What's new
Van's Air Force

Don't miss anything! Register now for full access to the definitive RV support community.

Budget Smoke System

Stroh21

Well Known Member
Hey VAF!!!

I know this conversation has occurred on here a few times, but it has been 6 years (that I've seen) that a good conversation has occurred on building a smoke system on a budget.

I'd like to start off by saying the Smoke System Helper kit looks awesome! If I planned on using the system more than 2-3 times a year, I'd probably go that route. However, we primarily use the -8A for cross county flying, so the smoke will be primarily for the occasional loop or formation flight.

The primary question I have centers on finding a suitable oil pump. It seems like oil extracting pumps sit around $40 and a general utility oil pump is $140. What kind of pump does everyone use?

Any other ideas/recommendations are also appreciated! :)

Blue Skies!
Matt
 
If you search the archives, you'll find various Shurflo pump model numbers.

I'm using a 8009-541-236. It goes on sale at Northern Tool regularly. I don't know how many gallons of smoke oil it has pumped, but the internals have been exposed to oil for a few years.

Paige
 
Awesome! Thank you!

What kind of nozzle did you use? I notice there are some stainless steel water nozzles that have a little bit of a spray pattern.

Also, did you put a nozzle in both pipes or will one work?
 
Smoke

If you just want a few minutes of smoke you might go to the junk yard and get a windshield wiper reservoir with built in pump and mount it up and give it a try.
Bob
 
My home brew system is on rev 3. I now use a submersible aftermarket automotive fuel pump. Takes the pump leak failure out of the equation, no worry about where to mount, recirculates back into the tank before leaving via manual needle valve. Simple, plenty of pressure & flow, lighter, and cost comparable to Surflo hydrocarbon compatible pump.
 
Last edited:
If you just want a few minutes of smoke you might go to the junk yard and get a windshield wiper reservoir with built in pump and mount it up and give it a try.
Bob

Great idea - I think I'm going to try an experiment with this $27 wonder or this at some point.
 
Last edited:
My home brew system is on rev 3. I now use a submersible aftermarket automotive fuel pump. Takes the pump leak failure out of the equation, no worry about where to mount, recirculates back into the tank before leaving via manual needle valve. Simple, plenty of pressure & flow, lighter, and cost comparable to Surflo hydrocarbon compatible pump.
Did you just use the internal 'popoff' protection bypass, or a dedicated regulator for the bypass?

Here's a turbine style in-tank pump; probably a better choice than gerotor/roller-vane pumps as seen in the current crop of FI boost pumps. You can find them even cheaper. Hopefully, using cheap components won't matter much since smoke isn't required for safe completion of flight...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/380876588889?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Charlie
 
strainer?

ok Charlie, that Herko in-tank pump looks like a simple and elegant solution.
Do you think the strainer would work with 'smoke' oil or diesel? if intended for gas, I wonder if it would restrict oil flow too much?
 
I've got a similar product in my 'stash' of misc stuff I've looked at for my rotary installation; contemplating it as an aux>main transfer pump. The filter socks are pretty open, with a *lot* of surface area; several times what you get with Van's recommended pickup strainer in a regular gas tank. The actual flow should be pretty low for a smoke system. These pumps are capable of supplying 200HP engines at 40+ psi; you can dial the flow back with a PWM driver,
http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-24V-Max-20A-PWM-DC-Motor-Stepless-Variable-Speed-Control-Controller-Switch-/111936836128?hash=item1a0ff49220:g:V78AAOSw~oFXNU24
or even a simple resistive divider, if you don't mind the extra heat. Though a resistive divider with enough wattage capacity would probably cost more than the pump (and be about as big).

I'd say that it's certainly worth a try, considering the low financial risk. And the socks are removable/replaceable, so....
 
Did you just use the internal 'popoff' protection bypass, or a dedicated regulator for the bypass?

Here's a turbine style in-tank pump; probably a better choice than gerotor/roller-vane pumps as seen in the current crop of FI boost pumps. You can find them even cheaper. Hopefully, using cheap components won't matter much since smoke isn't required for safe completion of flight...

http://www.ebay.com/itm/380876588889?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT

Charlie
My pump looks very similar. As I recall, it came from Summit but would have to check at the hangar for specific brand. My relief consists of a tee in the discharge with a small needle valve allowing some of the pump discharge to spill back into the tank. I open the valve for less flow to the injectors. I use the supplied filter element. Works with diesel and various concoctions of home brew smoke oil just fine.
 
Last edited:
So, I stopped by the auto parts store to see what they had available. While i was talking to the cashier, he had a great idea to use a nitrous nozzle to spray the oil. Has anyone tried this?

I'm also looking for what type of hose to get off of Amazon. How hot does the hose get? I assume a high temperature hose is required?

I feel like I'm getting closer to a pretty good system. Thank you for the help!
 
nozzle tech?

lots of nozzle designs out there in the experimental world.

Now you've got me surfing the racing sites...I wonder if this methanol injector would work....

http://www.burgertuning.com/methanol_injectors.html

only because it's a fluid....perhaps the nitrous ones are too large an orifice size, as they are designed to dump and distribute a gas at higher volumes/rates?

...but who knows, they sure look like they'd do the trick! ( if you don't have a machine shop, or gadgets to roll-your-own)...why not bench test a few, and see what you get!??!
 
Back
Top