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Plan vs. Actual

dflyguy

I'm New Here
Folks,

I am at the planning stage of an RV build. Van’s says that the build on a -14 is 1100 hours. I’m adding 50% to that total (plus a few months). If I pay attention to my intention then the math says that I can build for 100 hours a month and be finished in 18 months. I know that all builders begin a project with the best intention and then unforeseen circumstances may side tract them. Age does not afford me that option.

So, my questions to the group are:

In the beginning of a build, do members have a “complete plan” laid out by month-by-month moving forward step-by-step? If so, would you like to share your plan with me? I’d like to plan my build from start to finish.

I’m curious; is the group tracking all of the builders who have completed their project and the hours that they have spent on their project? I saw a member with an “actual” completed build time of 638 hours. That’s amazing! I’m certain that he began with a comprehensive plan.

Thank you for your sharing,
 
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The best-laid plans o' mice an' men gang aft a-gley...

Plans are good, but in the end...who cares? It takes however long it takes, whether that was your original plan or not.

Just follow the manual, and enjoy the build! :)
 
What he said. In addition, an aircraft build is an effort you don't want to rush. If you fall behind your planned progress, will you feel compelled to pick up the pace? That's not a good thing. This gumbo needs to simmer along as long as it needs. You must not allow yourself to rush the build: Shortcuts aren't good for safe aircraft construction.
 
The best-laid plans o' mice an' men gang aft a-gley...

Plans are good, but in the end...who cares? It takes however long it takes, whether that was your original plan or not.

Just follow the manual, and enjoy the build! :)

638 hours at 8 hrs a day average is roughly 80 days. I would imagine the only way to make that happen is:
Have help, experienced help
Live near one of the aviation supply houses
Order every kit at the same time
Never make a mistake
Have the engine and avionics at the start of the build
Have no kids
Retired
Not married unless she/he is the helper
Have a hangar to build in on the airfield
Perfect weather
Etc

I would imagine that it is possible to complete the build in that short of a time but unlikely for most. Plans are good but often need to be amended in the middle of the build for numerous reasons. There is no harm in planning but be prepared to accept that it may change. For me the building process is the fun part. Time is never my end goal. It will be done when it’s done. I don’t like putting and end time on a project like this. I do not feel safe rushing the build!!
Sorry. Quoted the wrong post
 
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Don't set deadlines, you are just going to get frustrated and not enjoy the build.

I would just build as much as you feel like for the day. When you get tired, call it a day and go do something else. Sometimes I can build for 6 hours straight, other times in burned out after 45 minutes just depending on how the day is going.
 
Having a month by month plan for your first build is impossible. You won't have any idea about how long stuff will take as you start to learn, what mistakes you will have to undo / redo, what modifications you will want to make, and what part you absolutely positively need right now that gets back ordered for a month or spends two weeks in a USPS sorting facility....

You can have a big picture of what and when, and then find that the engine backlog is 9 months or your ailerons are back ordered for 11 months and counting (true story).
 
It's not like you're going to get to a particular point (on either the calendar OR the budget) where it exceeds a certain threshold and you just say "Screw it, that didn't work, I quit."

You're gonna do it, or you're not. If you're gonna do it then keep doing it until it's done.

I had a 5-year plan to pay for it and build it, and it only took me 8 years - but it survived one ex-wife, a couple girlfriends, a job change and a move, so I figured it worked out.

Likewise - I did not track the costs of the build - because it didn't matter to me. I knew I would spend "about" $90k-100k for the airplane the way I wanted it, and I wasn't going to fret about passing any particular point on the budget because I knew I wouldn't quit building when I hit that point - so I simply ignored it. I wrote checks when I could, and paused when I couldn't, and kept building.

It's not a football game with a clock - it's a life event. Enjoy it.
 
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OP is not unfamiliar with homebuilding; he has a Dragonfly and is re-powering the "biplane". I personally know a number of the Bakersfield gang who cranked their RV-4's out in 3-4 months, and know of 2 LongEZ's (plans built, not kits) that went from first layup to first flight in less than 100 days.

I've built a number of planes, and enjoy the building process, but understand sometimes the goal is simply get in the air. Is 3 or 4 months realistic for a 14 or 14a? Who knows, but waiting for parts (especially the ones you don't know you need after the airframe is built) can put a real hitch in the best laid plans.
 
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My plan was always to finish on a Friday. That was as detailed as I got. Anyone (and everyone that sees you building will) asks when I was going to be done I said “on a Friday”. I actually succeeded as first flight was on a Friday.
 
Tuesday

My plan was always to finish on a Friday. That was as detailed as I got. Anyone (and everyone that sees you building will) asks when I was going to be done I said “on a Friday”. I actually succeeded as first flight was on a Friday.

Funny. I always say Tuesday. They look suprised.
Seriously, no way to estimate based on anyone elses Hobbs. Too many variables.
Buy the QB kits and a big chunk is already done.
 
I personally do not think it is realistic to layout a schedule for building the 14. There are too many variables that are unknown at the outset to be able to account for them and make an accurate schedule. These include builder factors such as initial skill level and proficiency, pace of learning, time management ability, daily stamina, and competing responsibilities & relationships. There are also outside factors such as availability and lead time for sub-kits, upgrades, tools, hardware, avionics and power plant, etc... Then there are the unforeseen items that you don't know you need until you arrive at that point in the build. There are many, but I'll take a rotisserie as an example. You may decide when you are building your fuselage that a rotisserie will save time (and you back), and will increase build quality by placing you in a better position to perform a task. Now you need to make one, adding time that you could not have accounted for until you reached that decision.

I tried to make a schedule for my first build (non RV) and quickly abandoned it. Waiting on one critical item for two weeks blows up the whole schedule. And that will happen many times over the course of a build (RV or not).

So first off, build for the fun of it alone. If you truly enjoy building, it will seem to go fast. And it probably will go fast, because you will build every day - because you enjoy it. If you don't really want to build for the sake of building alone, just keep flying the dragonfly, or buy a flying example of what you are looking for. Nothing wrong with that approach at all.

The strategy that I have found helps move building along most effectively is actually very simple. It is simply to understand that you the builder are the rate limiting step in the process. Do whatever is necessary to ensure that you have on hand whatever is needed to keep at it. When you have to wait on something, use that time productively on another part of the project. Order extra hardware in advance - to keep from waiting on it later. Buy good quality tools that will let you work most efficiently. This strategy does work - but it will only means that you will finish faster than you otherwise would have. Actual build time remains unknown until you finish.
 
When bought the tail kit, I was hoping to be flying in 10 years. Here I am 10 years later only on the fuselage . The lesson was that life happens and the plane needed to take a back seat for a bit.

Built the tail one winter, worked the day job all summer and then got the wing kit. I powered through the wings in about 6 months, working 6-10 hours per day. Would have easily kept up the pace and flying in less than planned time, but life. Got married, started a family, all the thing more important than bits of aluminum. The great thing is my wife is supportive of the project. I've had the tail kit longer than I've known her. Now that life is more settled, I bought the fuselage and am back at building.
 
I thought I could build my 7A in about 2000 hours and it took me 4000. I did it in 4 years. I'm a bit of a perfectionist and I'm guessing I probably scratched my head for at least 200 of those hours.

It takes what it takes. If you want to know what it will take you, get started and work on it for 6 months. After that you should have a good idea of your available time and pace.

Just remember, once you flip the canoe and attach the empennage and wings, you're about half way.
 
I came to realize that the only thing I could control is whether or not I worked on the plane every day. I set a goal of working 10 hrs a week, and I try to work on it every day. That's the only thing I'm really able to control. The build will take however long it takes, all I can do is decide every morning to keep building.
 
All this talk of meticulous planning and record keeping is giving me hives. I just followed the build manual till the fuselage got flipped. After that, I foundered a bit thanks to some "life events" until I hit upon a"to do" list where I write down stuff that I think needs to be done soon/before something else. It's a living document and gets rearranged frequently but it helps focus. I also came to the conclusion that any progress is good progress as long as it doesn't have to be redone later, which is how I justify hopping around between structure, wiring, and other tasks.

Not counting hours; I really don't want to know... but coming up on 8 years building. Probably two to go.
 
I'm a bit embarrassed to admit that as a post-graduate qualified project manager (MSc) it has taken me nearly 28 years to build my RV to 46.325% complete.

So I humbly suggest...don't...go....there! :)
 
I'm going to be a bit of a contrarian and say the OP's plan can work at the macro level and with some caveats. It takes discipline. It takes applying 25 hrs per week of actual no-s**t building time each and every week. That's measuring, cutting, fitting, riveting, wrenching time - not pondering your navel, talking to visitors, fixing coffee, reading VAF, eating lunch time. The caveats: order all the kits and other components up front or with plenty of lead time and stick to your initial configuration, i.e. don't chase the shiny new stuff or deviate from the plans. That's not everyone's cup of tea but there's no reason it still can't be fun and it will certainly be rewarding to meet that goal.
 
As to the OPs original question about actual time spent by builders....

Go to eaabuilderslog.org and use the advanced search to find RV-14 builders. You can then browse their build logs, many of which do report hours.

That will give you a good idea.
 
I'm building a -14. It's been an interesting lesson in logistics.

I plowed through the vertical stabilizer and rudder in a few weeks, and then COVID hit, the market crashed, and evaporated the funds I was expecting to order my fuselage kit with... which also evaporated my desire to continue building.

After 9 months I finally recovered and was able to order my fuselage kit. It has been very motivating to me knowing that I have X weeks until it shows up and my goal is to be done with the empennage by the time the fuselage arrives.

Other than that I don't really have a project schedule other than my goal is to work on the plane for at least an hour per day when I am home.
 
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