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Foreflight being acquired by Boeing

$$$$ Opportunity

To me is looks like an opportunity to force the ForeFlight community to be required to use Jepp under the auspices of not having to maintain two different chart solutions and "saving money".


Just a WAG, lets see what happens.
 
RIP Foreflight, is what I'm thinking.

Me, too. Big Company buys little company. Sees an opportunity to maximize profits. Kills goose laying golden eggs.

Non commercial users find better mousetrap provided by small entrepreneur with better customer support at a lower cost.

Rinse and repeat.
 
Me, too. Big Company buys little company. Sees an opportunity to maximize profits. Kills goose laying golden eggs.

Non commercial users find better mousetrap provided by small entrepreneur with better customer support at a lower cost.

Rinse and repeat.

+1

Can't see a path where Boeing doesn't screw this up for GA users.

Larry
 
FWIW, this is from Foreflight when I contacted them after reading the news.....

Hi David,

Grant here - Thank you for flying with ForeFlight.

We understand your concerns. However, GA pilots have been the foundation of our business since day 1, and we're still fully committed to making your flying safer and more enjoyable.

You can read this AOPA article with our co-founder Tyson Weihs for more information: [AOPA Article](https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2019/march/06/boeing-acquires-foreflight)

Let us know if you have any questions. We're happy to help!

Grant
Pilot Support Team
[email protected]
www.foreflight.com

[ForeFlight Support Center] (https://foreflight.com/support/support-center/)
[ForeFlight Video Library] (https://foreflight.com/support/video-library/)
[ForeFlight Mobile Pilot's Guide](https://foreflight.com/ipad/guide/pdf)
 
FWIW, this is from Foreflight when I contacted them after reading the news.....

Hi David,

Grant here - Thank you for flying with ForeFlight.

We understand your concerns. However, GA pilots have been the foundation of our business since day 1, and we're still fully committed to making your flying safer and more enjoyable.

You can read this AOPA article with our co-founder Tyson Weihs for more information: [AOPA Article](https://www.aopa.org/news-and-media/all-news/2019/march/06/boeing-acquires-foreflight)

Let us know if you have any questions. We're happy to help!

Grant
Pilot Support Team
[email protected]
www.foreflight.com

[ForeFlight Support Center] (https://foreflight.com/support/support-center/)
[ForeFlight Video Library] (https://foreflight.com/support/video-library/)
[ForeFlight Mobile Pilot's Guide](https://foreflight.com/ipad/guide/pdf)

That is a meaningful input, however, it becomes irrelevant the the day the new bosses show up. Current team will have no input on future direction. Boeing likely is buying the technology and not the marketshare. I don't see Boeing as a player in serving the GA marketplace. I see them revamping and selling subscriptions to the commercial carriers. It's possible they leave the current product alone and harvest subscription revenue to offset costs. However, over time lack of GA development and cut back support will send customers to the next guy in line. I suspect Garmin views this as an opportunity to invest more in their Pilot and grab the cast offs.

Larry
 
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Congrats to the owners who had an idea, developed a business, and realized the American dream.

In my business life, I represented an independent company that sold out to a ?big boy?. I called and congratulated the founder. He was shocked. He told me he had received threats, hate mail, and was treated rudely by many. ?How dare you do this to us,?
I was the only one who congratulated him. He didn?t quite know what to say other than he was doing what he felt best for himself, his family, his employees and his company.

I will now return you to the speculators.....
 
Congrats to the owners who had an idea, developed a business, and realized the American dream.

In my business life, I represented an independent company that sold out to a “big boy”. I called and congratulated the founder. He was shocked. He told me he had received threats, hate mail, and was treated rudely by many. “How dare you do this to us,”
I was the only one who congratulated him. He didn’t quite know what to say other than he was doing what he felt best for himself, his family, his employees and his company.

I will now return you to the speculators.....

Zero replies so far indicative of the behavior he apparently endured. Comments seem focused on how this may affect the many users of this product. Is your story relevant for any reason other then trying to shame? I think most of us here understand how business works so... thanks?
 
Zero replies so far indicative of the behavior he apparently endured. Comments seem focused on how this may affect the many users of this product. Is your story relevant for any reason other then trying to shame? I think most of us here understand how business works so... thanks?

Wasn?t my intent. Sorry it was taken that way.
 
That is a meaningful input, however, it becomes irrelevant the the day the new bosses show up. Current team will have no input on future direction. Boeing likely is buying the technology and not the marketshare. I don't see Boeing as a player in serving the GA marketplace. I see them revamping and selling subscriptions to the commercial carriers. It's possible they leave the current product alone and harvest subscription revenue to offset costs. However, over time lack of GA development and cut back support will send customers to the next guy in line. I suspect Garmin views this as an opportunity to invest more in their Pilot and grab the cast offs.

Larry

If Garmin were to open Garmin Pilot up so that you could use outside hardware (Stratus, Stratux, etc.) for ADSB, GPS, and AHRS, I would imagine they would really open up the amount of people willing to change over.

That was the biggest factor for me when I was looking at EFB's. The fact that I could build my own Stratux for under $200 and have all the thing I wanted, instead of shelling out $500+ just in hardware. I would have gone with Garmin Pilot otherwise.
 
Congrats to the ForeFlight founders

Good for the founders. Unfortunately they won?t have any say so on what happens to that great product and it will die.
 
Good for the founders. Unfortunately they won?t have any say so on what happens to that great product and it will die.

Well, again speculation. We don?t know the details of the acquisition nor is Boeing obligated to say. The small companies I have been involved with that have been acquired typically keep past owners involved with earn out incentives.
However, history is on your side and you may be right. We shall see.
 
Seattle Avionics is offering $100 off the first year subscription to anyone who "upgrades" from Foreflight to FlyQ, they are smelling blood in the water.
 

Regarding the SA blog post and the comment that there has been no innovation from Jepp since the Boeing purchase. That just isn't so. How do I know? Jepp sent a bunch of their software engineers (post Boeing purchase) to our company to meet with our flight crews and learn how we used Mobile FD out in the real world. They had beta versions of proposed software that we played with and provided feedback. They asked a ton of questions, shot video of how the crews interacted with the beta software etc etc etc. Lots of the stuff we saw made it in to later updates of Mobile FD. Don't misunderstand me, I think Boeing has some room to improve their customer service but to categorically state this will be the end of Foreflight for lack of innovation is a bit of an overstatement.
 
I will continue to use Foreflight unless I see changes in the product I don?t like, out of line pricing, or poor service.
I am not impressed in SA?s self serving Blog intended to cast doubt, or their offer, intended to take advantage of a situation that hasn?t even happened. But that?s just me. If something does happen, I won?t look to SA for a solution.

Boeing is my States largest employer. An American owned and operated company, and hasn?t done a thing to Foreflight yet. Who knows, they might make it all better, cheaper, and faster. That guess is as good as anybody else?s.

Let?s see how it plays out before we bury Foreflight.
 
With the SkyView in my RV, I have found no reason to purchase Foreflight.

What am I missing?

That and I simply don't trust my life on PC's, be they Windows or Apple based. I deal with them in my day job and have never seen that I would want in the cockpit with me.
 
With the SkyView in my RV, I have found no reason to purchase Foreflight.

What am I missing?

That and I simply don't trust my life on PC's, be they Windows or Apple based. I deal with them in my day job and have never seen that I would want in the cockpit with me.

It?s a great preflight tool and gives me a secondary display in flight. I under utilize it I am sure.
 
Ohhh noooo. Crud! This sucks. Yup, Boeing will absolutely steam roll Foreflight and ruin it. This is horrible news. Such an amazing development that has helped us GA guys. Thanks corporate America. One more amazing life achievement down the drain. Sucks. This tool has been a God send for me and others. Way to go Foreflight...shame on you for allowing this. Good luck Boeing...go ahead and ruin it. Your'e just going to add more cost to GA pilots and further the saddening decline of aviators. Sad. :(
 
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With the SkyView in my RV, I have found no reason to purchase Foreflight.

What am I missing?

That and I simply don't trust my life on PC's, be they Windows or Apple based. I deal with them in my day job and have never seen that I would want in the cockpit with me.

It’s a fantastic IFR tool. I have Garmin touch, coupled GTN650 and autopilot....and foreflight is always running when I’m IFR. I file and brief on foreflight as well. It’s pretty handy.
 
Maybe..

Just maybe Boeing will make Foreflight as good as their jets! Lets wait and see if all this moaning and whinning is justified.
I never flew a bad Boeing.
 
Ya’ know, it is extremely fashionable to bash “the huge coorporate giants” of any industry...but wait, Van’s is so much bigger than all the rest of the kit companies that they are our Boeing and Airbus combined...so shouldn’t we be worried about what they are doing to the kit industry.....? Perspective.

I’m with JonJay - nothing has happened to ForeFlight yet, I’ll keep an eye on it, and keep using it until something bad DOES happen to it. If Boeing is goign to destroy it, then nothing anyone says here will stop it - and if they don’t then predictions of doom aren’t accurate.
 
Vans is in the business of making homebuilt kit airplanes for general aviation pilots. Boeing is not in the business of general aviation, and there are examples of products becoming less useful to GA once acquired by them. It's not bashing a corporate giant to acknowledge developing and innovating features for GA pilots is probably not going to be a major focus for them. It's even easier to understand if you've worked for them or been a supplier to them.
 
I don't get the attachment to FF pilots have. FF has a lot of features most people don't use, and I'm in that camp. For $20 a year with the CFI discount I get all I need with FlyQ. WingX is free for CFI's but its got some clunkiness to the UI. Avare is free and open-source and will run on a $50 Amazon fire tablet.

The problem with Garmin Pilot as others have mentioned is it only works with Garmin ADS-B products.
 
I looked at WingX a couple of years ago and stayed with FF. Just looked at it again, and it has improved a lot (or I have slowed down), but it is definitely a contender if FF heads south. In fact, as I look it over up to the renewal date, I could see just switching over to it.
 
I give little consideration to the SA blog, coming from a company with such an awful piece of software as Data Manager.

Further, if predictions of Foreflight's doom ever do come true, I'll save money and switch to Fltplan Go. I used this last summer mostly because it includes Canadian charts, but it's a real competitor to Foreflight in my opinion. And completely free...

(I am not affiliated)
 
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I think about where Jeppesen was in the early 90?s with their Jeppview product and where it is now under the ?Boeing? umbrella and I don?t see a negative.

It kept growing and improving. Yes, with Jeppesen being bought out the small company feel went away, but the employee?s stayed true to the product...or as much as one can with big company issues.

I?ll stay optimistic and look at the other positive things that have to result from this. E.G. - Garmin will have to work closer with them since Jeppesen is used in their hardware, ROCKWELL COLLINS has to step up their game now that they have an ?app? but no meat behind it like Jeppview/FF.

I think this will shift gears into making another forward step for us all in all the products we use.

I have 2 subscriptions to FF, one GA and one Business.
 
I'm not worried at all about Foreflight; the EFB market has become very competitive and there are plenty of good alternatives. I've had FF for years but I'm not sure its head and shoulders above the competition like it once was.

I'm more curious about why Boeing would want to own Foreflight? Surely its a flyspeck compared to the size of their core business. Perhaps they are looking at ways to better integrate EFB technology with their existing products? If so this could indeed lead to some interesting innovations (although not primarily focused on GA).
 
Alan, Yes, there is a ton a money to make in the international flying market. Boeing?s ?Jeppesen International Service/Handling? - Billions.

FF has a wide net of services business?s they purchased over the years regarding flight planning in the international arena?s.

I think they see major growth and the opportunity to gain market share.

But, there are a lot of players...
 
Don't forget that Boeing acquired Jeppesen a few years back. Jeppesen has had their own EFB for a while now, Jepp FD and now Jepp FD Pro X, we use the former at my professional flying job for all of our electronic chart needs.

The Pro X version has been limited to the 121 world so far. Maybe just maybe this will be a good thing as Boeing will bring all three products under one and create a really great EFB that can be customized for GA 91 ops, 135/121 CONUS ops and 121 International ops.

That's my hope at least. Jepp FD could benefit from some of the nice features that FF has to offer.

Also the recent acquisition of Fltplan.com by Garmin was thought by many to be the end of this free and amazing flight planning app, so far so good with Garmin adding new features and usability and still keeping the free portions of the app, free.

We live in interesting times.....
 
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With the SkyView in my RV, I have found no reason to purchase Foreflight.

What am I missing?

That and I simply don't trust my life on PC's, be they Windows or Apple based. I deal with them in my day job and have never seen that I would want in the cockpit with me.

Only reason I did was for easy IFR preflight filing, but there are others.
 
Reality check; GA is not a big priortity for the "huge" aviation corporations. If you want to use their product, pay their price. :(
 
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Foreflight

Here is a repost of some remarks I put on Facebook a few minutes ago.

I am a total outsider but when a big company like Boeing buys a successful, small company like Foreflight, they start changing everything to make it like the big company. They forget that the reason the small company is successful is that it had a company culture that favored innovation, rewarding and recognizing employee contributions, etc. Over the last 20 years I have watched many very good FBO's be bought by the large chains and then service went to pot. It will be interesting to see how this purchase affects Foreflight. I think the result will be good employees leaving to go to another small company that has the culture they like.

Several years ago I was at Oshkosh and went to the Foreflight booth. I talked with Tyson Wheils, the president of Foreflight. At the time I was a corporate pilot and we used Jepp charts and Foreflight, which only had the government charts. I suggested to Tyson that they make available the Jepp charts in their product for subscribers of Jepp charts. He said they had tried to do it, but Jepp wouldn't allow it. I ask him who at Jepp would not allow it and he gave me a name. I went directly to the Jepp booth and ask for that person (I don't remember the name). I told him I thought they should work with Foreflight so that their mutual customers could use the Jepp charts within Foreflight. He said they would not do that as their product was as good than Foreflight. He said they were doing further development on it and it would better. I told him he was shooting at a moving target as Foreflight was continuing to improve their product also. As we all know, a couple of years ago Jepp allowed Foreflight to display their charts.

But my point is that large companies usually think they know best. So when they buy a smaller company, they impose their ways of doing things on the small company and it usually stifles innovation. It will be interesting to watch this the next few years.

One more comment about the press release. I worked for a company that was bought by a larger company in the late 90's. For the six months that preceded the closing of the sale, we were told one story. The day after the closing, the story completely changed. I learned from that that during a purchase, you can't believe one word the buying company says. You have to wait and see after the deal is completed.

Tyson and his team did a wonderful job developing Foreflight. Hopefully they did as good job in negotiating the sale and have restrictions in the agreement to protect the product, employees, and their customers.
 
Then...

"...That and I simply don't trust my life on PC's, be they Windows or Apple based..."

Then I hope you don't ever fly on an airliner...are you ok with a TRS-80?
 
^That. I've been quietly harping at Garmin to port their Pilot software to Windows so I can put it on my Surface Pro. I am on my fourth upgrade, but I still have the original, which is working just fine as an in-car PC after years of work. One of the others is my hangar machine, even though there is no wi-fi at the hangar, and the other is my home-office machine, which I am using right now. The new one is used for my teaching and walk-around use.

I'd really love to have Pilot to integrate with my panels, but Garmin doesn't see a market. Failing that, I'd like FF to fill the gap, but I'd even make do with the web app over a mobile device. Not disparaging the iPad, but why do I wan't a crippled tablet when I already have a fully-functional one?

Anyway, I can understand the concern about PCs, but any device can fail and there are PCs out there that are plenty robust. Heck, the Linux device that ran my Blue Mountain panel from 2006 was still running when I turned it in to Aerotronics a couple years ago to upgrade to the G3X. Not all hardware/software is highly failure-prone.
 
This will probably be less detrimental than people think. It would not be in anyone's best interest to start changing Foreflights operations. Boeing will make it it's own business unit and leverage the technologies both with their products and government EFB contracts.
 
Here is a repost of some remarks I put on Facebook a few minutes ago.

I am a total outsider but when a big company like Boeing buys a successful, small company like Foreflight, they start changing everything to make it like the big company. They forget that the reason the small company is successful is that it had a company culture that favored innovation, rewarding and recognizing employee contributions, etc. Over the last 20 years I have watched many very good FBO's be bought by the large chains and then service went to pot. It will be interesting to see how this purchase affects Foreflight. I think the result will be good employees leaving to go to another small company that has the culture they like.

Several years ago I was at Oshkosh and went to the Foreflight booth. I talked with Tyson Wheils, the president of Foreflight. At the time I was a corporate pilot and we used Jepp charts and Foreflight, which only had the government charts. I suggested to Tyson that they make available the Jepp charts in their product for subscribers of Jepp charts. He said they had tried to do it, but Jepp wouldn't allow it. I ask him who at Jepp would not allow it and he gave me a name. I went directly to the Jepp booth and ask for that person (I don't remember the name). I told him I thought they should work with Foreflight so that their mutual customers could use the Jepp charts within Foreflight. He said they would not do that as their product was as good than Foreflight. He said they were doing further development on it and it would better. I told him he was shooting at a moving target as Foreflight was continuing to improve their product also. As we all know, a couple of years ago Jepp allowed Foreflight to display their charts.

But my point is that large companies usually think they know best. So when they buy a smaller company, they impose their ways of doing things on the small company and it usually stifles innovation. It will be interesting to watch this the next few years.

One more comment about the press release. I worked for a company that was bought by a larger company in the late 90's. For the six months that preceded the closing of the sale, we were told one story. The day after the closing, the story completely changed. I learned from that that during a purchase, you can't believe one word the buying company says. You have to wait and see after the deal is completed.

Tyson and his team did a wonderful job developing Foreflight. Hopefully they did as good job in negotiating the sale and have restrictions in the agreement to protect the product, employees, and their customers.

Precisely. I am a Boeing fan when it comes to their big iron but they have no idea how to succeed and innovate in the space that Foreflight occupies and moreover, may have no interest in doing so. They may be buying FF for market share, for technology, for human capital or other reasons that have nothing to do with keeping the current customer base happy. I hope I'm wrong!
 
I see a lot of worried people about the foreflight acquisition. I can understand your worries, but in reality nothing else has changed other than ownership. I am an avid FF user and was actually first introduced to it while serving in the military. FF developed a military version just for the Air Force and we used it while flying VFR in the UH-1 helicopters in D.C. I was so impressed that I started using it in my GA flying as well. I have been an avid user since some of the first releases and have seen prices continue to rise over the years. I bring this up because several of the cost increases are due to cost being passed on to users such as chart costs. With Boeing owning the platform there is no need for them to pay for charts so this may help control some costs. Now for the rest...I am an engineering manager at Boeing and believe me this acquisition came as just as much a surprise to me. That being said I ask that you give FF a chance. I have some very sound reasons for this. Boeing is split into 3 divisions, BCA (commercial airplanes), BDS (military), and BGS (Global service). The division that purchased FF is BGS. This is Boeings newest division and was formed to provide services to the entire aviation market (just like FF does). As an engineer for Boeing I can say that there is a large demand worldwide for digital flight bags in all markets. This purchase simply propels Boeing to the front. I see the commercial version getting more robust, but I truly don't think the GA version will get negatively affected. One can hope.
 
Just ask yourself this

?Did the B company buy FF to develop it for the GA market??

You know the answer. Enough said.
 
I didn't use FF but my experience in life is big isn't always better. Especially in subjects like this. Look at the big GPS glass cockpit provider... pretty cooperate environment from most posts I read right here on VAF. With most all of their competition you can call and ask to speak to anyone and after a short hold you have them.

I've worked for the same company, and I won't say what type, I should say the same job since 1990. The first half of that time, the company was a locally run company. Always very very employee friendly and even more customer friendly. We were taken over about 15 years into my employment with them by the, (3rd largest I think), corporation in America that runs these types of business. Same as previously mentioned all talk and hype and promises in the beginning and after the first year there were definite changes and non were good for employees or customers. Everything took on a very VERY cooperate mentality and continues to the present day. Makes me sad too. I use to enjoy it but not so much anymore.

I've often wondered/worried that some big kid on the block will try to acquire the big D, my favorite in glass cockpits. Sure hope that never happens.

Regarding Boeing and FF.... as others have posted, we'll just have to wait and see.
 
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