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riveting

hebertm1

I'm New Here
Hello all. I am currently in the process of building the Vans toolbox kit and I am not as ready or skilled as I thought I might be, LOL. I am desperately looking for help and/or direction. Lol. I just finished trying to rivet my two sides together to the tool box and almost every rivet head did not sit flush. i can catch my finger nail underneath almost every rivet head. I checked my dimplier and the diameter of the male end is the same as the rivet maybe .001 bigger. I think my problem might be that the dimplier I have is a hammer strike blow type of dimplier. Could this be the problem? I also used a standard 3x rivet gun. Should I drill out every rivet and try again?
 
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You may want a 2X rivet gun for 1/8” rivets. You will want to “set” the rivet by gently hitting it with the rivet hun and no bucking bar. For 1/8” rivet you may need to chase the hole with a high quality #30 drill bit.

In any regards, it takes practice. Don’t hesitate to buy a bunch of .030 aluminum and practice riveting 6”x6” squares together with a pattern of rivets.

A couple of quality YouTube videos from the A&P schools online with lists of practice is helpful.

You’ll get there, but takes some practice to work your way up to the toolbox and then an aircraft.

Also don’t be shy about asking around for the best local A&P riveter and paying him $50hr side money for a couple of lessons. It will really jumpstart the learning curve.
 
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Dimpling take two things - good dies and a whole lot of force. I use only Cleaveland dies, which do make a real difference.

If I'm using a C-frame, I place the male die on the bottom and ensure that the female die is in perfect alignment. Then I use a two-pound hammer to give the die a powerful whack. You can tell when it's right because the faces of the dies leave a faint witness mark on the skin.

If I'm not using the C-frame, I use a pneumatic squeezer. Set the dies so that they are in firm contact when the squeezer is tight, and then back off slightly, not much.

For riveting the -3 rivets, I prefer a 2x gun and between 40-50 psi. I use the same pressure for the 3x gun that I use for the -4 rivets. Lots of people use a 3x gun for -3 rivets but I expect that you'd need to reduce the air pressure for that.

Sure, go ahead and drill out the rivets and try again. It's good practice that'll come in handy on the airframe. No shame to it. However, as a general rule, we are more likely to damage the hole doing this than is good, so on the airframe, only do it when you really must.

Dave
 
You must push with the rivet gun a lot more than you press with the bucking bar. I press with the gun fairly hard, yet the bucking bar is just held there with almost no press at all. Then gently pull the trigger, let the bucking bar just bounce there, and release the trigger before you release the gun pressure. I suspect that you are pressing with the bucking bar the same amount as with the gun. That’s what’s causing the rivets to swell in the middle, instead of flush with the metal. The tricky part about the practice kits are that they are so small and hard to secure. Try putting your workbench up against a wall, so you can press the gun into the toolbox, which will be against the wall.that way you don’t find yourself wrestling with trying to secure the part while you buck. Make sense?
 
Given that riveting with a gun and bar requires two hands, there is no shortage of creativity necessary when it comes to figuring out ways to secure the workpiece while you rivet. Smaller items are good in the vice. Larger structures can be braced with blocks of wood, clamps, sandbags, exercise weights, you name it. The important in is to make sure the workpiece can resist your pushing and pulling as your setting rivets.

Follow the previous advice. Push hard with the gun and trigger only when firmly on the rivet. Bucking bar held lightly on the shop end and only enough to bring the bar back in contact with the rivet after being bounced off by the concussion of the gun.
 
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Mentor

All good advise.
I recommend finding a local Mentor and spending a few hours learning good skills.
Don't teach yourself muscle memory skills you may have to relearn.
While your there, learn how to properly drill rivets. Probably one of the most important builder skills.
 
As others have said, the C-frame dimpler takes a good wack with a heavy hammer. In the hands of an expert it produces excellent dimples. OTOH a DRDT-2 produces very good dimples even when operated by a non-expert (me). One thing you’ll quickly learn, there is no limit on the amount of money that can be spent on tools!
 
i wanted to ay thank you Mr. Larson and Mr. turner for your very much needed advice and guidance. I plan to practice more on some basic sheets of aluminum. I am learning that using the rivet gunner is a learned skill, Thank you all.
 
EAA Hints for Home Builders

All of the above advice is good. In addition to that, I found that installing 20 rivets in scrap per day, every day for 10 days was like magic in producing better results. This idea was not mine, but from one of the EAA videos.

Best of luck and don't give up!
Mike
 
And if you can make it to Airventure we teach this twice a day, every day, Monday to Sunday, at the Sheetmetal 101 workshop. Forums Plaza Bldg 12. Free with the price of admission.

While I'm on the subject, we are always looking for volunteers to help out during the work session. Stop by the workshop or Builders Education Center if interested. You could get a free lunch.
 
Welcome

i wanted to ay thank you Mr. Larson and Mr. turner for your very much needed advice and guidance. I plan to practice more on some basic sheets of aluminum. I am learning that using the rivet gunner is a learned skill, Thank you all.

You arre most welcome. If you ever visit CO, I take pride in helping. Feel free to visit.
 
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