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BEST Electronic, Ignition?

I would also put Electroair into the mix.

Spent a bit of time talking to them at Reno last weekend, and was very impressed with what they had to say. I was impress with their crank trigger mechanism that did not require any drilling of the case or flywheel.

BTW, they just received FAA certification on some models and are close to the cert for the rest of the line-----------if such is important to you.

http://www.electroair.net/index.html
 
Define "Best".

Ultimate performance? Reliability? Ease of installation?

I think pMag takes the ease of installation award, but beyond that, the water is muddy, particularly around reliability.
 
Best electronic ignition

If this helps you, I have had the light speed II on my RV 8 (IO360 A1-B6) for 700 hours now and it has performed flawlessly. I have a regular mag on the other side and have had to spend $500.00 + in repairs/overhauls AND had to buy expensive aircraft plugs once already. Go with TWO electronic ignitions and you won't regret it !
 
LS Plasma III

Very happy with LS
450 hours on my RV8 and now 200 on my 10.
Same set up , one mag and one EI
Easy installation, easy starting and smooth running.
 
I just started my engine today, dual EFII system.

It's worth the time to read through the install manuals for EFII, ElectroAir, Pmags and Lightspeed to find the system that best fits your airplane/mission. Adding or deleting switches on the panel, more holes in the firewall and electrical redundancy (aux batteries/alternators/ebus) are important factors. Also learn the difference between capacitive and inductive ignitions.

I chose EFII because i liked the crank sensor and installation better than other brands. The EFII ignition seemed to be newer than the other brands but the couple of reviews I found were positive. I also like the possibility of upgrading to the EFII fuel injection in the future. After installing the system I am very satisfied with the quality of the parts especially the customer service Robert gives.

Read the install manuals and then call the suppliers directly, it will make your decision easier.

Good Luck!
 
Well, when I test ran my G3i in the cell at Mattituck, it really was noticeable!

IMG_0004.JPG


We rigged it up on a test board and triggered it from the control console.

IMG_0278.JPG


When the ignition came on the engine dramatically smoothed out! We were all impressed!

You modify your existing mags to interface with the module and it really wakes them up!

If you lose electrons, the system reverts to standard mag function.

Very good system!

;). CJ
 
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We Have a Forum for That!

You might take a look over here in the VAF forums dedicated to Electronic Ignitions:

http://www.vansairforce.com/communi...1&pp=53&sort=lastpost&order=desc&daysprune=-1

There are six pages of threads that should keep you reading for hours. Of course, asking what is BEST is nothing but trolling - every person who bought one of the various systems thought it was best, so they are all right, or all wrong. You need to define "Best" in your terms. Of course, there are three truisms when researching choices on the 'net:

1) Everyone will defend their own choice.
2) Most people have only tried one selection - they might have opinions on the others, but no experience with them.
3) You will see more complaints than praise - people post about problems, not about the perfectly routine flight they had today.

Have fun researching - it's a good question.
 
Best Eltronic Ugnition

Best is for long Life and service. Little background: 2003 RV6 Io360 with DUAL Electroairs. Total Time 800 Hrs, many changes and adjusments to get working good. Tried one Mag, One Pmag (back to the factory3 times, last time with a broken shaft right after take off) so you see I have a little experance with Electric Ignition . By the way Saturday The 3rd Board in the electrair burned out on the way home. Abou 700 to 800 And 8 to 10 years on thes units. The other one that got me home is going to be removed because I am sure It is next to go. Thanks for all the input, I am still working on the next thing to do. Dick
 
Running Pmag x2, over 100 hr on O-320, had a main power bus failure at 100 ft on take off. Engine ran just fine until I turned onto taxi way post landing and rpm dropped to 700 rpm with reduced throttle, it then got real quiet.
Very happy with them.
 
I have 60 hrs on my first P-Mag and have just installed the second and could not be happier with the performance and ease of installation.

Cheers
 
Over 400 hours on LSI. with Hall Effect Module. Not one problem. Timing is always right on. Instant starts and great economy. With one Bendix till it needs O/H, then another LSI will be added.
 
Am I the only one trying to figure out why this thread is in the classifieds instead of the discussion forums?

To the OP - there is a TON of info on this in the other forums...do a search and you will be reading for hours. However, you may find, as I did, and as Paul stated, that everyone has strong opinions and they usually directly conflict with a bunch of other strong opinions. You might as well ask which color is better. It seems that any of the common options have a strong following.

Take a stroll through the proper forum and you will find plenty of info.
 
EFII

I recently removed my Lightspeed Plasma II+ Ignition system and do believe that the EFII is the most modern and well engineered electronic ignition available for Lycoming engines today. The choice is ultimately yours, and there are always products that fit well in some situations, but not in others. I'm still running a Slick Mag but not for long. I plan on upgrading to the dual EFII ignition very soon, and am already considering a longer-term transformation to EFII's fuel injection as well. Take a look at the competitive ignition report on the EFII website:

http://www.flyefii.com/ignition/ignition_comparison.htm

EFII system installations in progress on multiple aircraft,

Chris Randall
KWHP, CA
 
I really like my P-Mags. Installation...SIMPLE, Periodic maintenance...SIMPLE, re-timing..SIMPLE, Decision...SIMPLE.
 
Light my fire...

Need to make a change, looking at light speed and EFII by R Paisley. Which one is best. And why. Thanks, Dick. [email protected]

Dick,

Great (email) chatting with you recently! As I mentioned I have put over 3000 hours on three different Electroair Ignitions, all the older Jeff Rose versions having bought Jeff's original system in 1997. Their newer systems are a quantum leap forward from mine and certified by the FAA. All three gave (and still give) me solid performance increases over the mag they replaced. Issues over the years were minor, mainly plug wires and finding a 14MM Automotive spark plug I liked (Autolite 386) and rigging the crank trigger on my IO-540. I have also helped a friend maintain 2 P-Mags which I have flown extensively (Lancair 320) and is a solid, simple, excellent product and the least expensive. I have also helped maintain a LSE Plasma 2 for a friend which worked well when it was working. Working with LSE is another story...

I have to add that having a Mag/EI setup (as you know) isn't optimum for performance as the Mag always fires at 25BTDC while the Electronic systems advance the spark, mine as much as 40BTDC throttled back up high. I reduced fuel burn 1 GPH and on my HR2 the performance gain was easily 5HP. The current draw is .5A inflight with my single Odessey battery and SD8 alt and my entire electrical system only using 5.1A inflight. Contingencies/power failure? If I have alternator failure inflight utilization of load shedding allows operation of the EI for one hour easily. P-Mags are self contained/powered.

What would I do different? Have dual EI, no Mag.
My dos centavos...

V/R
Smokey

PS:With the issues you mentioned maybe you should consider the G3I. You could utilize your existing Mags and still have very effective EI.
 
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I would also put Electroair into the mix.

Spent a bit of time talking to them at Reno last weekend, and was very impressed with what they had to say. I was impress with their crank trigger mechanism that did not require any drilling of the case or flywheel.

BTW, they just received FAA certification on some models and are close to the cert for the rest of the line-----------if such is important to you.

http://www.electroair.net/index.html


I believe the electroair uses a collar that clamps around the prop shaft? That's one of the things that was a negative in my book. I like the efii unit. Their crank trigger mounts with no drilling or tapping either and is a much more modern unit.
 
I believe the electroair uses a collar that clamps around the prop shaft? That's one of the things that was a negative in my book. I like the efii unit. Their crank trigger mounts with no drilling or tapping either and is a much more modern unit.

Yes, the Electroair unit uses a clamp on timing wheel. There is no need to remove the prop and flywheel.

The EFII requires removal of prop, and your flywheel needs to be drilled and magnets installed. http://www.flyefii.com/EFII_desc.htm
 
I believe the electroair uses a collar that clamps around the prop shaft? That's one of the things that was a negative in my book. I like the efii unit. Their crank trigger mounts with no drilling or tapping either and is a much more modern unit.

Electroair has a mag pickup housing.

Also, Electroair's current product is substantially different than the hardware they originally sold or what Jeff Rose sold, so "yesterday's" feedback on Electroair may not be relevant to today's product. One interesting thing is that the Electroair ignition is the Electromotive EI from the automotive world with a mag housing and with the advance curves adjusted for our use. If you pull up the Electroair manual and compare it to the Electromotive manual, the wiring diagrams are identical. Nothing wrong with that, just interesting. Same thing for the components - they are essentially re-labeled Electromotive units.

Several people have posted their opinion that the Pmag is the best choice. I have one, but I also recognize its limitations. It has an unpublished spark advance curve, a weaker, shorter duration spark than other EI units, and is subject to vibration and heat issues due to being bolted directly to the engine. Easier to install than other EI's? Yes. Easier to install than a mag? No. Better performance than a mag? Yes. Better performance than other EI's? No - probably less performance than most others.

There are compromises with all of these products - you just have to choose the best set of compromises for your circumstances. Me? I chose a pMag to replace my 13 year old Electroair because the new Electroair units come with a separate brain box which needs to be installed on the cold side of the firewall, and that requires a lot of wires to pass through the firewall. That was a deal breaker for me. With the pMag, I figure I get better performance than with a Mag, but without all of the wiring and installation hassle of most of the other EI's. Ask me in a decade and I'll comment on the unit's reliability.
 
Not in need, indeed!

I believe the electroair uses a collar that clamps around the prop shaft? That's one of the things that was a negative in my book. I like the efii unit. Their crank trigger mounts with no drilling or tapping either and is a much more modern unit.
WM,
You only need a crank trigger on the IO-540, Electroair built the first Hall Effect monitor that they call the Mag Timing Housing still offered for the 0-320/360. It plugs right in the mag hole, you set your engine at TDC on #1, remove the timing pin and you're done!

Mine still works great after 10 years.

http://www.electroair.net/experimental_ignition_kits.html

V/R
Smokey
 
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I recently removed my Lightspeed Plasma II+ Ignition system and do believe that the EFII is the most modern and well engineered electronic ignition available for Lycoming engines today. The choice is ultimately yours, and there are always products that fit well in some situations, but not in others. I'm still running a Slick Mag but not for long. I plan on upgrading to the dual EFII ignition very soon, and am already considering a longer-term transformation to EFII's fuel injection as well. Take a look at the competitive ignition report on the EFII website:

http://www.flyefii.com/ignition/ignition_comparison.htm

EFII system installations in progress on multiple aircraft,

Chris Randall
KWHP, CA

I don't have an opinion about which is better, but I do have a question for the electronics experts about some of the comparative data shown on the EFII web site. In their graphs and text they report the following approximate numbers:

EFII: 1.2 amps, 36 millijoules, 2.2 millisecond duration. Dividing millijoules by milliseconds I get 16.4 watts (1 watt = 1 joule per second). Based on the equation watts/volts=amps, you have 16.4/13.8=1.2 amps, which agrees with the reported current draw. So far so good.

Plasma II+: 1.5 amps, 13 millijoules, 0.25 millisecond duration. Dividing millijoules by milliseconds I get 72 watts. This works out to 72/13.8=5.2 amps. This is not even close to the reported current draw. I have a Plasma II+ and I'm pretty sure it doesn't draw 5 amps.

Am I missing something or are the data for the Plasma II+ incorrectly reported? (keep in mind I'm a geologist and not an electrical engineer!)
 
Plasma II+: 1.5 amps, 13 millijoules, 0.25 millisecond duration. Dividing millijoules by milliseconds I get 72 watts. This works out to 72/13.8=5.2 amps. This is not even close to the reported current draw. I have a Plasma II+ and I'm pretty sure it doesn't draw 5 amps.

I think you have a math error, I get 52w which is 3.7A (doesn't explain the current draw though but pretty sure like said above it peak vs avg pwr)
 
On each spark, the strike voltage is high until the ion path is established. after that, the voltage required to maintain the spark is much less, so the actual power required to maintain the spark decreases even as the ignition coil field collapses. Peak Vs Average power.
 
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Ignition power calcs

I won't go through all the calculations,
But the system current draws are related to average power over time that the system pulls from the aircraft electrical system. The average current draw is consumed partially by the control electronics and partially by the creation of sparks.

Spark energies, spark currents, and spark voltages are things that only exist for a very short amount of time during the engine cycle. These numbers do not translate into average system power levels. If you like math, you can calculate the average power of the sparks during an engine cycle (two sparks per rev on a four cylinder), the power consumed by the control electronics is the difference between the average system power and the amount of power involved in making sparks.

Don't worry, all the numbers stated are correct. The results are much more interesting than the details of the calculations.

Robert Paisley
 
I won't go through all the calculations,
But the system current draws are related to average power over time that the system pulls from the aircraft electrical system. The average current draw is consumed partially by the control electronics and partially by the creation of sparks.

Spark energies, spark currents, and spark voltages are things that only exist for a very short amount of time during the engine cycle. These numbers do not translate into average system power levels. If you like math, you can calculate the average power of the sparks during an engine cycle (two sparks per rev on a four cylinder), the power consumed by the control electronics is the difference between the average system power and the amount of power involved in making sparks.

Don't worry, all the numbers stated are correct. The results are much more interesting than the details of the calculations.

Robert Paisley

Thanks for the explanation; makes sense that the spark itself is only part of the total power consumption.

From the graphs it appears that that the inductive system has higher total spark energy, but the CDI spark is actually more powerful for the short time it lasts (52 watts vs. 16 watts). Does this have any practical significance, or are voltage and spark duration all that really matter?
 
E-Mag P model question

If two E-mag P models are installed and your battery is dead or very low and needs a charge and you have no back up battery, can it be started by hand?

E-mag site says no back up mag or battery needed and will work as long as engine is turning but will hand propping turn the engine fast enough?
I'm thinking no.
Is there any electronic system out there that has a built-in backup mag so you can run two electronic units.
Those E-Mags sure do look nice.
 
Spark energy

Thanks for the explanation; makes sense that the spark itself is only part of the total power consumption.

From the graphs it appears that that the inductive system has higher total spark energy, but the CDI spark is actually more powerful for the short time it lasts (52 watts vs. 16 watts). Does this have any practical significance, or are voltage and spark duration all that really matter?

Hi Alan,
The spark voltage is a function of the size of the spark gap and the combustion chamber pressure. Electrically, the spark gap looks like a zener diode. It take a certain voltage to jump it regardless of what power source is providing the energy. CD ignitions run out of sufficient firing energy very quickly. They do pump more current through the spark for a short time as you mention. But the spark may not be lit when a burnable mixture gets to the plug during excessively lean or rich operation.

A long duration spark has a better chance of lighting an excessively lean or rich mixture. This benefits lean of peak as well as max power operation when the mixture may not be optimal. When the mixture is optimal, long duration may not matter much.

Robert
 
Hi Alan,
The spark voltage is a function of the size of the spark gap and the combustion chamber pressure. Electrically, the spark gap looks like a zener diode. It take a certain voltage to jump it regardless of what power source is providing the energy. CD ignitions run out of sufficient firing energy very quickly. They do pump more current through the spark for a short time as you mention. But the spark may not be lit when a burnable mixture gets to the plug during excessively lean or rich operation.

A long duration spark has a better chance of lighting an excessively lean or rich mixture. This benefits lean of peak as well as max power operation when the mixture may not be optimal. When the mixture is optimal, long duration may not matter much.

Robert

Rob - very clear explanation, thanks.
 
If two E-mag P models are installed and your battery is dead or very low and needs a charge and you have no back up battery, can it be started by hand?

E-mag site says no back up mag or battery needed and will work as long as engine is turning but will hand propping turn the engine fast enough?
I'm thinking no.
Is there any electronic system out there that has a built-in backup mag so you can run two electronic units.
Those E-Mags sure do look nice.
There's a story of someone wiring a small 9 volt battery into their ignition when there battery was dead. That's enough to hand prop the engine with dual pmags. Then just keep the rpm up! And I wouldn't do it for an IMC flight.
I just installed dual pmags and I love them. I removed my Lasar system after too many problems and difficulty getting parts and service these days.
 
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