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Answer to many questions

LAMPSguy

LAMPSguy

Well Known Member
This started as a response to DR's question on the front page (see pg 62 I think).

Many of us are not very good at reviewing. So here you go, this is what I have been telling my students for a while now:

Grab a friend (pilot or not, if not, find someone who you want to become a pilot or at least share the love with), grab an IFR low (high if you fly up there), VFR sectional and a TAC. Now get a copy of the FAA document that tells you what it all means. https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/flight_info/aeronav/digital_products/aero_guide/media/Chart_Users_Guide_12thEd.pdf

Go review. It makes us all better and I guarantee no matter how much you teach or fly, you will most likely come upon something you didn't know or forgot.

I make it a habit of not asking when I don't know. I go look it up (in an OFFICIAL publication) and then go teach everyone else I can find. Remember, you do NOT need to be a CFI to teach others what they may have forgotten!

Enjoy the fun that learning should be!
 
Charts

I have a good one: what does objectionable mean on a VFR(Sectional or local) chart?? The answer is rather vague, I understand the concept but don't completely understand why it needs to be on a chart.
 
I knew it was ‘don’t use me’, but I didn’t know WHY until this morning when I got a message from a FAA buddy.

[FONT=Verdana","sans-serif]"…usually some sort of restricted area or warning area is nearby or overlaps the 4 mile width each side of center."[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana","sans-serif]Learn something every day, I tells ya.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana","sans-serif]v/r, dr[/FONT]

[FONT=Verdana","sans-serif]PS: I’ll include the pic:[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana","sans-serif]
VAF_586%20Dec.%2020%2008.59.jpg
[/FONT]
 
jrs14855 said:
I have a good one: what does objectionable mean on a VFR(Sectional or local) chart?? The answer is rather vague, I understand the concept but don't completely understand why it needs to be on a chart.
Click to expand...


Here is what Google told me:

"Upon completion of the airspace review, and the airspace has not passed the review process, the airspace is deemed objectionable. When this occurs the airport will be printed on the VFR chart with the words OBJECTIONABLE next to it."

http://expertaviator.com/2012/07/31/what-is-an-objectionable-airport/


Should be a temporary thing
 
My thought...I don't work for the FAA

?157.7 FAA determinations. (a) The FAA will conduct an aeronautical study of an airport proposal and, after consultations with interested persons, as appropriate, issue a determination to the proponent and advise those concerned of the FAA determination. The FAA will consider matters such as the effects the proposed action would have on existing or contemplated traffic patterns of neighboring airports; the effects the proposed action would have on the existing airspace structure and projected programs of the FAA; and the effects that existing or proposed manmade objects (on file with the FAA) and natural objects within the affected area would have on the airport proposal. While determinations consider the effects of the proposed action on the safe and efficient use of airspace by aircraft and the safety of persons and property on the ground, the determinations are only advisory. Except for an objectionable determination, each determination will contain a determination-void date to facilitate efficient planning of the use of the navigable airspace. A determination does not relieve the proponent of responsibility for compliance with any local law, ordinance or regulation, or state or other Federal regulation. Aeronautical studies and determinations will not consider environmental or land use compatibility impacts.

(b) An airport determination issued under this part will be one of the following:

(1) No objection.

(2) Conditional. A conditional determination will identify the objectionable aspects of a project or action and specify the conditions which must be met and sustained to preclude an objectionable determination.

(3) Objectionable. An objectionable determination will specify the FAA's reasons for issuing such a determination.

(c) Determination void date. All work or action for which notice is required by this sub-part must be completed by the determination void date. Unless otherwise extended, revised, or terminated, an FAA determination becomes invalid on the day specified as the determination void date. Interested persons may, at least 15 days in advance of the determination void date, petition the FAA official who issued the determination to:

(1) Revise the determination based on new facts that change the basis on which it was made; or

(2) Extend the determination void date. Determinations will be furnished to the proponent, aviation officials of the state concerned, and, when appropriate, local political bodies and other interested persons.


I take it as the FAA has determined that the airport (usually a private one) isn't "smart"...ie may conflict with airspace, etc. but they cannot rule against it, so it is charted as objectionable so people know to be safe and careful around it. Think of it like an Alert area where they have no jurisdiction to place an Alert area.
 
What the FAA says...

jrs14855 said:
I have a good one: what does objectionable mean on a VFR(Sectional or local) chart?? The answer is rather vague, I understand the concept but don't completely understand why it needs to be on a chart.
Click to expand...

The vague FAA answer..

What does "OBJECTIONABLE" stand for on VFR Charts?

"OBJECTIONABLE" indicates an airspace determination per FAA Joint Order 7400.2J Section 4, Airport Charting and Publication of Airport Data, issued February 9, 2012. When you see this indication on a chart be sure to refer to the applicable Airport/Facility Directory for more information. FAA Regional Airports Offices are responsible for airspace determinations. Address any challenges to objectionable airspace determinations to your regional airports office. Contact Information for FAA Regional Airports Offices.

And the FAA document referenced...

http://www.faa.gov/documentlibrary/media/Order/AIR.pdf

I sort of see it as items that don't meet FAA standards (such as conflicting traffic patterns) and are listed in the A/FD
 
Interesting IFR stuff

DR brings up a good point.

IFR approach separation standards(I am not a controller, and these are from memory)I am on duty tonight, ill look it up at work!:
a. Positive separation 3 miles horizontally, 1000 ft vertical
b. 5 miles or more from approach to center.
Others not applicable to this discussion.

Here is another strange one, like DR's issue. That 3 miles must not be violated. We have an instrument approach at work that directly abuts a Restricted area...so our 3 mile "bubble" goes into the area, but ATC does not have control over the aircraft in the restricted area...so if it is active (EVEN IN IMC) I cannot shoot the approach IFR!!!!!

Here is the plate!

http://155.178.201.160/d-tpp/1513/01909IZR32.PDF
 
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