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  #11  
Old 11-23-2018, 10:04 PM
rvbuilder2002's Avatar
rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nzrv8 View Post
It is (or was in 2009 anyway) SW PG-60-G2 wash primer. Personal experience has shown me that it isn’t much good for corrosion protection (but might be better than nothing); but it does provide an excellent adhesion for a more durable primer if you wanted a bit more protection.
I would be interested in hearing about your personal experience because it is contrary to what 16 years of exposure testing has shown me

Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotjohnS View Post
I Think Vans have test couponns outside and have periodically checked the corrosion preventiveness of the primer; the results were excellent. But be careful because it does contain chromium 4 and nasty solvents, so personnal protections need to be taken.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock View Post
Yes, do a search. Seems like the test coupons have been outside exposed to the elements for a very long time (10+ years?) and still show no signs of corrosion. I think it's great stuff. Light and easy to spray.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Avgas View Post
Vans have openly admitted that they use the SW product because it is "inexpensive, dries fast, and is easy to apply" but also acknowledge that "the manufacturer says it needs a top coat".

Additionally Vans states: "Though some disagree it is generally accepted that two-part epoxy primers provide the best corrosion resistance. However, they are expensive, toxic, heavy and dry slowly making them problematic for the home builder. If one can tolerate these issues and desires an RV that would be in good shape for grandchildren to inherit, then two-part epoxy primers may be the "best" solution."
Actually the very best corrosion protection requires carefully following some multi step Mil spec processes, which are labor intensive, costly, and hazardous to the environment and the workers involved.

As was mentioned above, if you ask Sherwin Willliams, they do recommend top coating the P60 G2 for full corrosion protection.
As was also mentioned above, a test sample has been hanging outside (but under cover so not to be exposed to UV) at Van's (60 miles from the Pacific ocean coast line) since early 2003. Every four years or so a primed portion of the test piece has been exposed to check the metal condition. So far at 15+ years it has always looked like it did the day the P60 was sprayed. The portion of the test piece that was left bare when coating was originally applied has had surface corrosion steadily developing since day one, as well as any area where the coating has been removed for inspection, begins to develop surface corrosion.

So, regardless of what the manufacturer says, P60 G2 seems to a substantial amount of protection at very little cost and labor effort. For people that are willing to invest a lot of additional effort and money, great. That is what home building is all about. But I am convinced by the testing that has been done, that using other processes is extending the useful life of an RV airframe very little (if any) additional amount than the P60 does.


BTW, the above quote says "may be the best solution". That was written many many years ago. When that portion of Section gets updated again, there will be qualifiers added.......
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Hubbard, Oregon
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
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RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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  #12  
Old 11-23-2018, 10:44 PM
rv9builder rv9builder is offline
 
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Location: Irvine, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
The portion of the test piece that was left bare when coating was originally applied has had surface corrosion steadily developing since day one, as well as any area where the coating has been removed for inspection, begins to develop surface corrosion.
Scott,
How bad does the bare test piece look? If the inner surface of a wing skin or a rib on a completed RV had a similar amount of corrosion, would you still consider it airworthy, or would you be concerned that it wasn't going to last much longer?

Thanks,
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  #13  
Old 11-24-2018, 07:15 AM
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nzrv8 nzrv8 is offline
 
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I?ll try and find some photos Scott. My corrosion was on the inside of the lower skins, light filliform easily removed with scotchbrite. The epoxy primed parts nearby weren?t affected. Humid environment, and it may have been poor preparation rather than the product as it was localised corrosion not widespread. I?ve got no science to back me up here, and it seems like overall people are happy with the QB primer. I epoxy primed as a precaution with no further issues.
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  #14  
Old 11-24-2018, 10:28 AM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rv9builder View Post
Scott,
How bad does the bare test piece look? If the inner surface of a wing skin or a rib on a completed RV had a similar amount of corrosion, would you still consider it airworthy, or would you be concerned that it wasn't going to last much longer?

Thanks,
Even the area that has been exposed since the test piece was hung outside is just surface corrosion that has not caused any detectable pitting, etc., and it would still be considered airworthy.

Usually the most serious corrosion issues occur between parts (lap joints of skins, areas where skins and ribs or bulkheads mate together, etc.) where moisture can become trapped and stay in place for extended periods of time.

The test sample doesn't simulate that, but the test results convince me that the P60 is doing a good job in these areas as well.
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Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.

Scott McDaniels
Hubbard, Oregon
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
FAA/DAR
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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  #15  
Old 11-24-2018, 01:42 PM
rv9builder rv9builder is offline
 
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Thanks, Scott!
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  #16  
Old 12-23-2018, 07:51 AM
Lizard Lips Lizard Lips is offline
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Longview, Texas
Posts: 81
Default QB Primer

Quote:
Originally Posted by parabuzzle View Post
Does anyone happen to know what primer they use to prime the parts when they do the Quickbuild stuff?
I had the privilege of touring Van's QB assembly facilities in the Philippines this past Spring. The primer they were using was:

Wash Primer Green
SWP-600
"Sphero" Brand

Wash Primer Catalyst
SWPC - 1000
"Sphero" Brand

Wash Primer Reducer
SWPR - 2100
"Sphero" Brand

Joe Reaves
Longview, TX

RV-14A Empennage Complete, Awaiting Fuselage & Wings
Arion Lightning LS-1 ? Flying
Dues paid thru 2019
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  #17  
Old 04-17-2019, 06:37 PM
mikebee mikebee is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Oakland, CA
Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rv9builder View Post
Scott,
How bad does the bare test piece look? If the inner surface of a wing skin or a rib on a completed RV had a similar amount of corrosion, would you still consider it airworthy, or would you be concerned that it wasn't going to last much longer?

Thanks,
Following up on this since I was researching recently. Here's the Facebook post from Vans a few years ago with a picture of the test piece:
https://www.facebook.com/vansaircraf...363901667872:0
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  #18  
Old 04-17-2019, 08:55 PM
Lizard Lips Lizard Lips is offline
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Longview, Texas
Posts: 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lizard Lips View Post
I had the privilege of touring Van's QB assembly facilities in the Philippines this past Spring. The primer they were using was:

Wash Primer Green
SWP-600
"Sphero" Brand

Wash Primer Catalyst
SWPC - 1000
"Sphero" Brand

Wash Primer Reducer
SWPR - 2100
"Sphero" Brand

Joe Reaves
Longview, TX

RV-14A Empennage Complete, Awaiting Fuselage & Wings
Arion Lightning LS-1 ? Flying
Dues paid thru 2019
I have since checked with the manufacturer and the Sphero brand is not available anywhere except in the Philippines. Bummer.
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  #19  
Old 04-29-2021, 01:14 PM
MikeThePilot MikeThePilot is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Morinville, AB, Canada
Posts: 15
Default QB Primer

Hey, reference the Van's news release on 22 March 2021, does anyone know which new primer is being used on QB kits?

"We have also changed the primer being used by the contractor in the Philipines due to a lack of availability of the original primer from the supplier there. This is a permanent change, and the new primer has been evaluated and accepted by Vanís."
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  #20  
Old 07-03-2021, 03:17 PM
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A36Lee A36Lee is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Charlotte
Posts: 38
Default Vanís new QB primer

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeThePilot View Post
Hey, reference the Van's news release on 22 March 2021, does anyone know which new primer is being used on QB kits?

"We have also changed the primer being used by the contractor in the Philipines due to a lack of availability of the original primer from the supplier there. This is a permanent change, and the new primer has been evaluated and accepted by Vanís."
Has anyone learned yet which primer Vanís is now using on QB kits?
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