AeroSport vs Van's / Lycoming

I had originally planned on an Aero Sport 0-320-D1A (building a 9A), but thought I would compare it to the deal Van?s / Lycoming is offering. What have I missed? Aero Sport warranty better. Attention to build maybe better at Aero Sport. Have heard great things about Bart?s after the sale support. Van?s saves you $3250 plus free shipping and free long term preservative.

Vans? / Lycoming - $21950 (-$1000 if I order a prop) = $20950
X0-320-D1A
Lycoming Cylinders
Roller Tappet Valve Train
Sky-Tech Light Weight Starter
Magnetos
Fuel Pump
Carburetor
Prop Gov Provision
Free Shipping
Free Long Term Storage
Alternator / Exhaust ? Not Included
1-4 Week Lead Time
Warranty ? 1 year (2nd year prorated), must be activated within 2 years of purchase



Aero Sport - $22,200 / $24200 (with roller cam) + shipping + long term storage treatment
0-320-D1A
ECI Cylinders
Roller Tappet Valve Train (+$2000)
Light Weight Starter
Slick Magnetos
Fuel Pump
Carburetor
Shipping (+$)
Long Term Storage (+$)
Alternator / Exhaust ? Not Included
Warranty - 3 years parts and labor (starts at first flight)

Alan Jackson
Hartselle, AL

When buying from Lycoming you get what Lyc want to sell you, its just the next engine off the line.

Buying from Bart you get exactly what you want. Bart understands exactly what homebuilders require and will do anything that you want him to, he will also tell you if he thinks you're being dumb in your choices.

I think Bart gives a great service, but is it worth $3K+ more? Difficult to quantify. The price for a new Lyc from Van's has certainly fallen considerably in the last few months.

Pete

Aerosport

I'm sure you get what you pay for....that said, Bart has to buy all his parts from U.S. vendors with a canadian dollar worth 80 cents, pay shipping, brokerage fees, etc.
Then put his labour into it, and ship it back to you.
Not easy to do and keep costs low, and quality high.
(I think almost every RV in the pacific northwest was aerosport powered in recent years, when the canadian buck was at 60 cents!)

I think the VAN's Lycoming OEM engines are the least expensive option.

Then you have the various builders like Aerosport, Barrett, Mattituck, Penn Yann, etc, etc. All have good reputations for support.

Then there is now Lycoming Thunderbolts. Jeff Schanns just presented at our local chapter meeting. It looks like he has a good offering that is competitive will all but the OEM offering. What still doesn't make sense to me is that this Lycoming product steals market share from their own dealers. It's going to be difficult for some of the independents to compete.

I think you'll get a great product from any of them. The only real differences I've been able to find is how warranty is handled and the responsiveness of support.

I share my personal bias, in that Rhonda and Alan at Barrett (BPE) had been great over the last year answering all my dumb questions. Rhonda even got my wife onboard with the engine purchase. That wasn't easy to do.

Aero Sport Power

I have two engines from Aero Sport Power. Bart's knowledge and warranty support are worth it for me. I am already sending back my slick mag because of the SB, well over a year after I bought my engine and before first start.

After I talked with the folks at the Lycoming booth during Oshkosh the decision was very easy for me.

Paul

When I bought my engine a Lycoming through Van's was slightly cheaper than the Mattituck engine I bought. I went with Mattituck because of their fantastic support and haven't regretted it. I can email Mahlon with a question and will often get an immediate response via phone or email--even on a weekend.

I don't have any actual information, but I would guess that Van's doesn't actually support the engines they sell and that Lycoming would be far less responsive than Mattituck or Aerosport power.

Obviously, this is just an opinion.

Guy

I think Bart gives a great service, but is it worth $3K+ more?

Click to expand...

Based on experiences from two local builders who had problems (not due to any fault of Bart's), and the incredible support they got from Aerosport, I would say yes, it is worth 3k more.

My own experiences have been good so far. He's answered all my (naive) questions, helped me select an engine based on a long phone conversation, and when I damaged my starter (terminal connector) Sue from Aerosport made the arrangements for me to get it sent back to SkyTec, where they repaired it free of charge.

I am Canadian, and was very lucky to get my Engine from Bart last year when our dollar was 97 cents US. Saved me a fortune! I also opted for an Overhauled O-320... from what I'd been told a quality overhaul from Aerosport will be virtually as good as a new engine (and several K cheaper).

Roller Tappets?

N316RV said:

I had originally planned on an Aero Sport 0-320-D1A (building a 9A), but thought I would compare it to the deal Van?s / Lycoming is offering. What have I missed? Aero Sport warranty better. Attention to build maybe better at Aero Sport. Have heard great things about Bart?s after the sale support. Van?s saves you $3250 plus free shipping and free long term preservative.

Vans? / Lycoming - $21950 (-$1000 if I order a prop) = $20950
X0-320-D1A
Lycoming Cylinders
Roller Tappet Valve Train
Sky-Tech Light Weight Starter
Magnetos
Fuel Pump
Carburetor
Prop Gov Provision
Free Shipping
Free Long Term Storage
Alternator / Exhaust ? Not Included
1-4 Week Lead Time
Warranty ? 1 year (2nd year prorated), must be activated within 2 years of purchase



Aero Sport - $22,200 / $24200 (with roller cam) + shipping + long term storage treatment
0-320-D1A
ECI Cylinders
Roller Tappet Valve Train (+$2000)
Light Weight Starter
Slick Magnetos
Fuel Pump
Carburetor
Shipping (+$)
Long Term Storage (+$)
Alternator / Exhaust ? Not Included
Warranty - 3 years parts and labor (starts at first flight)

Alan Jackson
Hartselle, AL

Click to expand...

From what I understand, and I may be wrong, but Lycoming is the ONLY supplier of Roller Tappet parts now.....and their parts are not the same as the Superior parts were for roller tappets. Lycoming roller tappets need newly designed cases for their install, not just cam and lifter parts.
So Bart is most likely having to buy his parts from Lycoming, which would now include cases and cam/lifters, which surely is driving the costs up.
This may give Lycoming a leg up when competing for the roller tappet business.

All new lycoming parts are roller tappet, so unless you are getting an engine overhauled by Bart, he's using their parts anyway. Lycoming has a little monopoly right now. Anyone know what is happening with Superior? Last I heard the Government said NO to the lycoming aquisition...

No bad choices here.

I went with a rebuilt engine from Aerosport power, and opted for some modifications. If the stock Lycoming configuration is exactly what you want, it's an appealing choice. No matter what, you'd never regret doing business with Bart and Sue.

Give Aero Sport a call

I strongly suggest you talk to Bart or Sue before you make your decision. As has been suggested by other vendors, the prices on a web site are not the whole story.

I'm also considering both options...

I'll probably go for the Aerosport option. Since they are in BC and I'm in Quebec(canada), I only have to pay 1 tax (saves me 7.5%, the provincial sales tax), that's $1500 on a $20K engine. If I buy an engine from the US, it has to go by customs and they will charge me both taxes...

I contacted them 3 or 4 times already and support is TOP.

British Colombia is far from "local" for me, I'm on the other side of the continent but it's easier for us, canadians, to deal with a canadian company.

Time will tell, I'll probably buy my engine is 3-4 years and things might change... but so far, Aerosport customer service was excellent.

llavalle said:

I'm also considering both options...

I'll probably go for the Aerosport option. Since they are in BC and I'm in Quebec(canada), I only have to pay 1 tax (saves me 7.5%, the provincial sales tax), that's $1500 on a $20K engine. If I buy an engine from the US, it has to go by customs and they will charge me both taxes...

Click to expand...

Whatever happened to NAFTA? Is "free-trade" just a one way street?


Do you guys in the states have to pay extra taxes when buying from Aerosport over Lyc, Barret, Mattituck or Superior in the past?

briand said:

Whatever happened to NAFTA? Is "free-trade" just a one way street?

Do you guys in the states have to pay extra taxes when buying from Aerosport over Lyc, Barret, Mattituck or Superior in the past?

Click to expand...

NAFTA removes the Customs tax(i.e. 16% on all items imported, to promote local buying). We still have to pay the local taxes that are applied to ANY items here (except food).

i.e.
I buy a computer locally for $1000 CAD here in Quebec. I'll have to pay 5% of federal tax (GST) and another 7.5% of provincial tax of Quebec(PST). Total : $1128.75

I buy a computer online for $800 US. That's around $1000 CAD. When it gets across the border, the customs broker will charge a fee (5$ for Canada Post/USPS, $40-$50 for UPS/FedEX). They will then submit the package for custom clearance. They, the customs, will then evaluate the CURRENT CAD value of the amount specified on the package in US dollars. They will then add both taxes and I have to pay the bills. Most of the time, the computer is cheaper and even with shipping and the 5$ fee, it's cheaper.

It gets weird when the exchange rate changes a lot. I can pay $900 CAD for a $800 US item because the day they charged me on my credit card, the exchange rate was good. When it gets to the customs' office, 2-3 weeks later, I'll still pay taxes on $800 US but that $800 might be $1000 or $1100 CAD... I'm overpaying for the taxes, and it's kind of bad... but it sometimes goes the other way.

There is only one loophole in the whole thing : if a seller from another province sells me something, they can't change me their local provincial tax because I'm not supposed to pay that, and since they don't have a Quebec Sale's taxe registration, they can't change me my province tax. That why I only get to pay the federal tax if I order from Aerosport (I don't pay the BC tax, nor the Quebec tax).

Guys in the state won't pay thoses taxes but they will still have to pay for the brokerage fee.

Sorry for the thread slipping but I think it should be clear for Canadian & US buyers. Buying from Canada frees me from the hassle of having to wait for brokerage & customs clearance. I also pay the taxes and shipping directly on the invoice --> I know exactly how much I'm going to pay.

And by the way, Aerosport will accept payment in both US Dollars and Canadian Dollars.

Be aware! Some of the provinces will send you a notice asking for their pound of flesh once the aircraft is registered with Transport Canada. It will probably show up in the mail after about six months from when you get your final C of A. Then you will have to prove to them that you have paid all of the PST while you were building the plane. If you cheap out on the value they will come a knocking at your door.