VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

-POSTING RULES
-Advertise in here!
- Today's Posts | Insert Pics

Keep VAF Going
Donate methods

Point your
camera app here
to donate fast.


Go Back   VAF Forums > Model Specific > RV-15
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

View Poll Results: Pull Rivets or Solid Rivets?
Pull Rivets 63 34.24%
Solid Rivets 121 65.76%
Voters: 184. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #11  
Old 07-27-2021, 08:02 AM
N8DAV8R N8DAV8R is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Salida, Ca
Posts: 91
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mburch View Post
I voted "pull" but what I actually want is more nuanced than a binary choice. I love squeezing rivets and I don't really even mind driving rivets when I can get my hands on both sides to buck them myself. What I really hate is two-person rivet bucking, since the reliability and availability of your riveting partner becomes a challenge. Not to mention, bucking the rivets inside the fuselage and wings usually involves a lot of painful contortions. So I wouldn't mind a combination of squozen and pulled rivets in order to make solo building easier.
This is similar to my thinking. I'm building a -12, just about at the end of the fuselage kit. Contrary to what a lot of people think about us "assemblers" (I see you over the NYTOM ), there is some actual airplane building and lots of solid rivets in the -12. You get plenty good at prepping for and squeezing solid rivets. I just finished getting the roll over structure all drilled out and countersunk, a task that most people will have "assembled" essentially the same way I did regardless of model.

I have enjoyed the build so much that I'm thinking about what to build next more than I think about going flying. The priority for me is a comprehensive design, documentation, and modern precision kit parts. My opinion is that those things will make a build more enjoyable than one type of rivet or another. If the next kit is well thought out, I'll be glad to have a bunch of dimpling and pounding to do. A little noisy, but I think my neighbors already have me pegged as the crazy guy building an airplane in the garage and will leave me alone.

Anyway, yeah. The idea of a solid rivet airplane biased towards squeezable rivets is attractive to me. I guess that's only practical if a bunch on the skins are blind rivets. By the end of the fuselage kit I think I actually prefer putting in squeezed solids to pulled blinds.
__________________
Nate - Salida, Ca
RV-12is - Finish Kit!
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 07-27-2021, 08:21 AM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 749
Default

I’m assuming this poll is related to the new -15.

Insomuch as this design is backcountry capable, strength is the primary concern. Bush or backcountry airplanes take quite a beating, therefore in an ideal world, universal head solid rivets would be used for maximum strength.

Solid universal head rivets would up the build time considerably so maybe a mix of universal, flush and pull rivets could be used were appropriate.

It doesn’t have to be all or nothing.
__________________
Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you

Last edited by mfleming : 07-27-2021 at 08:24 AM. Reason: Add content
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 07-27-2021, 08:44 AM
rv8ch's Avatar
rv8ch rv8ch is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: LSGY
Posts: 4,160
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfleming View Post
...
Insomuch as this design is backcountry capable, strength is the primary concern. Bush or backcountry airplanes take quite a beating, therefore in an ideal world, universal head solid rivets would be used for maximum strength.
...
Don't forget repair - particularly field repairs. Poop happens.
__________________
Mickey Coggins
http://rv8.ch
"Hello, world!"
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 07-27-2021, 01:28 PM
joeboisselle joeboisselle is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: White Swan Wa.
Posts: 371
Default

How about AN470 rivets instead of 426? I like the aesthetics.
__________________
Joe Boisselle
2010 RV-4
1941 Luscombe 8C
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 07-27-2021, 03:25 PM
Berchmans Berchmans is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Posts: 465
Default Strenght is king

I live in Alaska and fly a RV8, Cessna 182 and a Citabria 7GCBC on floats. if this going to a true back country aircraft it will get used and abused here in AK. Strength is king. I fully intend to buy this kit and assume it will be a great replacement for the Citabria...a pulled rivet construction method would give me pause.
__________________
Burke Wick
Flying RV 8
Anchorage, Alaska
VAF Dues Paid for 2021
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 07-27-2021, 03:40 PM
terrye terrye is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 959
Default Poll - Pull or Pound?

I'm building a -9A and vote for solid rivets on the RV-15/16. In the overall scheme of building an aircraft, I don't think the pulled rivets give a noticeable time saving. Pulled rivets, whether dome or countersunk head still have a hole in the middle from the break stem. Potential water leak path, water freeze path, in addition to harder to paint and keep clean. Definitely solid rivets (I'm sure Rian at Vans has already made this choice).
__________________
Terry Edwards
RV-9A (Fuselage)
2021/2022 VAF Contribution Sent
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 07-27-2021, 03:47 PM
wirejock's Avatar
wirejock wirejock is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 4,674
Default Pull or solid

I doubt a poll will change all the engineering Vans has already done. I suspect it's a "Done Deal".
__________________
Larry Larson
Estes Park, CO
wirejock at yahoo dot com
Donated 01/01/2021, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
Empennage, wings, fuse, finishing kit, now FWF
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 07-27-2021, 03:51 PM
mfleming's Avatar
mfleming mfleming is online now
 
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Joseph, Oregon
Posts: 749
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock View Post
I doubt a poll will change all the engineering Vans has already done. I suspect it's a "Done Deal".
Maybe...but then why take a poll at the presentation

I believe that's what's driving this conversation...some hope that Van's is listening...
__________________
Michael Fleming
Joseph, OR
sagriver at icloud dot com

RV-7 Slider #74572
Started 11/2016
Empennage completed 11/2016 (sans fiberglass)
Ailerons and flaps completed 3/2017.
Wings completed 12/2017
Started on QB fuselage 01/2018
Sliding canopy mostly completed 10/2020
Wiring and Avionics harness completed 9/2/2021
FWF Started 9/3/2021

Donated for 2021 and so should you
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 07-27-2021, 04:01 PM
wirejock's Avatar
wirejock wirejock is offline
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 4,674
Default Poll

Quote:
Originally Posted by mfleming View Post
Maybe...but then why take a poll at the presentation

I believe that's what's driving this conversation...some hope that Van's is listening...
Doh! Sorry. I didn't see that. Nevermind! My vote is still pounded rivets. However, I do see the value in a quick RV12 type back country bird.
__________________
Larry Larson
Estes Park, CO
wirejock at yahoo dot com
Donated 01/01/2021, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
Empennage, wings, fuse, finishing kit, now FWF
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 07-27-2021, 07:16 PM
JohnD.TF4 JohnD.TF4 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 54
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYTOM View Post
Probably just me and donít mean to knock the assemblers out there but pulled rivets just look cheap, amateurish and temporary. Obviously they are the required for certain special situations but otherwise just makes the project look like a high school shop project. Take the time and effort to use solid rivets for a more professional build. Sorry but just my stinky opinion.
Considering all of the other skills you master over the course of an building an airplane, learning to buck rivets is trivial.

Pros: Looks better, lighter, cheaper, faster (flush rivets), makes a cool sound when you install them, WAAAY easier to paint. I've masked N-numbers for paint on nearly 30 pop-riveted airplanes. Words cannot accurately convey the royal pain that process is.

Cons: slightly harder to install.

In case you are worried, check out the RV-12 vs RV-14 build times. They are very close despite the rivet differences. In my opinion, the big deal for build-ability is the format of the build instructions and the matched hole punch.
__________________
John D
RV-12(ULS and iS) Pilot,
Restoring RV8A,
General Purpose Airplane Nut, etc,.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:47 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.