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Wannabe -10 builder

W

WannFly

Member
Hello everyone, my name is Priyo and i am based out of Fargo, ND. I own and fly a PA-28-181 out of KFAR. In next 3 years or so i would need a cross country traveling machine and getting excited about RV-10 and building it. While i know a lot of people who have traveled all over US in an Archer II, i think i could use some speed and i absolutely love shinny new stuff (interior, avionics etc). If i had unlimited funds, i would buy a SR-22 yesterday, but the reality is I dont.

Just kicking the tires right now since i have no idea if i even have the skill to take on a project this big, but i plan on ordering the Toolbox and one of the control surface project from Vans and see what this riveting is all about and if i am able to do a decent job of doing it.

I am little handy, but never done work with Al or fiberglass. i used to do wiring and building computers for a living many moons ago, so avionics shouldn't be a huge deal. i might look at hiring an A&P to do some of the firewall forward work.

Anyway, just wanted to stop by and say hi and provide an early warning that there is a plethora of dump questions coming shortly.... I have never flown anything other than a 172 and my Archer, but getting a ride in a 7A is not too far away...

any tips on where to even start? this project seems insurmountable to me right now, but i am patient, i have time and perseverance is my middle name (with a lot of four letter words that comes with the territory)

I have been reading forums and watching build videos, i am getting excited and apprehensive at the same time :p
 
Welcome to VAF

WannFly said:
Hello everyone, my name is Priyo
Click to expand...

Priyo, welcome aboard the good ship VAF.

The 10 is a wonderful plane, loves to go high and fast.

Your best bet is to try finding someone actually building a 10, in a reasonable travel distance and go see what things are all about.

Try the White Pages, on the VAF home page.
 
Mike S said:
Priyo, welcome aboard the good ship VAF.

The 10 is a wonderful plane, loves to go high and fast.

Your best bet is to try finding someone actually building a 10, in a reasonable travel distance and go see what things are all about.

Try the White Pages, on the VAF home page.
Click to expand...
Thanks Mike, i will give that a shot
 
Here is a very complete builders log. I was an experienced builder so your time, and number of reordered parts will be higher. Mine was slow build fueselage and quick wings.

Suggest doing some builders workshops on metal, fiberglass (there is a lot on the -10), and electrical. Find your EAA chapter and it should have some very helpful people. This forum is a very good source, The Vans kit is excellent and any issues have been ironed out a long time ago.

It is a big commitment of time and money, but the result is better than any other four seater plus you are your own mechanic and A&P which is worth a whole bunch of money in the future.

http://www.mykitlog.com/users/index.php?user=diablouser&project=2128
 
My standard advice: try the toolbox kit, maybe even the tail kit. If you enjoy the work, great. I and many others found it rewarding. But if you find that's it's actually unenjoyable work, stop. Life is too short to force yourself into years of unhappiness. Buy a used -10 instead.
Also, be sure you understand the EAB (experimental amateur built) rules. There is only a limited amount of work that you may hire out, especially if you go the "quick build" route.
 
WannFly said:
In next 3 years or so i would need a cross country traveling machine
Click to expand...

BTW, if the above quote implies that you need regular, scheduled travel (work?), then you should definitely plan on getting an instrument rating. And have an airline alternative available. And have some flexibility.
 
Hi Priyo,

I was in your situation too--I own a PA-28-161, and while it actually has more useful load than at least one -181 I have seen (no kidding! --some are loaded up with so many extras as to eat up all the added gross weight), it is not the cross country machine I eventually want. I travel frequently around the East to visit family, and less frequently for business. The RV-10 seemed to me the best option versus the competing certified aircraft in terms of flexibility and performance. The speed will eat up the miles, and the carrying capacity will make for some fun trips with friends and family. I love building things, and since I already owned the Warrior, I figured I would give building a go.

Get the toolbox kit, and get the airfoil kit. I recommend signing up for the EAA's weekend seminar on building Van's kit aircraft. It only costs less than $400, which is nothing compared to what you will spend on building an RV-10. I consider it money well spent; the work that I did in the class convinced me that I was capable of doing the sheet metal work, which was my major concern.

When you do the airfoil kit (they give you one and you build it in the EAA seminar), pay close attention to deburring ribs, because you will be doing an enormous amount of that. If you can keep your focus on quality and not get bored out of your skull doing those ribs, it seems to me the rest of the build will be interesting and rewarding.

If you don't decide that building is for you, there's no shame there, and there are some RV-10s out there for sale occasionally--at a hefty premium over what you will spend building one.

Also give thought to the builder assist programs out there; while I'm building mine by myself with only help from friends, there are pros out there that can help you get through the build process.

If you have a local EAA chapter, consider joining it! I have found a ton of support in my local chapter from folks who have built and are building RVs, and plenty of other aircraft types. The support you'll find from a group of like minded local builders is indispensable.
 
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Welcome to the world of Van's aircraft and the RV-10 Priyo.


I agree with the recommendations above that you try to get enrolled in an EAA SportAir workshop. I took both the building a Van's aircraft and the sheet metal workshop, and they are almost identical, so pick which ever is most convenient for you in location and timing.

I also took the EAA workshop on fiberglass, but didn't find it very helpful for building the RV-10. EAA is now offering a fiberglass workshop specifically focused on the RV aircraft, but they only seem to be offering it in Oshkosh. But it might be worth attending if you decide you like building with the sheet metal workshop.


Another way to get a great start on building is with the Synergy Air empennage class. In their class you actually build your empennage with the advice and oversite of one of the Synergy Air A&Ps who are experts on the subject. For the RV-10 it is an 8 day class, and I found it extremely helpful and highly recommend it. But I would suggest you start with the EAA sheet metal or RV workshop first, as it is a lot cheaper and I found that workshop helped prepare me to make the most of the Synergy Air class.

Best of luck with your project.
 
Hit up Derek (dbro172) and ask him for a ride in his RV-9A. :D
He put that airplane together in less time than you would expect.
The sooner you start, the sooner you finish!
 
bruceh said:
Hit up Derek (dbro172) and ask him for a ride in his RV-9A. :D
He put that airplane together in less time than you would expect.
The sooner you start, the sooner you finish!
Click to expand...

That?s right, looks like you?re right here in my backyard. My -9A is at KJKJ. I have all the build tools and a completed -8 empennage at home. I could definitely take you for a ride and help you get started.

Call or text 701 2one2 3947
 
BobTurner said:
BTW, if the above quote implies that you need regular, scheduled travel (work?), then you should definitely plan on getting an instrument rating. And have an airline alternative available. And have some flexibility.
Click to expand...

its not for work, mostly pleasure with ton of flexibility in dates. working on IR right now (fairly slow progress since i want to do mostly in actual and icing is putting a dent in my plan)
 
1001001 said:
Hi Priyo,

I was in your situation too--I own a PA-28-161, and while it actually has more useful load than at least one -181 I have seen (no kidding! --some are loaded up with so many extras as to eat up all the added gross weight), it is not the cross country machine I eventually want. I travel frequently around the East to visit family, and less frequently for business. The RV-10 seemed to me the best option versus the competing certified aircraft in terms of flexibility and performance. The speed will eat up the miles, and the carrying capacity will make for some fun trips with friends and family. I love building things, and since I already owned the Warrior, I figured I would give building a go.

Get the toolbox kit, and get the airfoil kit. I recommend signing up for the EAA's weekend seminar on building Van's kit aircraft. It only costs less than $400, which is nothing compared to what you will spend on building an RV-10. I consider it money well spent; the work that I did in the class convinced me that I was capable of doing the sheet metal work, which was my major concern.

When you do the airfoil kit (they give you one and you build it in the EAA seminar), pay close attention to deburring ribs, because you will be doing an enormous amount of that. If you can keep your focus on quality and not get bored out of your skull doing those ribs, it seems to me the rest of the build will be interesting and rewarding.

If you don't decide that building is for you, there's no shame there, and there are some RV-10s out there for sale occasionally--at a hefty premium over what you will spend building one.

Also give thought to the builder assist programs out there; while I'm building mine by myself with only help from friends, there are pros out there that can help you get through the build process.

If you have a local EAA chapter, consider joining it! I have found a ton of support in my local chapter from folks who have built and are building RVs, and plenty of other aircraft types. The support you'll find from a group of like minded local builders is indispensable.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip. I was going thru the builder assist program today and it is definitely a great choice, unfortunately nothing around where i live :(. i am joining the local EAA chapter soon and find out about the weekend class that you mentioned.
 
Dbro172 said:
That?s right, looks like you?re right here in my backyard. My -9A is at KJKJ. I have all the build tools and a completed -8 empennage at home. I could definitely take you for a ride and help you get started.

Call or text 701 2one2 3947
Click to expand...

WOW talk about small world, thats where my A&P and my avoinics guy is.. you know who I am referring to and thats where i am planning to get a hangar when i get close to moving out of the garage.... i will text you tomorrow and see if you are around this weekend.... depending on the WX, i havent seen a flyable weather in about 2 weeks, apart form today when i was working :(
 
BobTurner said:
My standard advice: try the toolbox kit, maybe even the tail kit. If you enjoy the work, great. I and many others found it rewarding. But if you find that's it's actually unenjoyable work, stop. Life is too short to force yourself into years of unhappiness. Buy a used -10 instead.
Also, be sure you understand the EAB (experimental amateur built) rules. There is only a limited amount of work that you may hire out, especially if you go the "quick build" route.
Click to expand...

I havent decided on the QB yet, but good to know that there is a limit on how much pro help i can get. i know about the 51% rule, but time to dig into some FARs... man last time i read those was before my checkride (i will duck for cover now :))
 
Thanks Bruce and everyone else who has replied on this thread. cant figure out how to post in my own thread without a direct reply to a person, but just wanted to reach out and say thanks. I had heard that RV community is one of the best tight nit community out there and i am finding that out first hand :)

Edit: i might have figured out how...
 
1001001 said:
Hi Priyo,

I was in your situation too--I own a PA-28-161, and while it actually has more useful load than at least one -181 I have seen (no kidding! --some are loaded up with so many extras as to eat up all the added gross weight), it is not the cross country machine I eventually want. I travel frequently around the East to visit family, and less frequently for business. The RV-10 seemed to me the best option versus the competing certified aircraft in terms of flexibility and performance. The speed will eat up the miles, and the carrying capacity will make for some fun trips with friends and family. I love building things, and since I already owned the Warrior, I figured I would give building a go.

Get the toolbox kit, and get the airfoil kit. I recommend signing up for the EAA's weekend seminar on building Van's kit aircraft. It only costs less than $400, which is nothing compared to what you will spend on building an RV-10. I consider it money well spent; the work that I did in the class convinced me that I was capable of doing the sheet metal work, which was my major concern.

When you do the airfoil kit (they give you one and you build it in the EAA seminar), pay close attention to deburring ribs, because you will be doing an enormous amount of that. If you can keep your focus on quality and not get bored out of your skull doing those ribs, it seems to me the rest of the build will be interesting and rewarding.

If you don't decide that building is for you, there's no shame there, and there are some RV-10s out there for sale occasionally--at a hefty premium over what you will spend building one.

Also give thought to the builder assist programs out there; while I'm building mine by myself with only help from friends, there are pros out there that can help you get through the build process.

If you have a local EAA chapter, consider joining it! I have found a ton of support in my local chapter from folks who have built and are building RVs, and plenty of other aircraft types. The support you'll find from a group of like minded local builders is indispensable.
Click to expand...

since you are coming from a PA family, you might have a better perspective than others... how did the transition feel? i am fairly low time pilot, about 260 hrs, but i do fly regularly. these hours are exactly over 2 year period, my first training flight was on Nov 10, 2016 (and i didnt know what the heck i was doing, still dont at times :p). from what i read, a -10's climb speed is what i cruise at and it also climbs at 1500 fpm or more when not at max gross, that sounds like a rocket ship to me. i have also heard that a -10 is slippery, which is little concerning and i definitely dont want to fall behind the plane. from what i read, the pattern entry speed is 90, then 80 base and 70 final which is at par with what i do, but honestly i am little concerned with the slipperiness of -10 with its short wing. its also a lot of sky while flying from what i can gather that i have never seen from a cramped 181 cockpit. my useful load is 960 so 660 with full fuel and in summer with my fat arse in it i see about 350 FPM climb at times on a bad day and about 500 on a good day. winter here is awesome in the sense i can finally see 1000 fpm climb and that puts a grin in my face
 
Not slippery

Do not fret the handling of the -10. It is very capable and has great handling qualities. Yes it is a step above the PA series but with proper training and checkout, it is a pleasure to fly. The combination of stability, high climb rates, excellent range and docile slow speed handling, you will love it.
 
WannFly said:
Thanks for the tip. I was going thru the builder assist program today and it is definitely a great choice, unfortunately nothing around where i live :(. i am joining the local EAA chapter soon and find out about the weekend class that you mentioned.
Click to expand...

You can find out more about the EAA SportAir workshops here: https://www.eaa.org/eaa/aircraft-building/eaa-sportair-workshops

BTW, I think EAA still offers a complimentary 6-month membership to attendees of the SportAir workshop who are not already members.
 
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WannFly said:
since you are coming from a PA family, you might have a better perspective than others... how did the transition feel? i am fairly low time pilot, about 260 hrs, but i do fly regularly. these hours are exactly over 2 year period, my first training flight was on Nov 10, 2016 (and i didnt know what the heck i was doing, still dont at times :p). from what i read, a -10's climb speed is what i cruise at and it also climbs at 1500 fpm or more when not at max gross, that sounds like a rocket ship to me. i have also heard that a -10 is slippery, which is little concerning and i definitely dont want to fall behind the plane. from what i read, the pattern entry speed is 90, then 80 base and 70 final which is at par with what i do, but honestly i am little concerned with the slipperiness of -10 with its short wing. its also a lot of sky while flying from what i can gather that i have never seen from a cramped 181 cockpit. my useful load is 960 so 660 with full fuel and in summer with my fat arse in it i see about 350 FPM climb at times on a bad day and about 500 on a good day. winter here is awesome in the sense i can finally see 1000 fpm climb and that puts a grin in my face
Click to expand...

I'll be honest, I haven't even piloted an RV-10 yet! I can't imagine it's too much different than any other high performance single, but thinking ahead -- well ahead -- is going to be required at these speeds and power levels. As I understand it, it is a bit easier to slow a -10 down than some other slick high performance singles because of the flap configuration, but I'll leave that discussion to the people who have experienced it!
 
Welcome Priyo

My experience so far building my RV-10, which is my first airplane project and all (very) slow built, is that it is certainly doable, even for a novice. You certainly won't be a novice for long, especially if you get some training first, join your local EAA chapter, and get help where you can. The SportAir Workshops are very helpful, in my opinion. I have flown in several RV models and the 10 is definitely the "family trickster" of them all, but still responsive and fun to fly. Much more fun than the POS Cessnas I've been renting on occasion.
 
I am missing the like button on this forum, but thanks all for chiming in. I am looking at enrolling at the EAA class (VAN'S RV Assembly) end of Jan in MD
 
3 years?

In the next three years, you will be building not flying.
If you start a RV10. Consider buying a RV to fly while you build.
I just waited 8 months, after ordering, to receive a RV10 QB kit. The wings were damaged and had to go back to Vans.
 
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