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AOG - Block Island, RI

rcarsey

Well Known Member
Seems me and my CFI are stuck on the island for at least tonight. The #2 fuel pump is dead.. not even the light on the switch is illuminated. Any ideas? (Other than flying with one pump)
 
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Either would be a PIA, but maybe do some substitutional trouble shooting and swap the switches or the power connectors at the pumps to see if the problem stays with the pump or moves. Would help zero in on the issue.
 
I don't think there is any power/signal and/or ground getting to the switch. But because of the way the LED lightbulb in the switch is wired in, I believe it's the ground that isn't grounded. That is the only common wire shared between both the switch and the bulb. I think the power circuit from the fuse box to the pump is OK though.

I think the quick fix to get home is to find the power leads to the "broken" pump behind the center channel. Cut them. and tie them into the Red & Black terminals that are located back there. There are fusing issues with this though.
 
Rob, it looks like wire #6267 is the one common to both the LED and pump power. See attached from the schematic. Could be a bad connection at pin #7 on the HIC connector.
 

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I would bridge a wire from the Pitot heat, landing lights or similar sized (10 amps) source and wire directly to the pump via it's pigtail or pull the supply side wire from the pump switch and bridge there. You can buy some small wire nuts and cutter/stripper at the hardware store to do this. You can put it all back together properly back home after troubleshooting.

Larry
 
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The 8-pin connector in Bob Y's last image was the culprit. Although the connector was fully seated and latched, there seemed to be some play in it and lightly touching the wires/connectors would make some of the pins disconnect from the socket in the HIC module. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09ZESkYkpEM

This is particularly alarming because this 8-pin connector is a "jesus bolt". If it is disconnected, or in this case, loose, there is the potential for both fuel pumps to turn off. I've contacted support this morning because I think this might be a safety/design issue.

I'm not sure why it is loose -- could be the plug, socket, pins, or maybe some tension/stress from the wires pulling on the plug, etc.

I've also looked at a few past flights in the Garmin Logbook and charted the Fuel PSI on some randomly picked flights. Apparently this issue has been occurring intermittently since at least Oshkosh 2021. The indication is that the fuel psi would drop about 2 psi instantly and return some minutes later.. which I wouldn't notice in flight. (ie. 46 psi vs 44 psi)

The plan is to replace the ES-60009 HIC module with a ES-60009-1 HIC module (apparently it has a skirt to prevent things from getting underneath the pcb). I'm going to extend the wires with 12&14ga tefzel, solder sleeves -- enough to help avoid the abrupt bend in the wires. Put a new molex connector on and use the TPA (Terminal Position assurance) inserts which help prevent the pins from moving around inside the connector. Depending on how secure/flopping around the wires are, I may secure them further with an adel clamp somewhere.
 
I have looked at the 12iS, and especially the fuel plumbing behind the rear baggage bulkhead, wondering how an old man like me would service something like that.

I guess I’ll be happy with my legacy 12 knowing the spare Bing carb floats and tools I carry with me can save the day and get me home…
 
I have had exactly the same problem. It was pin number 8 i the Molex connector ES-60012. Fuel Pump 2 GND.
It was melted in the tip due to poor connection. See first picture.

It happend once when flying and I troubleshooted and found when I pushed the connector slightly to one side the connection was reestablished and when I let go of the connector, there was no connection in the Molex connector.
I then unplugged and plugged the connector a few times and all seemed to work, but a few flighthours later pump nr. 2 stopped again.

Now I did not trust the Molex connector any more and decided to change it to an Automotive connector I knew worked. See pictures.




The 8-pin connector in Bob Y's last image was the culprit. Although the connector was fully seated and latched, there seemed to be some play in it and lightly touching the wires/connectors would make some of the pins disconnect from the socket in the HIC module. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=09ZESkYkpEM

This is particularly alarming because this 8-pin connector is a "jesus bolt". If it is disconnected, or in this case, loose, there is the potential for both fuel pumps to turn off. I've contacted support this morning because I think this might be a safety/design issue.

I'm not sure why it is loose -- could be the plug, socket, pins, or maybe some tension/stress from the wires pulling on the plug, etc.

I've also looked at a few past flights in the Garmin Logbook and charted the Fuel PSI on some randomly picked flights. Apparently this issue has been occurring intermittently since at least Oshkosh 2021. The indication is that the fuel psi would drop about 2 psi instantly and return some minutes later.. which I wouldn't notice in flight. (ie. 46 psi vs 44 psi)

The plan is to replace the ES-60009 HIC module with a ES-60009-1 HIC module (apparently it has a skirt to prevent things from getting underneath the pcb). I'm going to extend the wires with 12&14ga tefzel, solder sleeves -- enough to help avoid the abrupt bend in the wires. Put a new molex connector on and use the TPA (Terminal Position assurance) inserts which help prevent the pins from moving around inside the connector. Depending on how secure/flopping around the wires are, I may secure them further with an adel clamp somewhere.
 

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Well, don’t know how many occurrences are required to call something a pandemic, or how many countries to call it a global pandemic, but when I flew on Friday, I had the EXACT same issue - no fuel pump #2 and no green light. Diagnosed the problem today and the same root cause - poor contact at the HIC connector. Mine too was on pin #8. Wiggling the connector would cause the pump and light to operate intermittently. Noting would fail #1 pump, which was reassuring.

After disconnecting the connector from the HIC board, I removed the shell around the connector. Steinair used heat shrink around the wire bundle where it went into the connector shell to make a nice neat package. When I cut the shrink tube loose and reinstalled the connector, like magic, the pump started running. I was able to pull on #8 pin and cause intermittent misoperation. And there is discoloration on the female pin. After using a pin probe to gently push the segments of the female pin together for a tighter fit on the male pin, adding a wire tie several inches away from the connector and reinstalling without the heat shrink, I was no longer able to cause a failure by wiggling. So, the strain of the heat shrink in the outer pin is my conclusion for my failure.

And as a side note, this is the third time I’ve needed to remove the avionics bay cover since completion. I am so glad I modified the fiberglass canopy shroud to expose those otherwise hidden screws.

And yes, Scott, I will contact Support tomorrow with my findings.
 

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Apparently there have been multiple reports of this failure, as Van’s Support indicated an SB is in works to address it.
 
I can confirm that a SB is in the works. I've already performed it, which took about 1 full airport-day (that's a day where you try doing a 1 hour job and it turns into 6 hours as other builders/pilots stop by to see what you're doing).

I won't go into the details, as its still a draft.. but I felt like it was straight-forward and easy for a builder to retrofit.. and maybe adds 5-10 minutes of work for someone still in the process of building.

I tried redesigning the board myself (shown below), but given the real estate constraints (its surrounded things that can't really move.. the firewall, the ECU, the instrument panel fan), I had trouble breaking out the Pump 2 wires (pins 7&8) into its own Molex Mega Fit connector. I did fit a 6 and 2 pin Megafit connectors onto the board, but the D-Sub connector is covering up the HIC Module mounting holes.. so it won't work. Theres just not enough room.

I also wanted to replace Mega Fit with Deutsch DTP connectors (same as the fusebox's regulator connectors which can carry up to 25A). However, they are gigantic and there's definitely no way to squeeze them into the existing footprint.

Now that I see PEB's idea -- removing Mega Fit and soldering a pigtail right onto the board, along with changing the type of connector.. AND securing that connector to Van's proposed strain relief bracket.. that may be the way to go.

PEB: What connector did you use? I like the convenience of having 1 connector, but I still may want to use two connectors to eliminate a single point of failure.
 

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Now that I see PEB's idea -- removing Mega Fit and soldering a pigtail right onto the board, along with changing the type of connector.. AND securing that connector to Van's proposed strain relief bracket.. that may be the way to go.

PEB: What connector did you use? I like the convenience of having 1 connector, but I still may want to use two connectors to eliminate a single point of failure.

I used automotive connectors from an Audi. They have VW part numbers.

Female connector: 3B0 937 741

The male consist of 2 parts: 3B0 937 713 and 3B0 979 714

Female pins 2.5 mm2 square: 000 979 225 E
Male pins 2.5 mm2 square: 000 979 226 E

You can find the parts on eBay.

If you want 2 connectors you can use 191 972 714 and 1J0 972 704.
Male pins: 000 979 219 E
Female pins: 000 979 225 E
(google the part numbers to see pictures)
 

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Amazing coincidence. Yesterday I had the same experience with my fuel pump quiting (after 11 minutes). Switch light went off, and pressure dropped to 44.2. No signs of this happening in earlier flights. Great video.

AM-JKLWmmKJycY2jSYgP9dg3qzwhaROa8l4VA7KdWF7Sl9LPoXgBSrUoRrjqTHGRSK-2pqTED0t6kdELSG-dcSafrmp1i3XzMX64mYZNg9MpMffrL6LRKwK3-1c_2hkmVtWjxowvbqPNBIOD2MuWnbTnpOAj=w500-no
 
I'm unsure if I posted snapshots of my Fuel PSI vs Fuel Flow in this or other forums, but that's about what I saw. I'll post a couple below. Its normal to see a slight drop in pressure as flow goes up.. maybe about 0.5psi from idle to full-power

Unless I happened to look down and see the light out, or notice < ~45psi, there is no way to tell - no alerts, engine sound change, etc.

Now that I'm all fixed up with Van's draft Service Bulletin, I may experiment with changing the Fuel PSI warning (yellow) level in the G3X. I'm careful to document any settings change in my Avionics Logbook when I deviate from Van's standard configs.. and I suspect the exact cut-off number will vary slightly from aircraft to aircraft..or pump assembly to pump assembly.
2021-09-29 13_47_34-Window.png

2021-09-29 14_06_25-Window.png
 
Van’s eliminated the upper and lower yellow caution fuel pressure ranges in the last firmware update.
 

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