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Flame suit on.... just bought an engine.

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instructor_bill

Well Known Member
So here it is... 13b (turrentine build with streetport work I think) and Tracy Crooks' EC2 and RD1B PSRU

I won't be able to do anything with it for a while as I'm waiting for a fuselage kit, but I'm jazzed just the same:D

I've got to brush up on my TIG skills for the mount though. Has anybody got any experience with buying partial mounts from the subcontractors that Van's uses?
 
So here it is... 13b (turrentine build with streetport work I think) and Tracy Crooks' EC2 and RD1B PSRU

I won't be able to do anything with it for a while as I'm waiting for a fuselage kit, but I'm jazzed just the same:D

I've got to brush up on my TIG skills for the mount though. Has anybody got any experience with buying partial mounts from the subcontractors that Van's uses?

Been there, done that with a rotary. Same set-up as yours on a pusher. Do yourself a favor and cut your losses now and put a real airplane motor in your project. In the end,,,,you aren't saving any money,,,will be "tinkering" forever, and the bottom line is your plane is pretty much worthless on resale value. Like I said,,,,I have been down that road. Someone has a Subaru powered plane for sale on the forum right now. He will be really lucky to find someone even consider buying it at value LESS the engine set-up costs.
 
Been there, done that with a rotary. Same set-up as yours on a pusher.

If you put the SAME setup as a tractor on an airplane that is a pusher, I can see why you might have had some trouble... ;-)

-Dj
 
Cognitive dissonance alert.

Is it too late to stop payment on the check? Do yourself a favor and put a Lycoming in your project. Is this a money issue?....I would never fly that engine A. With a family member. B . At night. C. IFR. D. Over harsh terrain.

Why work on a quality project for 1000s of hours and hard earned cash and install a modified car engine.? Who's going to buy that airplane from you?

Nobody.

Talk to people who have done the learning curve ($) already and follow their advice.
 
If you put the SAME setup as a tractor on an airplane that is a pusher, I can see why you might have had some trouble... ;-)

-Dj

What are you talking about ? The motor does not know if its in front or in back of the plane.
 
So here it is... 13b (turrentine build with streetport work I think) and Tracy Crooks' EC2 and RD1B PSRU

Hi Bill,
I applaud you for standing up and making the choice for yourself. Best of luck building your dream machine! Please keep us posted on your progress.

-Dj
 
Bill,

Congrats on your engine purchase.

My buisness partner has one in his RV-6A and has only had three engine stoppages in flight. Each time he has made an airport. I think he has more RV glider time than anyone.

He will be the first to tell you that if you like to fly buy a Lycoming but if you like to tinker, buy an auto conversion and if you like rotories, buy good muffler.
 
I almost did the same...

but realized it would add a year to my build time, reduce resale and be less safe, and likely would not actually cost less. Great little engine the 13B, I have rebuild three of them myself, porting them, etc. Good luck with your project, and be safe! Post pictures of your FWF and get as many eyes on it as possible before you fly.

Hans
 
Bill - I am going to do you the courtesy of assuming that you have already read all of the warnings, educated yourself on the pros and cons, and made the decision based on what you want to do you with your project - and offer congratulations on making your choice!

Anytime someone feels they need to put a flame suit on before they post on VAF, it is a sad commentary on the civility of the place. It bothers me when anonymous critics chase people away from VAF with their negativity. I hope that everyone working on Alt Engines will contribute their experiences (good and bad), what they discover that works, what they find that doesn't work, and how things turn out.

Too many "Alt Eng" types with vast amounts of experience have left this forum and taken the valuable contributions with them. I hope they come back some day.

Paul (definitely NOT an "Alt Eng" guy, but open to all who wish to contribute)
 
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Will be interested to watch your progress Bill... I've been very interested in the rotaries. (And I drive an RX8. ;))

I'll probably end up going conventional on my RV, but as a separate (and not "required to fly") project I'd like to experiment with engines as well. I think there is great potential there, I just don't want it to be a requirement for my plane to fly...as I may personally make some not so great decisions in that case. I think the engine work would be fun in it's own right...and to subject them to mean test bed procedures, induce failures, etc. Well, I may have a strange idea of fun.

Keep posting, and keep us updated! I've read Crook's book, and much other info -- but I wish there was more conversation out there. (I assume you're on the "flyrotary" email list, as well?)
 
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Amen!

Bill - I am going to do you the courtesy of assuming that you have already read all of the warnings, educated yourself on the pros and cons, and made the decision based on what you want to do you with your project - and offer congratulations on making your choice!

Anytime someone feels they need to put a flame suit on before they post on VAF, it is a sad commentary on the civility of the place. It bothers me when anonymous critics chase people away from VAF with their negativity. I hope that everyone working on Alt Engines will contribute their experiences (good and bad), what they discover that works, what they find that doesn't work, and how things turn out.

Too many "Alt Eng" types with vast amounts of experience have left this forum and taken the valuable contributions with them. I hope they come back some day.

Paul (definitely NOT an "Alt Eng" guy, but open to all who wish to contribute)


Paul,
Well said! VAF shouldn't be a place to avoid if your into something outside the 'norm'.

I have flown behind alternative powerplants in a previous life so I speak from experience. All of the cautions and warning are real. I know that I have no business with one on my own airplane - I had a dedicated crew chief that maintained the kit prototype I was flying. That being said, I applaud folks who have the experitise and skills to put these airplanes in the air.
Respectfully,
 
If you are going rotary Tracy is the go to man. He has so much knowledge and experience with rotaries. Build the plane you want to build. The attack the alternate engine guys has pretty much gone away. It was tough here two and three years ago. Be very conservative with your flight test airport, plan,they way you fly and things will work out. Get her done and keep showing up at fly-ins if you want to quiet the naysayers down. I wonder if Rotax is an alternative engine. Well it was but is considered OK now. So minds can be changed, it just takes a while and some success. Go forth and conquer!
 
Hmm, this reminds me of a short conversation I had with a fellow at a gun show. He is part of a club that shoots fully automatic weapons.

I told him that I didn't have any desire to own a fully automatic weapon, but I was glad that there are people that did.

I think the same case can be made here. I did a tremendous amount of research on auto conversions and decided to buy a lycoming, however, I am glad that people do have the desire to build airplanes with auto conversions since that is a big part of the E in EAA.

Schu
 
yeah schu, nfa owner here. it is silly why people think a gun is "more deadly" with a happy switch, even fellow gun owners.

some of the immediate: "quit while you can responses" are very anti experimental in my opinion. nothing wrong with experimenting, it all depends on your method of research and implementation.
 
wow, this is a good flame suit

:rolleyes:
Still looking for some experience with either mount fabricators that will fab an entire mount, or for ones that van's contracts for theirs (so I can build from a basic mount with gear leg attachment tubes)

EYES WIDE OPEN:cool:
 
:rolleyes:
Still looking for some experience with either mount fabricators that will fab an entire mount, or for ones that van's contracts for theirs (so I can build from a basic mount with gear leg attachment tubes)

EYES WIDE OPEN:cool:

I used 1/2" aluminum plate sandwiched between the oil pan and engine, a Renesis. I cut it out of one piece and had rounded "ears" on each corner that mounted to the engine mount bed with Lord style rubber isolator mounts with 3/8" bolts. Lots of lightening and oil drain holes in the plate. I fabricated the bed mount out of chrome moly and tig welded it. Took me about two days to fabricate the mount and plate. No Big deal. I don't want to dissuade anyone from going this route,,,,just be well aware of the downsides. Most people think that auto conversions are a lot less expensive than certified Lyc's but when its all said and done, you will be at the cost of a good used Lyc. There are more than a few here that have pulled their conversions from FLYING planes and replaced them with Lyc. More tinkering than flying. People warned me early on but I did not believe them,,,,,:eek:
 
Rotary in RV7

Bill,

Congrats on your engine. I too am installing a rotary engine in my RV7. I am very close to first engine start. It has been a great experience, I anticipated quite a bit if work to make this happen, I was off by a good margin. Don't get me wrong, it has been very rewarding, and I am sure once I start it, it will be more so. But don't underestimate the amount of work ahead of you.
It can get pretty brutal around these parts with the nay sayers to alternative engines, but hold your head high, as you are a true experimenter. Be very careful in what you do, listen to those that have flown with a rotary, what works, what doesn't, and enjoy it. If you are not already on it, the flyrotary list is a wonderful place to exchange rotary ideas, and ask questions. Great people on there. I should know, I am one of them:rolleyes:
Good luck,
Ben
 
To their credit....

There's an article in this month's Sport Aviation....a couple of really level-headed guys put a small-block Chevy 427 in their Velocity. They had gearbox troubles but one of them, an engineer, designed their own, quite successfully, it appears.

Chevy and Rotary engines are highly dependable...I drove an RX-7 from 1979 until it had well over 100,000 miles on it, then found out that if I'd added just a small amount of oil to the fuel, I could almost have doubled that figure!

The problems that I've seen here and that friends had, was always with systems...mainly cooling and PSRU. I still believe that if they're done correctly, present a good alternative.

Best,
 
Speaking of rotaries....

Does anyone here know anything about the Norton AE 100R? It has been used on a Fisher 80% scale Tiger Moth. I have not been able to find any info on it other that the name Norton comes from a very early motor cycle company in England.

On the subject of the suitability of auto engines in an airplane, one area of discussion that recently came up on another forum is bearing tolerance with the cam and crank shaft. It seems with some modern engines the tolerances are so close, the bearings fail after prolonged high power due to a lack of sufficient oil to the bearings.
 
Proceed cautiously

The important thing is to research the facts. I have had several back line discussions with died in the wool Alt engine guys. Most are completely unwilling to accept the completely dismal success rate with Alt engines. That is why they leave this forum for the safety of their own group.

I'm not going to rehash the facts but, I only ask that those considering the unconventional move to an Alt engine to openly and objectively evaluate the facts regarding these engines. If you want to fly dependably with speed and efficiency, go with a proven route. If you want to design, develop, manufacture, tinker and then be on edge every flight, go the Alt engine route. Just make sure your significant other also knows the history.

I'm just tired of seeing people grounded because of broken promises and unrealistic expectations provided by some of the Alt engine companies. Further, I'm tired of seeing people crash and have off field landings with these engines. The reliability and consistency of Alt engines just isn't there yet. I've got 10 examples, 2 have crashed and the remaining 8 have had problems. Of the 2 that are flying, neither have even close to the performance promised and have had significant other issues.

Out to the hangar to work the new Lycoming/Barrett IO390 powered 7!!!!!
 
I'm really amused. Everytime the resale value argument is brought up as a disadvantage.

It's an invalid argument.

First because you can take the engine off and put a lycossauros in place if wanted and sell it that way.

Second, because honestly I think NO ONE here is building an aircraft thinking of selling it. Certainly, no one who uses an auto conversion would be.

Third because over 5 or 10 or 20 years of ownership any difference in resale value will be so diluted to be insignificant when the time comes to sell the aircraft.

You people need to shut up already.
 
I'm really amused. Everytime the resale value argument is brought up as a disadvantage.

It's an invalid argument.

First because you can take the engine off and put a lycossauros in place if wanted and sell it that way.

Second, because honestly I think NO ONE here is building an aircraft thinking of selling it. Certainly, no one who uses an auto conversion would be.

Third because over 5 or 10 or 20 years of ownership any difference in resale value will be so diluted to be insignificant when the time comes to sell the aircraft.

You people need to shut up already.

I'm only reponding because of the word.........."lycossauros". :)

Lyco's & clones work because they were designed as aircraft engines in the "beginning". Seventy years later, no alternate engine has passed them in simplicity or reliabilty.

Many Van's aircraft builders, do sell their aircraft. I've seen numerous "auto conversion" aircraft for sale, and usually here on this forum. There is one ad, in this last week, and should still be in the classifieds. Auto conversions in Van's airplanes have not sold well; and it's a tremendous amount of work and expense to just put a Lyco in it's place. New cowl, prop, engine mount, paint, Phase 1, etc............let alone the engine.

L.Adamson --- RV6A/Lyc O360
 
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I'm really amused. Everytime the resale value argument is brought up as a disadvantage.

It's an invalid argument.

First because you can take the engine off and put a lycossauros in place if wanted and sell it that way.

...

You people need to shut up already.

kristoffon - Welcome to the VAF forum.

While I agree with you, that the engine can be changed, it is not a valid argument for alt engines. I'm in the process of changing one Lycoming for another and the difference between the two engines means a complete FWF change, including the engine mount, prop, spinner, cowl, and upper gearleg fairings, and a LOT more. Total cost of the parts is greater than $30,000 and the time involved will be close to 250 hours. Neither of these numbers are trivial.

As for using an Alt engine, I'm all for it. I hope Bill has good success and many trouble free flight hours. However, having followed the Alt engine movement for some time, it is not for the faint of heart. Engine (and engine accessory) failure rates that are higher then Lycoming engines are but one issue. The biggest issue in my mind is the increased weight penalty of most auto conversions.

With that said, like most people on this thread, I wish Bill the best but hope he is going into this with his eyes open. There have been a number of alt engine FWF kits sold as bolt on and go fly kits and that is just not the case.
 
eyes open?

I think Bill has his eyes wide open already!

Since his Thread is titled Flame suit on . . . just bought an engine, I would conclude from that he already has explored these issues and feels he is ready to tackle the responsibility of doing the necessary work. Even if he did not start with his eyes open I am sure by now those "nay sayer" posters have adequately warned him with their posts.

So being that I am a card carrying member of the non-experimental experimental airplane builders out here (hmmm, maybe not quite true since I am building an RV9A with a 185 HP ECI IOX340), I tip my hat to you and say "Good Luck to you sir!" I wish I had the skills to go down that experimental road. Please keep us informed on your experiences so we may some day feel the same way about auto conversion engines as we do the original LYCOMING auto conversions of Lycosaur days past! Lest anyone choose to think otherwise there was a day when Lycoming was a premier auto engine manufacturer.
 
You people need to shut up already.

I'd say we shouldn't "attack" either way, though.

I really appreciate the detailed comments -- even if very negative -- from those that have been there. (Whether its to help make a decision, or just to know what to watch out for...)

Lest anyone choose to think otherwise there was a day when Lycoming was a premier auto engine manufacturer.

And before that... sewing machines! :)
 
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...Second, because honestly I think NO ONE here is building an aircraft thinking of selling it...

I would be inclined to take that statement with a huge old grain of salt. In my direct experience with building homebuilt aircraft, and with developing, manufacturing, and selling parts for them, almost all builders have at least some level of concern for their ability to eventually recoup their investment of money, time, and trouble.

Furthermore, if there _are_ folks here who have no such concerns, it is likely because the Vans homebuilts have what is probably the most solid track record in return on investment. The RVs are probably the first airplanes in the history of homebuilt aviation to consistently sell for more than the sum of the costs of the engine, airframe kit, avionics, and accessories. For proof of this, you need look no further than eBay Motors. Notice how many RVs are sold as complete and flying, and how many homebuilt airplanes of other types are sold as "projects" with the airframe and engine auctioned separately. It must be frustrating for those folks to understand that their airframe and engine combination actually has less value than the sum of its parts.

...First because you can take the engine off and put a lycossauros in place if wanted and sell it that way.

It is much more easily said than done to remove one engine and install an engine of a completely different type. In the case at hand, you would probably end up removing and discarding pretty much everything firewall forward, then installing new engine mount, engine, baffling, induction system, cowling, exhaust system, controls, and monitoring systems. Oh, and then you have to go back to Phase I and do 25 or 40 hours of testing. All in all, that's a lot of trouble and expense to go through to sell an airframe.

Thanks, Bob K.
www.hpaircraft.com
 
It is much more easily said than done to remove one engine and install an engine of a completely different type. In the case at hand, you would probably end up removing and discarding pretty much everything firewall forward, then installing new engine mount, engine, baffling, induction system, cowling, exhaust system, controls, and monitoring systems.

Thanks, Bob K.
www.hpaircraft.com

Yup.

If I was going to go with the auto conversion route, I would plan ahead a bit, make any future reversion back to Lyc as painless as possible. Little things like bulkhead fittings for fuel, firewall mounted electrical connectors, try to keep stock location for motor mount attach, stock cowl attach. No firewall penetrations for cooling, stuff like that.

None of these would detract from the Alt Engine installation, and make it easier to R/R if needed.
 
And I thought I asked about engine mount fabricators

I've been here for a while, I've done my reading.

I don't care to throw stones. Thanks to this forum, I've got some feedback that I think I can use in order to mount the engine. (some sifting required);)
 
....
It is much more easily said than done to remove one engine and install an engine of a completely different type. In the case at hand, you would probably end up removing and discarding pretty much everything firewall forward, then installing new engine mount, engine, baffling, induction system, cowling, exhaust system, controls, and monitoring systems. Oh, and then you have to go back to Phase I and do 25 or 40 hours of testing. All in all, that's a lot of trouble and expense to go through to sell an airframe.

Thanks, Bob K.
www.hpaircraft.com

Bill is correct, it is 5 hours minimum back to phase one. I did it last year. It took about 8 months to make the switch.

The idea of going with an alternate engine is complex and little understood by most builders. I've had both feet in that camp, had some success and some non-success. There is much written about such an adventure because some people doing it are really hooked and can write volumes about their passion.

I wasn't so much impressed with the written stuff as seeing and flying with an alternate engine. In the beginning things were simple and worked fairly well. Last I heard, one of the early guys had over 900 trouble free hours. There is another pilot in Venice, FL who gave me a ride, very impressive and he has had great success. There a few guys like that around, they simply keep to themselves and do their thing. Same can be said for the Mazda rotary crowd. We tend to hear much more about failures than successes in this business. Sometimes the bad news is justified, you just don't know how deep it goes because guys involved don't want to rock the boat too much, after all they are in it for better or worse.

When it comes to selling whatever the alternate engine airplane is, buyers are not passionate about it. They want proven value and that's almost impossible to present. Some buyers will go for a totally underpriced project simply because they can not resist such a deal. But the builder will NEVER get his money back on an alternate engine - not to think about labor.

I understand completely why a person would want to get involved with an alternate engine and try to make something different work. It can be fun, interesting, and sometimes things work out quite well. But much of it is not long term proven in an airplane and that always presents an element of uncertainty.

Some thrive on such things, I don't any more. :)
 
I'm a rotary fan!

I very, very nearly went with a rotary engine! High power/weight ratio, loves running in the higher RPM's, dual ignition per combustion chamber, smooth running if a chamber quits, and due to greater case thermal expansion, nearly impossible to seize up. Sounds about perfect for an airplane. I commend you on your effort!!!! Bruce and Tracy are the folks to work with here too. It may be worth seeing who built/builds PowerSport's mounts, they may have the tooling to make your mount. IIRC it was a sled-type.

As others have said, it will require more tinkering, and that was what led me to put an aero engine in mine. Still an experimental aero engine though.

Thanks for keeping the "E" in EAA!!!
 
What was the original question?

Welcome to the world of fabricating Bill! Since there has been so little direct replies to your original question let me bring up a few options:

1. Check out Todd Bartrim's RV-9 site since he has already done what you talking about...buying the back of a mount and adding structure to the front that will tie into the Renesis / 13B. http://www3.telus.net/haywire/RV-9/C-FSTB.htm

2. There also is an engine mount designed by Bill Shertz called the "Shertz beam"... http://www.jerryhey.com/S-Beam.html

3. Mistral is developing a certified 13B type engine and has been willing to sell individual parts that they have developed to home builders. They sell a rear cover plate I believe will bolt right onto a standard Lord type engine mount.

4. But since you're working on getting a TIG welding currrency hack again, you might want to just jump right in and weld up your own from scratch?! :)

I wish you lived a bit closer since I would gladly help you regain your TIG touch by welding some AN male bungs onto my radiator and also welding up my stainless steel exhaust system. If you going to do a project like this, a TIG welder and the skills to employ it will really come in handy!

Someone else mentioned it, but if you aren't already doing so you need to drop in and check out the rotary newsgroup list from time to time. There are some great guys on that list with incredible rotary experience who are ready and willing to pass information along free of charge.

http://lancair.net/lists/flyrotary/List.html?Language= I have been on it for 7 or 8 yrs. I think and you can search the archives by topic for quite a few great answers to dilemmas you encounter.

Keep us posted on your progress!

Doug Lomheim
OK City,OK
RV-9A, 13B , FWF, electrical, etc., etc,

P.S. A Navy buddy (Peter Bauer) who flew F-14's a while ago once told me that American Graffiti was filmed in his home town of Petaluma...
 
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I have only flown behind Lycomings and Rotax 912 and a few times behind a Rotax 447. I know that lots of people will consider the 912 and "alternate" engine, but the truth (based on facts) is that the 912 is in every single aspect a much better product, a better design solution as an aircraft engine both overall and in the details, and 10 times better built in times of precision and workmanship (quality). But, what the Lycoming lacks in quality and finesse, it makes up in brute simplicity, proven functionality and unsurpassed maintainability.

The Mistral is a rotary, presumably approaching the functionality of Rotax/Lycoming, but the last time I asked for a price, it costs twice that of a Lycoming 360. A rotary is often projected as the perfect aviation engine mainly because of much fewer moving parts, less vibrations and more compact size. Clearly there must be some major faults about the whole concept, or otherwise every aircraft would be using rotaries by now. The truth is that the rotary engine is a defunct dead end road in the history of engines, a curiosity nothing more. But then again, isn't one of the main ideas of experimental aviation to investigate and try curiosities?

There are others, like the Rotec and the WAM and the Verner Radial

If it is marketed as the thing it is, something different - a curiosity for enthusiasts, then it is OK (like Rotec, Verner with their radial engines and Wilksh does). But it looks like most have an idea to revolutionize the world, especially those doing auto conversions, and sadly also Mistral.
 
BILL;
Check my link below, there are a few pics of my turbo rotary powered RV-8.
I bought my mount from Fred Breese. I don't know if he still makes them, but I like mine.
My first engine run was a blast. You can see it on youtube if you search 'rotary 13b RV-8'.
You have to fabricate all your radiator and oil cooler mounts, manifolds, alternator brackets, throttle body, air filter,... everything.
It takes a while, so you already know you are doing it for the fun of building.
I've enjoyed every minute, and there have been quite a few!
 
Good on you!

Bill,

Just have to say, it's people like you who have me coming back to this board time and again. Those who lack ingenuity and don't have the nerve to experiment are weak willed and easily led.

Robin
Carbed Lycoming 0-320.;)
 
Engine mount help.

Bill,

As perviously posted by another member, Fred Breese made engine mount s for the rotary. However it took him a year to get mine done. He now no longer makes them, and is not in business. Contact Ed Klepis at Tech welding in Paducah Kentucky. http://www.techwelding.com
He now makes the mount that Fred Breese used to make, but with some nice improvements that I wish I had on mine. He is also easy to work with, and is open to helping on parts if thats what you need or want. I built my intake, and he welded it up for me, and he built my radiator and oil cooler as well. Good guy, great work.

Ben
 
Hey, I almost went rotary, then subaru, and I settled on a Lyc. For me, it wasn't the experimental nature of a conversion as much as it was the tinker factor. As my build progressed and I got a better idea of how much I could spend in both time and treasure, the Lycoming became the best choice, since I could stand on the shoulders of many giants.

My second build (if there is one) might go there. Maybe an RV10 with a 3-rotor 20b turbo, where I can borrow heavily from Ross Farnham's cooling setup on his EG33 sube conversion.

The most realistic option is that I'll happily get my Lyc-powered -7 out of my wife's "potting shed" and fly it until the govt says I'm too old.
 
Bill. When I designed and built my mount for the Renesis, I started out by making a false firewall on a 4' x4' piece of 3/4" particle board mounted on a stand horizontally. I then drew out the actual firewall outline on the board with mounting bolt locations, and water & center lines to scale from and using a digital level. With the known thrust line and prop flange station line, I was able to fabricate a fake mount using 1/2" ridged PVC,,,,hot gluing it together. When I was satisfied with the false mount, I removed it and fabricated the real mount on the temporary firewall using the PVC mount as a cutting guide, working from the bolt locations forward. You need to leave an escape for gas in the weld or drill a tiny hole in the tubing so the gasses escape while you weld it together. I was able to get about 70% of the welding done on the particle board firewall. Moving around while welding kept distortion to a minimum and required no twisting or torquing to keep the thrust line where it needed to be. My research led to the conclusion to NOT stress relieve the mount. Clean it up when done. Inject some boiled linseed oil in the vent holes and roll it about to get everything inside the tubes nicely coated for corrosion protection. Linseed oil has a good capillary property. Plug the holes with a tiny screw, a quick spot weld, or caulk, then prime and paint. Very EZ to do and it was a fun part of the build if you like to weld as I do. Good luck. Dave
 
Scott Emery RV-8

BILL;
Check my link below, there are a few pics of my turbo rotary powered RV-8...
You have to fabricate all your radiator and oil cooler mounts, manifolds, alternator brackets, throttle body, air filter,... everything.
It takes a while, so you already know you are doing it for the fun of building.
I've enjoyed every minute, and there have been quite a few!

Scott:

What size tubing are you using to plumb your water? Are you beading the ends where you attach the rubber hoses? I need to do something similar with mine so always looking for ideas on how best to do it...

Thanks.

Doug
 
Bob Hassel Progress?

You might try the CozyGirrrl's http://www.cozygirrrl.com/aircraftparts.htm. They typically do parts for the canard world but have been know to branch out. Their parts are a work or art. It's worth a try anyway.

Bob

Bob: I checked out your web site and it looks like you must be spending so much time building that you don't have time to update your progress. :). Can you give us an update on how far along you are?

Doug
 
Doug;
I'm using 1-1/2" water tube and hose, except the Griffin radiator outlet. It's a stock offering thru Summit Racing, $159 IIRC. I used a reducing rubber elbow cut from a radiator hose I saw hanging from the ceiling of the local auto parts store. It had just the right shape for just the few inches I needed. The rest was discarded, and the inner support spring shortened to fit too.
A local custom welder has a tube beading tool, so some of my cooling water system used that. Other tubes had 3 or 4 bead welds on the edges of the tube ends, not as complete, but better than nothing.
The Air Intake tubes are not beaded, as I am not really boosting much, mostly turbo normalizing. I'm trying to respect Van's 200 HP design limit.
 
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Jeggs has lots of parts that you need for FWF on auto engines.

Just a side note. My auto engine powered RV-10 flew over 1200nm yesterday with six stops in five different states. Keep plugging away. The best part was pulling up to the Mogas pump and paying 73 cents less per gallon than 100LL.
 
Yes;
I agree with TSwezey, I used Jegs as well as Summit. Plus the local auto parts store, Van's catalog, Steinair (for engine wires) Fittings Inc, Tacoma Screw etc., You have a lot of choices for hardware, but it will be up to you to keep the quality up to 'Aircraft Standard'.
 
hmmmm....

Well, there are people out there that really do put the E in EAA. I applaud those who do experiment. I know of several in the area, I'm not sure if they would call their record stellar though. There is a local RV-4 that had 9 or so sub's in it before he switched to a LYC. There is a pretty red and white -6 that had the engine break and stop while he was flying, he landed safe in a field. There is a Sub that nobody can make run right in Sandersville, there is also one in Griffin that is not installed on an airframe. I wish you the very best in luck for experimentation. It does appear that there are several airplanes that have gotten alt engines to work ok. Please do not fly over my house though. I must admit I cringe when I hear an airplane go overhead and the engine is turning 5800 RPM.....

Best
Brian Wallis
 
I must admit I cringe when I hear an airplane go overhead and the engine is turning 5800 RPM.....

Now that you mentioned it. And I'm being honest and forthright here...

A good friend has a Subie in his "8". It's loud all right, and we even made jokes that we'd have an airport petition to ban this aircraft... :)

However, he is now totally insulating the interior. Turns out that ANR headsets just won't tune out the high frequency engine sounds. He's tried several. It's driving him nuts, cause it is turning at such a constant high rpm!

L.Adamson --- RV6A
 
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