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Good Advice to All RV-12 Drivers

MartySantic

MartySantic

Well Known Member
Just fly the airplane!! If not latched, the canopy on the RV-12 will rise about 2-3" and float there as soon as you are ready to rotate. Yep, a lot of wind and noise. It will not close until you land, but you have to FLY THE AIRPLANE and NOT get distracted. When on the numbers, before take-off, I now say out loud........Trim, flaps, canopy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjMum0mTLp0&feature=youtu.be&ytsession=Ls9h4QDv0Zl3ZV0Fp1keb5AqtYm9KsDTNziYveyub8H2UyfhC-W3ZXoZNxO8NALwgRqllV8qlq_dMy-HC8BWWMjaelc3VRNJEFft6s5H2ffGNxayvvN79HS_q6crLfPQftPfk-Z0EaxdeBY0pYXUKSsIiTfoxxzIGCL4XzE5nzv7EPnBQrJcrX4kyX69iTmcZ0RSSsqBNgkZdwGBfOXgNoxlxJbcNeScsj1M9T6SNCc
 
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Having experienced this 2 times, I found that if I slow down to about 50 knots, I was able to latch it. But, for most, it is probably still best to land and deal with it. It behaves just as Marty says. And yes, "Canopy latched" is part of every checklist.
 
I used to forget the door latch in my Cherokee, first time I was terrified! I am wondering if it would not be a good idea for us to take off on purpose with it unlatched once, so we would be accustomed to the noise and breeze?
 
Hey now, I like that idea (take off with the canopy intentionally unlatched to get used to the mayhem). My only concern would be whether or not an unlatched canopy might impose greater stresses on the pivot bolts, anchor hardware, and canopy frame.

Anyone?
 
I wouldn't recommend taking off unlatched as an intentional test. While I don't think it would be a problem there is no point in creating a self-inflicted incident. In the worst case you get hurt if it causes an accident, and in the best accident scenario you end up explaining why it seemed like a good idea at the time.
 
RFSchaller said:
I wouldn't recommend taking off unlatched as an intentional test. While I don't think it would be a problem there is no point in creating a self-inflicted incident. In the worst case you get hurt if it causes an accident, and in the best accident scenario you end up explaining why it seemed like a good idea at the time.
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Agreed. I was overwhelmed by a tsumami of irrational exhuberence this morning. To much coffee.
 
I think I was the first to confess to taking off with the canopy unlatched. As Marty says, fly the airplane. It is a non issue. And yes, I have flown in a Cherokee with a door unlatched. Having experienced both, I can not think of any reason I would ever intentionally take off with either condition. But then I am one of those overly cautions people who have never taken off with insufficient fuel to reach my destination, just to see what would happen.
 
I have to confess, I did it "once" myself. I had plenty of runway so I just landed, closed it then taxied back for another go at it.

Now it is on my checklist twice. Once before runup and once as I'm lined up about to take off. Before full power goes on, I check it.

Hasn't happened again.
 
MLock said:
I have to confess, I did it "once" myself. I had plenty of runway so I just landed, closed it then taxied back for another go at it.

Now it is on my checklist twice. Once before runup and once as I'm lined up about to take off. Before full power goes on, I check it.

Hasn't happened again.
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Exactly what I did also. Landed, closed canopy, taxied back and took off.

Fly the airplane, when all else fails. Where have I heard that before? :rolleyes:

;)
 
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Yep, canopy unlatched is a non-event. It pops at the exact moment the plane lifts off and floats an inch or two off the rollbar. Since this most likely will happen in hot weather, enjoy the breeze as you make a normal climbout to pattern altitude and return to land.

Here's the hot weather angle and how it's likely to happen no matter how many checklists or mnemonics you use: You have completed runup and POH checklist at the hold-short line on a 100F day; the canopy is latched as you taxi into position. Something happens on the runway or pattern which causes you to delay takeoff for a minute or more. As you cook under the canopy at P&H or taxi clear, you unlatch to catch some air.

The runway clears and you see the guy turning base. Taxi power and your propwash silently snugs your canopy into the full-down. position. Coupla radio calls get you looking around, instruments good, let's go.

Some people never make mistakes (or at least never admit it); I've managed to do this twice.

Jim
RV-12 #264
flying 152 hours
 
I am sure I will forget it sooner or later, but I will feel far more comfortable when it happens if I intentionally do it first. I think we can safely say it does not cause any permanent damage to the pivot points or any other part. If it does, then I will strengthen that weakness.
 
Catbird said:
Hey now, I like that idea (take off with the canopy intentionally unlatched to get used to the mayhem). My only concern would be whether or not an unlatched canopy might impose greater stresses on the pivot bolts, anchor hardware, and canopy frame.

Anyone?
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Don't worry: I have a friend who flew for 1.5 hour holding the canopy handle without any damage but for his pride! After taking off for this flight to an airport 150 miles away, he thought that he would have plenty of time to close the canopy once in a steady flight. This never happened! The wind pressure makes the unlocked canopy wider and the tabs at the bottom wont engage in the slots. On this day my friend discovered the true meaning of flying single handed!
 
WingedFrog said:
Don't worry: I have a friend who flew for 1.5 hour holding the canopy handle without any damage but for his pride! After taking off for this flight to an airport 150 miles away, he thought that he would have plenty of time to close the canopy once in a steady flight. This never happened! The wind pressure makes the unlocked canopy wider and the tabs at the bottom wont engage in the slots. On this day my friend discovered the true meaning of flying single handed!
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I have to comment. DO NOT try to hold the canopy closed!! Let it be!! It will float, will not bang. FLY the AIRPLANE normally, go around, land and try again.

When on the numbers......say TRIM, FLAPS, CANOPY and FLY the Airplane. As per Larry's suggestion!
 
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Marty's right

This subject came up almost two years ago. On my 2nd or 3rd flight after completing the PAP it suddenly got cooler and noiser in the airplane about 10 minutes after takeoff. I'd had the canopy resting on the lock arm while waiting for the oil temp to come up, and thought I'd locked it but obviously hadn't gotten it fully latched. After several minutes of vibration an air loads it popped up about 4-5 inches and stayed there. Slowed to about 75 kts but could NOT pull it closed with both hands. Another field was closer than homw, so I proceeded there and landed w/o problems. Shut down, LOCKED the canopy, and proceeded with the flighty. I detailed this at the time but here it is again
And yes, Canopy latched WAS (still is) on my checklist. When the latch is new it's very hard to turn that last little bit and easy tho think it's latched.

Wayne 120241/143WM
 
Just an idea

This is my idea to solve this problem once for all:
I have the lighting kit which includes a red light located close to the canopy latch. As I did not intend to use my plane at night (Sport Pilot license) I did not wire this light but here is a way to use its wiring: It should be possible to install a reed swith of the same kind as the spar pin detection ones and cobble the wiring of the spar pin alarm in serie with the canopy reed switches. Using the big spar warning light as an unmissable clue.

This would work as follows:

- At start time you would close the canopy to get the warning light off. If however the light is still on after locking the canopy, this would mean that a spar pin is not engaged. You still could override the warning to start the engine. You could also override the warning if you want to start the engine with the canopy open. Note that currently although the POH requires to close and latch the canopy to start the engine, there is no light check for that.
- Once the engine is started, the warning light would come up if you open the canopy

Before take-off, the check for canopy latch is now much easier and the warning conspicuous.
 
My point of view is that it is so darned easy to just land and latch it, why make a big deal out of it. I still say doing it on purpose at least once would take all the terror out of it if it ever happened to you.
 
DonFromTX said:
My point of view is that it is so darned easy to just land and latch it, why make a big deal out of it. I still say doing it on purpose at least once would take all the terror out of it if it ever happened to you.
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Think some may be missing the point. An unlatched canopy is only one scenario that one may experience. Yes, we have lost an RV-12 due to this issue and should be aware of this specific issue. Had a friend here in Davenport that lost a rudder cable on take-off (not an RV). He is re-building. Want to try to fly with a loose rudder? The key is in Larry's signature line....... "Fly the airplane".
 
You guys seem to be saying that your canopy won't float up during run up. Mine floats about an inch and a half during run up if not latched.
 
Marty

If possible, now that it has been some time since the hard landing,is the pilot of that RV-12 now willing to give us some more detail about the accident? Or, is there nothing to be gained from hearing more detail about it. I may have missed it but was the RV-12 repairable?, etc? etc?etc. Thanks
 
E. D. Eliot said:
If possible, now that it has been some time since the hard landing,is the pilot of that RV-12 now willing to give us some more detail about the accident? Or, is there nothing to be gained from hearing more detail about it. I may have missed it but was the RV-12 repairable?, etc? etc?etc. Thanks
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On take off the pilot got distracted by the canopy being left unlatched and he turned around to try and latch it. He inadvertently moved the stick forward and hit the runway. The down loaded the data out of the Dynon and sent to Vans. It showed the rate of decent at impact and all kinds of other good data.

The pilot was uninjured, walked away from the wreck and actually helped get the plane off the runway.

The plane was totaled by the insurance company, rebuilt, and is flying today.

The pilot does not post on VAF. He has many decades of flying and experience in several different airplanes. He is still flying as far as I know. He is a good pilot that got distracted. BTDT.

The fuel tank SB was a direct result of this pilot recognizing an issue and notifying Van's and the RV community to the issue. He should be commended for coming forward with the crash info so other may learn. I would hope others will be as courageous as he was coming forward if they have any information that could help fellow aviators. Unfortunately, many do not.
 
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Thanks Larry. John and Ed..... Larry is describing the same individual and incident. And to answer a previous question, my canopy will not float if unlatched on runup (dependent on sealing all leaks with weatherstrip??)
 
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