Skyview panel component placement

VAFers,

I'm planning on an Aerosport panel with two 10 inch Skyview HDX units.

With the large units and the Aerosport panel restraints it seems like the only location available for the three small Dynon panels is above the main units.

This would be for the knob, autopilot and comm panels.



Does anyone have a similar panel in currently?

Are there any access/reach issues getting at the three small panels that high on the panel?

Any other comments?

az_gila said:

VAFers,

I'm planning on an Aerosport panel with two 10 inch Skyview HDX units.

With the large units and the Aerosport panel restraints it seems like the only location available for the three small Dynon panels is above the main units.

This would be for the knob, autopilot and comm panels.

Does anyone have a similar panel in currently?

Are there any access/reach issues getting at the three small panels that high on the panel?

Any other comments?

Click to expand...

I did something similar. I have AFS screens and slightly different accessories. It looks like it should work.

Give Geoff a call. He can mock up in Solidworks to see if things fit, then cut the insert too if you want him to do that. I believe that Dynon has all the Solidworks components online.

rleffler said:

I did something similar. I have AFS screens and slightly different accessories. It looks like it should work.

Give Geoff a call. He can mock up in Solidworks to see if things fit, then cut the insert too if you want him to do that. I believe that Dynon has all the Solidworks components online.

Click to expand...

Thanks, but I'm not really worried about the fit - there's lots of room for the not very deep Skyview parts - I'm more concerned with the operational aspects and the ease of use.

Will it be a pain in the *** to get at the small buttons up that high on the panel?

I don't think reach will be an issue. I have short arms, and can easily reach my Trio autopilot high in the stack. In some ways it's easier, as you can glance out the windscreen and turn the knobs at the same time.
I would check, though, that they're low enough for the view to not be blocked by the glare shield. This depends somewhat on your seated height. Give some thought to lighting for night flying (under the glare shield lip?).

BobTurner said:

.....
I would check, though, that they're low enough for the view to not be blocked by the glare shield. This depends somewhat on your seated height. Give some thought to lighting for night flying (under the glare shield lip?).

Click to expand...

Thanks I'll check the blocking soon when I visit a few local RV-10s looking at interiors...

As far as lighting goes, all of the boxes in the picture, except for the ELT monitor, are internally back lit and controlled by the Skyview HDX with a built-in automatic light level control.

The switches below all going to have back lit icons/labels (see my previous thread on Carling switches) so at this time I'm thinking the left side of the panel won't need any strip lighting under the glare shield.

Gil if you fly IFR you're gonna love that screen setup. I gives you so much flexibility in screen layout to give you the information you need right in front of you in an easy to read format. Also the right seater can see the right hand screen well enough to fly from that side as well. If it were mine tho I would put the the upper units in the following order - knob panel, autopilot panel, radio then annunciators. I would also shift all those units to the left with the autopilot panel directly above the map shown on the right hand panel. For IFR you will use the knob and autopilot panel all the time and want them front and center. The reach is just fine at that location and very convenient.

With that two screen layout I would set it up with the plate on the left half of the left screen then the PFD and no engine instruments, then on the right screen use it for a full map with engine instruments on the bottom or half and half with the engine instruments if you want to see them in large scale. You're going to want to use at least 1/2 of a screen full height for your plates or you will haft to scroll to get the information you need for an approach.

I am also considering a similar layout, but does it put the GPS navigator too far to the right for the pilot to use?

That layout should work fine, but if you have the Aerosport armrest I would recommend putting the knob panel on the front of the armrest then put the AP panel where the knobs are now in your drawing. With the knobs on the armrest you can adjust those 3 things with your arm on the armrest without looking at them. This is especially helpful in turbulence. The knobs panel is set up in a way that the knobs are easy to feel which is which without looking.

Thanks

Thanks Jesse and Jrskygod. Good points and I hadn't even thought of putting the knob panel on the front of the armrest.

So a newer version with the knob box relocated, the other small panels moved and five indicators added to keep the GTN-625 TSO happy since it is offset too far right from the center-line.

Not shown is the proposed avionics stack with a Garmin G5 for back-up - GTN-525 TSO GPS navigator and a GTR-200 comm #2 radio. Even though the G-5 is angled a bit to the pilot it should be OK for a right side pilot to use.

The audio panel will be located on the Aerosport lower console.



Again, thanks for the comments. I'm not IFR rated at the moment, but want to be when the -10 is ready.

Gil good idea on the annunciators. You will be able to easily work the GTN but you will not be able to readily see the annunciation on the radio because it will be too far from your scan. You do need to add two momentary contact switches to your annunciator panel for the susp / one and nav/ gps functions. Don't forget the toga button. On the sticks a good place for that if able. That works really well when you get it set up.

GPS only

Jrskygod said:

Gil good idea on the annunciators. You will be able to easily work the GTN but you will not be able to readily see the annunciation on the radio because it will be too far from your scan. You do need to add two momentary contact switches to your annunciator panel for the susp / one and nav/ gps functions. Don't forget the toga button. On the sticks a good place for that if able. That works really well when you get it set up.

Click to expand...

I was planning on a GTN-625 GPS only unit and went by this from the IM -

The external GPS Navigation annunciator unit must contain, at a minimum, the following annunciations:
• INTEG, INTG or LOI
• TERM
• APR
• MSG
• WPT

Are the switch inputs you mention only used if you have a VOR/GPS unit?

PS The reason for getting this sorted out now is to get my fuselage wiring completed. Jesse's good idea of moving the knob panel to the armrest just added another 9 wire Skyview network cable into the mix instead of it being a short, behind-the-panel cable.

They will be used to switch from for/ ILS to gps mode after a missed approach as well as to either suspend hold navigation or continue navigation on exiting a hold. It is very convenient to have them right in front of you and by the autopilot controls otherwise you have to look over to the radio and find the button to push to execute.

Consider not mounting the two EFIS displays side by side.

In my RV-10 the GTN-650 and audio panel are between the two displays. The GTN-650 display is marginal at best - having it mounted over in right field makes it even less useful.

My thoughts:
- The EFIS displays should be as high on the panel as possible.
- The left display is biased left, the center space for the GTN-650 is as narrow as possible and as high as possible but below the center support bracket.
- The right display is then just to the right of the GTN-650.

This leaves room for at least two Dynon modules (radio, knob panel or Autopilot panel) to the left of the left display, making good use of that space.

There is room above the GTN-650 for an analog airspeed and/or altimeter. I had both in the panel but the next plane will have just the analog airspeed.

The right display is perfectly fine for the pilot to see. I normally keep the engine monitor on that and the moving map set a a longer range than the moving map on the pilot side. Flying right seat is not much different than flying left seat.

Note, panel photo was taken before adding the Dynon Knob module horizontally below the Dynon radio module.

Carl

You say you are planning to use an Aerosport Products panel, but your layout appears to be on the stock Van's panel. Suggest you do the layout on the Aerosport panel you are planning to use, as some of the panel space is unavailable for the avionics due to the non-flat panel.

I don't have experience with the Dynon/AFS hardware, but in the layout of my Garmin G3X system (granted I included 3 of the 10" EFIS units) I found that I couldn't fit the EFIS and a G5 beside or above the EFIS with the Aerosport 310 panel. So I have placed the G5 in its own box above the glare shield in order to get everything to fit.

If you intend to work with a panel shop such as Aerotronics or Stein, suggest you talk to them early and have them do a preliminary layout in CADD with the specific Aerosport panel you intend to use. They can generally do this quickly as they have past designs with the Aerosport panels and most common avionics and so can quickly do an accurate scale layout.

Enjoy the panel layout exercise. It is an area of the design that you can make very personal.

DRMA said:

You say you are planning to use an Aerosport Products panel, but your layout appears to be on the stock Van's panel. Suggest you do the layout on the Aerosport panel you are planning to use, as some of the panel space is unavailable for the avionics due to the non-flat panel.

I don't have experience with the Dynon/AFS hardware, but in the layout of my Garmin G3X system (granted I included 3 of the 10" EFIS units) I found that I couldn't fit the EFIS and a G5 beside or above the EFIS with the Aerosport 310 panel. So I have placed the G5 in its own box above the glare shield in order to get everything to fit.

If you intend to work with a panel shop such as Aerotronics or Stein, suggest you talk to them early and have them do a preliminary layout in CADD with the specific Aerosport panel you intend to use. They can generally do this quickly as they have past designs with the Aerosport panels and most common avionics and so can quickly do an accurate scale layout.

Enjoy the panel layout exercise. It is an area of the design that you can make very personal.

Click to expand...

My pictures were made in TurboCAD with the panel dimensions directly from the Aerosport Dual 10" EFIS DXF file. They are accurate. I will create the panel just like I did for my RV-6A. When the layout is fixed I'll replace the pretty pictures with all of the cutouts, strange holes and associated nut plate holes in TurboCAD and have the panel cut by Up North Aviation.

You may be thinking that the picture from Carl F. was mine, and it does appear he has a stock panel. Go to post #9 for my plan for the Aerosport left side dual 10" EFIS panel.

Added -

This is the planned avionics stack shown in the angled center portion of the Aerosport Dual 10" EFIS panel. Note that the picture is of a GTN-650 but I am planning a GTN-625 GPS only - same box and screen size.

Sorry. I see now that what you are showing is the panel insert that goes into the Aerosport carbon fiber panel. Since I've been focused on the Aerosport 310 panel which has 3 more symmetrical inserts I forgot they have one with such a large insert, so it looked like a portion of the standard Van's panel to me. My mistake.

DRMA said:

Sorry. I see now that what you are showing is the panel insert that goes into the Aerosport carbon fiber panel. Since I've been focused on the Aerosport 310 panel which has 3 more symmetrical inserts I forgot they have one with such a large insert, so it looked like a portion of the standard Van's panel to me. My mistake.

Click to expand...

No problem... at least someone is looking...

Part of the need for panel component layout is to determine where all of the wire ends I have installed will ultimately meet a connector at the panel or sub-panel.

Here is my first cut at a mock-up -



A lot more room than the -6A and the foam VPX box is currently being replaced by Stein with a nice shiny red one.

Next plan is to properly mount the Aerosport panel, transfer the foam board component cutouts to the real subpanel and determine the subpanel hole needed for the GTN unit.

It seems that general RV-10 builder opinion is to have as much of this area completed as possible before moving onto adding the cabin top.

Now progressed to foam cutouts on the real sub-panel with the Aerosport panel frame in place. ARINC box on the far right out of the pic -



Panel components depth check next and sub-panel cutout for the GTN unit.

The two black parts are ExpressPCB custom "cable hubs". I'll share more details when they are completed -