
 
Just out of curiosity, how does the company get this info out to owners? I *think* (but can't swear) that I have notified Van's that I currently own my purchased RV-4, but I've never received any notification directly from the company about any SB that applies to it.

Do they attempt to send emails to registered owners, or are we expected to check somewhere every day for service bulletins as part of our pre-flight? If so, where?

Not that I've got my panties in a wad over it, but I just gave about a half dozen Young Eagles rides, plus taking my wife to/from the event, the day after this SB was issued.

I realize that Van's is a small company; yadayadayada, and mailing letters might be seen as too expensive, but an email to registered owners??

Charlie
 
The inspection is easy

I just inspected my 2006 RV-8 SB @1577 hours and found no cracks. I used a mirror and flashlight. The rivets in question are very easy to see and/or photograph. The area looks pristine on my plane. I routinely do light aerobatics; it will be interesting to see how many RV's have cracks and what activities or practices might be associated with cracks.

Dan Miller
RV-8 N3TU
IO-360 M1; WW 200RV
 
Just inspected my RV-8A

Built: 2003.
Hours: 687

Inspected visually and with cell phone camera. No cracks observed.
 
1577-hour RV-8, no cracks

My RV-8 is 10-years old and 1577 hours, including frequent light aerobatics. No cracks or defects noted. This inspection is easy; accomplishing the repair would not be.

Dan Miller
 
Just checked two RV-8's and my RV-7A on my field (3EV) and no cracks. Youngest plane was mine at 6 years old and 600 hours.
 
SB-16-03-28 Report your findings.

RV-9A, 9 years, 1502 hrs TTAF, no problems noted, 30m minutes total including iphone pictures. Dan from Reno
 
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I did the same- Took off the covers and let the iPhone do the looking. All is in order. I'm keeping the picture as a record anyway. Took 45 minutes. Would have been shorter but there was a really good Grateful Dead set playing........
 
Is it safe to assume this SB will be a non issue for new kits not shipped/ordered yet.

Not sure. If you read my post from earlier in the thread you'll see that my wing kit was delivered in March and was missing some parts in this area. I have reviewed the inventory of my kit and the parts described in the SB are NOT included.

So it appears that at least wing kits that have shipped prior to the SB issuance do not have the appropriate parts nor instructions incorporated yet. Whether Van's will include these parts and instructions with new kits shipped after the SB remains to be seen.

ETA: I checked "The List" on Van's web site and the parts called out in the SB for the RV10/14 don't seem to be included yet.

ETA: I'm speculating here a bit, but if I read the plans and the SB correctly, for the RV-10, the W-1013C-L/R, W-1013A, and W-1013B-L/R combinations get replaced by W-1013D and W-1013E? respectively, so I would expect new kits to have the -D and -E parts instead of the W-1013A, W-1013B-L/R, and include the new D, E, and W-1013F-R/L and W-1013G-R/L parts.
 
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RV-10

Paul, the ailerons have to come off, and the flaps have to be disconnected on the the 10. And since they are primary flight controls, they get double-checked when reinstalling. :)

Vic
 
Paul, the ailerons have to come off, and the flaps have to be disconnected on the the 10. And since they are primary flight controls, they get double-checked when reinstalling. :)

Vic

I'm assuming you wouldn't generally remove these during a condition inspection, so this will add some critical work to every condition inspection. Or do you remove yours normally?

I'm waiting to see how Van's will respond to my question about providing these parts to new wing kits purchasers (I just received mine in March and I don't have the new parts in my inventory). I'm hoping they will issue these parts to be fitted as part of the initial build for post-SB kits.
 
SB

I'm assuming you wouldn't generally remove these during a condition inspection, so this will add some critical work to every condition inspection. Or do you remove yours normally?

I'm waiting to see how Van's will respond to my question about providing these parts to new wing kits purchasers (I just received mine in March and I don't have the new parts in my inventory). I'm hoping they will issue these parts to be fitted as part of the initial build for post-SB kits.

Typically any kit purchàsed after an SB issue date will have all previous SBs incorporated into the parts, plans and manual. If purchased prior, the builder is responsible for procurement of the SB and installing it if required. The HS SB, for example, is part of new kits. I expect it would take some time to revise plans, manual pages and inventory.
 
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You're right....

We don't normally remove the flight controls during a normal condition inspection. I think once the cuts are made we might be able to inspect them without removal in the future.

And turning the inboard aileron bolt around looks like it will make it doable without having to disconnect the flap. I can't see any reason to not turn the bolt around.

Vic
 
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