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Oshkosh - new procedure in Homebuilt Camping

sprucemoose

Well Known Member
VAFers,

Now that we've ticked over into July, it's time to start thinking about Oshkosh in earnest. Actually, to be accurate, we never really stop thinking about it, but the pace quickens as it gets closer.

Over the years, your faithful parking volunteers have heard some variation of the following questions roughly ninety jillion times:

1. "How early do I have to get here to get a good parking spot?" or its close cousin:

2. I got here early on purpose! Why do I have to park so far away from the showers/so close to the showers/ way in the back/ way in the front/ etc etc etc?

The answer to the first question is simple, if a bit sarcastic- there are no good parking spots at Oshkosh. Really. Because good parking spots are very much in the eye of the beholder, and we have no way to know what is going on in your eye. Some folks like being right next to the showers/ bathrooms, others can't stand the noise. Some like being right up front close to the crowds, some want to be as far in the back as they can for the peace and quiet.

Historically, we have filled HBC starting in the back (far west end) and working east. That doesn't make a lot of sense to some, until you consider this- the non-camping RV parking area (called Area 51 or the Sea of RVs) is to the area just east of HBC. And, as some of you know, we start parking in this area on the far east end (just west of Van's tent) and work west. HBC starts west and works east, parking starts east and works west, and we meet in the middle, somewhere around the 50 yard line. We can usually guess with some accuracy where the border will end up, but it is not an exact science and each year we make some adjustments to the border as needed. This would not be possible if we started at the border and worked out in each direction.

Make sense? Good, because now we are going to change it up. Based on the feedback we've gotten over the years since HBC came into existence, and with the additional real estate we've gained by taking over the former red auto parking lot, we are going to, for the first time, make an effort to get inside the eye of the beholder and divine the ideal parking spot for each arriving airplane. How will we do this? The same way everything else is communicated at Oshkosh- visually.

The procedure for arriving pilots is the same. Once on the ground, show your HBC sign to each and every orange vest you encounter. Once you arrive at the entrance to HBC, you will be greeted by something new- an orange vested volunteer with a sign of their own, which will look something like this:

WHERE WOULD YOU LIKE TO CAMP?

#1. UP FRONT - LESS WALKING

#2. OUT BACK – LESS TRAFFIC

#3. CLOSE TO FACILITIES

The options are numbered. After considering the options, pick one and show the appropriate number of fingers to the flagman, who will then direct you appropriately. Rocking your wings to acknowledge is not necessary. (Note: if your choice is option #1, please use the correct finger. This goes without saying, but I insert it for the benefit of the KC boys:) )

Keep in mind that this will be time and space permitting. Depending on when you get there, there may or may not be anything left in your chosen area. We will get you as close to your choice as we can, but as usual, if you want a good seat to the show, get there early.

As this is the first year of a new procedure, there is bound to be a learning curve, so bear with us. As always we welcome your feedback, as we are always looking for ways to improve the experience. I look forward to seeing many of you at the big show in a few weeks. As always, fly safe and READ THE NOTAM!
 
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Would the area in blue be considered a #3?

Oshkosh.jpg
 
Laugh

Thanks......that was a fun read! You guys do a great job, but you will never please everyone!

So like Ricky Nelson sang in Garden Party...

But it's all right now,
I've learned my lesson well,
You see, you can't please everyone,
So you, gotta to please yourself.
 
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North 40

Some of us park in the North 40 campground. Will this procedure be in effect for that area, too?
 
Would it help to write a #1, #2 or #3 with a black magic marker on our HBC signs?
No, and in fact it will just confuse all the flagmen out near the runway. Just show your normal sign until you get to HBC.

Would the area in blue be considered a #3?
#3 will start east of there, closer to the showers. By later in the show your dot might be the best #3 available.

Some of us park in the North 40 campground. Will this procedure be in effect for that area, too?
N40 is handled by a completely different group of volunteers and they do things differently. This procedure is in effect in homebuilts only.
 
We had a perfect spot last year, up back, near the tent with the coffee pot, next to (but not too close) to the showers. Not sure how to to indicate that. But it was great.
 
Great post, Jeff. Looking forward to #2 this year. Every morning. :D

See you in a few weeks ...
 
Jeff,

Thanks for offering up these very helpful and logical options!! And for your work at the show!!

Bryan
 
Jeff, a question. I'll be arriving early, like Friday if the weather is cooperative, and camping in HBC. I'll probably need to fly out Saturday morning to cover an event elsewhere, and perhaps the same on Sunday. Should I ask for some particular area?
 
We had a perfect spot last year, up back, near the tent with the coffee pot, next to (but not too close) to the showers. Not sure how to to indicate that. But it was great.

Same here - in the vicinity of the blue dot above. The morning coffee in the tent was my favorite part of my first Oshkosh last year. Just awesome to meet so many folks from all over, with such varying backgrounds, all with the same passion. Plus, one could not have asked for better weather for a first timer (once the 40 degree nights the first weekend blew through:eek: )
 
Dan- park wherever you'd like, it doesn't make much difference. Just let us know when you plan to come/ go when you get here.

Bob- you got lucky to get your perfect spot. Not much you can do to affect your luck.
 
Jeff ?

Jeff,

Thanks for your post. Carol and I will get there on Friday, weather permitting
We want to camp with Dayton, but he cannot come till Wednesday. The blue spot is our favorite area.
Can we bring some yellow tape and save a place for friend?
We are volunteering again this year. Thanks for all you do.
 
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Can we bring some yellow tape and save a place for friend?
Afraid not, at least over the weekend, it's just too crowded. Chances are that by Wednesday someone next to or very near you will depart and open a spot, and by then things are thinning out enough that this could be done. Find me or one of the other guys and we'll see what we can do.

Can you get a no helicopter route parking spot?
Sure. Would you prefer Appleton or Fond du Lac? :)

Seriously- talk to Darwin. He is in charge of handling all the helicopter complaints this year.
 
Here's a question: What if I want to fly out after I set up at Oshkosh, pick up another person who wants to see Oshkosh (but not for the whole week), and then fly back in later in the day?

Do I have to set up a new campsite or is there a way to keep my stuff there (I'd have to take the tent down to get back into the spot, I suppose) and keep the spot?
 
Here's a question: What if I want to fly out after I set up at Oshkosh, pick up another person who wants to see Oshkosh (but not for the whole week), and then fly back in later in the day?

Do I have to set up a new campsite or is there a way to keep my stuff there (I'd have to take the tent down to get back into the spot, I suppose) and keep the spot?

Why would you have to take you tent down? I'm sure you can find enough volunteers to assist with pushing your RV-7 back into the site (as oppose to pulling through with the engine running).

It's been pretty common practice for folks to come and go and park in the same spot. Especially if you leave you tent up. :D
 
Check with...

Here's a question: What if I want to fly out after I set up at Oshkosh, pick up another person who wants to see Oshkosh (but not for the whole week), and then fly back in later in the day?

Do I have to set up a new campsite or is there a way to keep my stuff there (I'd have to take the tent down to get back into the spot, I suppose) and keep the spot?

Moose or Kreff but I believe you can leave your tiedowns there and tent to mark your spot. BTW thanks Moose for the posting, I plan to be there on Tuesday evening/Wednesday morning 7/22,23 to set up so we should be ready for everybody. Coffee provided this year by Flying High & will be in the tent from 6-9 during the show and possibly the weekend before(still checking on that).:)
 
Why would you have to take you tent down? I'm sure you can find enough volunteers to assist with pushing your RV-7 back into the site (as oppose to pulling through with the engine running).

It's been pretty common practice for folks to come and go and park in the same spot. Especially if you leave you tent up. :D

Well, it's kind of a big tent that has to go behind the wing so I wouldn't be able to get back into the parking spot with it in place.

Re: Helicopter noise. Apparently some people don't like the noise. Which makes me wonder why on earth you'd go to Oshkosh. ;)
 
Well, it's kind of a big tent that has to go behind the wing so I wouldn't be able to get back into the parking spot with it in place.
As long as you leave your tie downs in place the spot is yours. It helps to write your row number on your HBC sign for your return. As for the tent- most people arrange the tent so that they can get the plane in/out without removing it. It is easier to shut down and push tail-first back into your spot. Dropping one corner of the tent is an option. If the tent is too big to accommodate this, it might be too big period. Tents need to stay (reasonably) within the airplanes footprint so as to not block the taxi lane.
 
#1,2, or 3

Okay "Friday" I think KC Flight has it straight now, the special #1 sign 3 times and we get the prize!
Ripper
 
Debrief on the new procedure

Now that everyone is home from the big show and all our camping gear is safely dried out and packed away, it's time to debrief this. We had a huge turnout this year; close to but not quite a record number of RVs and the highest nightly turnout in HBC ever. So, it made for a good acid test for a new procedure. Some observations, which need to be archived for next year:

1. Overall it worked quite well, and we'll probably do it again next year.

2. It was well publicized ahead of time. Folks were taxing up holding up fingers before they even got to the sign explaining why. You did your homework.

3. Even for the unexpecting it worked well. A few seconds of reading and pondering and the fingers were raised. The slow-down effect on traffic was minimal.

4. We did not take detailed measurements, but the distribution was about 60% to #3 (close to facilities,) about 25% #1 (up front) and 15% #2 (in the back.) We did our best to accommodate but will adjust accordingly next year.

5. We kept this up until about noon on Sunday. By that time things had filled up enough that the three areas pretty much ran together, not to mention we were too busy with arrivals to take the time. So consider noon Sunday to be the cutoff for "getting there early."

6. To the poor soul who got their just before airshow time on Tuesday and plaintively held up one finger as we led you to a spot way in the back... sorry. If you want a good seat to the show, get there early. By noon Tuesday you're lucky to have a spot at OSH, let along you choice.

That brings up another point- the website folks asked me early in the week if we wanted the HBC status to be listed on the EAA website along with North 40 camping (ie. 90% full, closed, etc.) I turned them down and here's why- unlike in N40, Homebuilt never actually "fills up." When we get full, we get creative and look for ways to shoehorn planes into un likely spaces. When that runs out we can always send them to the far south end of the airport, ie. "North Fond du Lac." We will never turn a showplace (homebuilt, antique or warbird) way from Oshkosh. N40, by contrast, can divert to FDL or Appleton when they "get full." So, not wanting to have someone look at the website and say, "gee, HBC is 98% full, I probably won't find a spot so I won't go," we deliberately left our status off the website. Come on in and we'll always find you a spot, somewhere.

As always, we welcome your feedback on this new procedure.
 
From a pilot's perspective it went well.

This was my first time in HBC. Everything was great!

My only complaint would be the number of sinks in the shower house.

Thanks to all that made it go so well!

Bob
 
Now that everyone is home from the big show and all our camping gear is safely dried out and packed away, it's time to debrief this. We had a huge turnout this year; close to but not quite a record number of RVs and the highest nightly turnout in HBC ever. So, it made for a good acid test for a new procedure. Some observations, which need to be archived for next year:

1. Overall it worked quite well, and we'll probably do it again next year.

2. It was well publicized ahead of time. Folks were taxing up holding up fingers before they even got to the sign explaining why. You did your homework.

3. Even for the unexpecting it worked well. A few seconds of reading and pondering and the fingers were raised. The slow-down effect on traffic was minimal.

4. We did not take detailed measurements, but the distribution was about 60% to #3 (close to facilities,) about 25% #1 (up front) and 15% #2 (in the back.) We did our best to accommodate but will adjust accordingly next year.

5. We kept this up until about noon on Sunday. By that time things had filled up enough that the three areas pretty much ran together, not to mention we were too busy with arrivals to take the time. So consider noon Sunday to be the cutoff for "getting there early."

6. To the poor soul who got their just before airshow time on Tuesday and plaintively held up one finger as we led you to a spot way in the back... sorry. If you want a good seat to the show, get there early. By noon Tuesday you're lucky to have a spot at OSH, let along you choice.

That brings up another point- the website folks asked me early in the week if we wanted the HBC status to be listed on the EAA website along with North 40 camping (ie. 90% full, closed, etc.) I turned them down and here's why- unlike in N40, Homebuilt never actually "fills up." When we get full, we get creative and look for ways to shoehorn planes into un likely spaces. When that runs out we can always send them to the far south end of the airport, ie. "North Fond du Lac." We will never turn a showplace (homebuilt, antique or warbird) way from Oshkosh. N40, by contrast, can divert to FDL or Appleton when they "get full." So, not wanting to have someone look at the website and say, "gee, HBC is 98% full, I probably won't find a spot so I won't go," we deliberately left our status off the website. Come on in and we'll always find you a spot, somewhere.

As always, we welcome your feedback on this new procedure.

It was our first Oshkosh this year. We would have liked to be able to camp close to the HBC area because this is where the builders are. Isn't it possible to reserve a small area for builders that are not yet finished in a corner of the field near the fence? Maybe tents only on a first come first serve basis? Just an idea.
 
This was my first Osh and I thought it went great ! I was parked in row 320 back by the fence but that's because I got there on Sunday around 6:00 PM... so if I want anything better next year I'll get there earlier. I was actually pleased with the showers and the facilities. The Port-A-Potties were cleaned timely and the shower houses seemed to be busy early in the morning but that's no one's fault. I made it a point to get up, go for a walk/run, get my coffee and breakfast and walk around and see the planes then go to the showers mid morning... that seemed to work great.

Anyway, looking forward to next year :D
 
I didn't get a chance to get his name, but the gentleman who handled us (three times) was simply outstanding. I couldn't ask for more. I was concerned I wouldn't get a spot, but I got one EXACTLY where I wanted.

What would I change? Nothing. It was a fabulous experience and these are some really great folks.

I waved at Jeff a few times but he didn't wave back. That whole focus thing, I guess. :D
 
New HB area to the NW

I too got in late in the afternoon on Sunday and was at first disappointed that I was in row 320 in the new area for HB camping. In the past I was always closer to the old trailer showers in HBC which was convienent. But after having such easy and direct access to the new North 40 shower house I realy liked the spot. If EAA does not put in a new shower facility for HBC next year I would request an option 4 fingers for the new addition to the north west. Thanks Friday and your team for another great job handling AC traffic on the ground.
 
Jeff,
Thank you and your team for your excellent service. You guys make it so easy. Thank you. It was a spectacular time as always.
 
Update for 2015

This thread details a new procedure for parking in the Homebuilt Camping area at Oshkosh. We started this last year (2014) and it was a pretty big success, so we plan to do it again in 2015. If you are not familiar or did not fly in last year, go back to the beginning of this thread and read it. Go ahead, we'll wait for you here.

While we plan to do this again, 2015 will be slightly different. EAA has decided to move the HBC facilities (shower, coffee building and tent) to a different location at the west end of the HBC area. The below picture explains it.

c92b121ccd3b6af55aef888ce1f3931e.jpg


The current location is shown in red, and the blue area is where they will be moving to. This will naturally have an effect on the "1,2,3" system of parking, since what used to be "in the back" is now actually much closer to the facilities.

After much internal deliberation, we decided to keep it simple and use the same numbering system as last year. We will do our best to get everyone to the type of spot that they desire, keeping in mind that there will come a time when the best spot available might not be your first choice. Last year that occurred around noon on Sunday.

Also, keep in mind the new best-kept secret in HBC, which is the new North 40 shower house. For those folks in the far north end of HBC, that shower house is quite a bit closer than the HBC showers, and nicer to boot! That won't help you for the morning walk to coffee, but it is some consolation. Also, EAA reportedly has a new vendor for the shower trailers, so the old one that has served HBC for years will be replaced, and there will be two of them this year.

I look forward to seeing everyone in a few weeks. As always we welcome your feedback. Fly safe and READ THE NOTAM!
 
Jeff, last year, I was parked about 50 yards from the N40 showers. Will that be an option this year? At first, I was a little concerned being away from the masses in HBC, but after getting to know the lay of the land, I actually prefer that location.

BTW, that was Monday morning, 0930 and traditional HBC was slam full.
 
It's possible, but it will be luck of the draw. We generally try to fill that area last, as it is quite a ways away from everything. If you arrive on Monday again there is a good chance you will end up there, but no promises.
 
The past couple years, I made it a point to walk from HBC to the new N40 showers. They're nice. No waiting and no shortage of hot water either.... well worth the walk. The best time for a nice hot shower is towards the end of the afternoon air shows... No waiting whatsoever.
 
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The helicopter noise does not bother me much, but the noise from the movie and from the bars do. I love being in HBC but will probably try to get into N40 camping this year to be farther from the noise. EAA also has that lighted parking lot across the road from HBC and last year it seemed like the lights were doing a better job of lighting up HBC than lighting the parking lot.

Oh, and what's a curmudgeon?
 
Can someone describe the location of the N40 showers on the photo? I've got 15 hours left on my Phase 1 fly off and if I can get it done we're shooting for camping in HBC for the first time.
 
KC Boys, or at least Ripper

Remember to use the index finger for number 1! Don't tell them you need to go number 2.

See you all there.
 
Can someone describe the location of the N40 showers on the photo? I've got 15 hours left on my Phase 1 fly off and if I can get it done we're shooting for camping in HBC for the first time.
Well, actually, the N40 showers are not depicted on the photo used. If you use your imagination though it would be roughly in between the two paragraphs just above the '2015' in the text just above the picture posted.
 
Those showers weren't there when this photo was taken in 2011. I'll try to post a better one later buts it's about 150 yards north of the edge of this photo.
 
The bath-house is in the top circle. The bottom circle filled with cars, was HBC overflow last year. I was parked in the extreme north west of the area. There was one plane north of me.
OSH.JPG


Osh-2014.jpg


BTW, the ground was super hard. I twisted off a cork-screw tie-down. Found two new ones at the flea market.
 
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if we'r emaintaining the same numbering system, won't #2 and #3 mean the same thing? Or is the idea that #1 is up front, #2 is middle and #3 is far back.

Also, for the record, complaints of noise at oshkosh crack me up. :p
 
After much internal discussion, we are not changing the numbering. Yes they may run closer together. Will evaluate for next year.
 
Alton, Im in the row right in front of you, almost in the middle of the photo. Not a bad spot but a long way from the show and coffee. Love the N-40 shower and yes, the noise from the beer tent is loud and the lights in the parking lot are bright.

Ive been told to stop being an old fart, who likes to go to bed when the sun goes down, and go join in the party! :D
 
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