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Gamut Services carbon fiber canopy

videobobk

Well Known Member
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I have had LOTS of questions about the canopy I bought from Gamut Services. They now have a website about the canopy for RV-6's and 7/9's (yes, they are different) and their RV-8 baggage doors. Also about up-coming products. If you are interested, go to http://www.gamutservices.biz and check it out. To be up-front about it, I am helping promote their products. As one of the first customers, and having a background in promotions, I am doing this to help pay for the canopy system. That being said, if it wasn't a great product, I wouldn't promote it. I wouldn't even have bought it!

Bob Kelly
 
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videobobk said:
I have had LOTS of questions about the canopy I bought from Gamut Services. That being said, if it wasn't a great product, I wouldn't promote it. I wouldn't even have bought it! Bob Kelly
Bob, that is great. To promote it I think most of us would like some data, pictures and detailed explanation of how it installs and how it's different than stock. I am guessing you haven't installed it yet? Keep us posted.

Remind me what is the cost of the carbon canopy system and what the credit is for parts left stock parts left off, in other words total cost? (I see the answer is on the web site: "Price on the CCS system (complete with ALL materials except paint to finish your canopy) is $3400. After your deductions from the standard Van's kit, total cost is just over $2000" )

I think my main question is that the canopy is exact fit for the fuselage that was used for a mold. My experience is Van's metal tube frame does not fit perfect and you have to tweak it (bend, pull, push) into shape. No doubt part of that is the tube canopy frame, but there are variation's in the fuselage dimensions.

How do you adjust the carbon canopy system to fit your own fuselage, since you can't bend it into fit or shape?

Thanks
 
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Remind me what is the cost of the carbon canopy system and what the credit is for parts left stock parts left off, in other words total cost?

I think my main question is that the canopy is exact fit for the fuselage that was used for a mold. My experience is Van's metal tube frame does not fit perfect and you have to tweak it (bend, pull, push) into shape. How do you adjust this to fit your fuselage, since you can't really bend it into shape? [/QOUTE]

The cost is $3400, minus what Van's allows by deducting a bunch of parts. I don't know the exact amount as I deducted the motor mount and some other stuff also, but it is $1200-$1400. That is something we need to really tie down. I will ask Charles to ask some of the recent buyers.

I don't think you could call anything that wasn't molded off of your fuse an EXACT fit, but it is incredibly close! They made the top of a fuselage from Van's parts and molded off from that. I would guess the biggest gap I had (and yes, I installed mine and test fit another to my fuse earlier) was well less than 1/8". A strap under the bottom of the plane pulls it down tight while the epoxy sets up. I also used a couple of 1/8" clecos. The slider fits like a glove, especially after you latch it. It really seals at the back. The sides have a seal which I haven't installed as yet, so I can't comment there. The slider-to-windscreen seal is molded in place and I haven't done that either. That should take less than an hour.

Installing the front is a couple hour job. Installing the slider, maybe three-four hours. Now, you still have to do the filler around the front edge and that takes time, I would think the same as on Van's system. It depends on just how particular you are. It is pretty slick to have everything setting in place 30 minutes after you open the box.

Bob
 
Has rollover testing been done?

Do you know if they have done any testing to verify that the roll over protection is equal to the original design?

There didn't appear to be anything on there web site about it.
 
They have a canopy that will be tested, but as yet it hasn't been. The rollbar itself is a composite of steel, carbon fiber and kevlar that is quite strong, exceeding the strength of 4130 tubing. It does absorb shock differently. Technically, everything looks great as to protection, but a true test will come later. I really don't know the numbers, but Charles Wilhite would be more than happy to pass better information on to you. As with any new product, there are many questions the developer can best answer. He really has been helpful in talking with me as I had all kinds of questions. I am comfortable with it. Give him a call or e-mail. The phone & e-mail are on the website.

Bob
 
The website now has some better pictures of the RV-8 baggage door. Go to the "Products" page and click on the "baggage door installation" link. Charles wrote the instructions and they give some insite into working with carbon fiber, plus the pictures are more descriptive.

Bob Kelly
 
Carbon Fiber...and read the correction in the P.S.

Bob,
This looks like someone has done a lot of homework, and the results are quite impressive. Carbon fiber certainly offers some material properties that make it attractive as a design material for aerospace applications. The only concern I would have as a potential customer is how the possibility of corrosion is addressed. This is not meant to be a Pooh-Pooh on a good idea. But with over 5 years experience with carbon fiber on the Space Shuttle, I can tell you that carbon fiber and aluminum don't like each other, with aluminum being the loser. As long as you prevent contact of the aluminum with the carbon, you should have no problem. Otherwise, you have a galvanic battery with corrosion of the aluminum at an unacceptable rate. However, I didn't see any concerns or precautions on the web page for the interested customer. Also, the installation instructions should make sure that with normal wear and tear, the aluminum is protected from contact with the carbon.
Please note that I'm not talking about contact of aluminum with the resin, so this would be a long term concern with proper installation. However, it could become a shorter term concern if someone doesn't know and puts a rivet or aluminum fastener through the matrix.
I hope I haven't started another primers war. I did check with a NASA materials engineer who has a lot more experience (about 15 years) than I, and he verified my concerns.
Don Hull

P.S CORRECTION...I just re-read the instructions on the baggage door and found the following:

"The purpose of this layer of adhesive is to keep all the metal parts out of contact with the carbon parts. The electric potential sets up a galvanic corrosion hot spot. So make a mess with the glue, (USE GLOVES) and make sure no metal is touching any carbon fiber."

So the warning is there, but it's not obvious. My recommendation is to more plainly make this warning obvious up front on the home page or at least on the intro page on each product. Carbon fiber is a wonderful material for aero applications, but customers should be advised of the drawbacks, too.
 
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rv7boy said:
Bob,

P.S CORRECTION...I just re-read the instructions on the baggage door and found the following:

"The purpose of this layer of adhesive is to keep all the metal parts out of contact with the carbon parts. The electric potential sets up a galvanic corrosion hot spot. So make a mess with the glue, (USE GLOVES) and make sure no metal is touching any carbon fiber."

So the warning is there, but it's not obvious. My recommendation is to more plainly make this warning obvious up front on the home page or at least on the intro page on each product. Carbon fiber is a wonderful material for aero applications, but customers should be advised of the drawbacks, too.

Don,

Thanks for the heads-up! I know Charles made that very clear to me, and I think his instructions try to make that clear to installers, but I will pass this on. Perhaps a basic "working with carbon fiber" page is in order as not many people have done it, and as I found, there are some definate differences.

Bob
 
I must say if this was out six months earlier I would have bought it, and if I build again I most certianly will. I found the canopy to be the one part of construction I least enjoyed.
I
 
RV-7 w/ new carbon fiber canopy to be at Osh

I hear the RV-7 is JUST out of the paint shop will make it about Sunday or monday. If you are interested, call me (during the show only) on 812 701-5454.

Bob Kelly
 
What ever happened to this company? I need to retrofit an older RV6 Tip-up with stiffeners and I am trying to figure out my options.

Thanks,
D
 
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