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Panel mod idea

bret

bret

Well Known Member
Show me your SUB panel, just a slight take off of the sticky, I'm in the panel planning stage and I would like to put everything, space allowing, on the panel behind the panel, ground forest, fuse blocks, D9 panel, ect, then fabricate a 14X7 swing out picture frame to mount the Dynon 10" com, intercom, AP, and Baro knob panel onto. My main concern is being able to change out a fuse in flight, and not having to go contortionist under the panel....EVER....well, almost not as often as almost never ever..........
 
Panel

Tip-up or slider? Oh, sorry see it's a slider. Had some ideas for the tip up
 
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bret said:
Show me your SUB panel, just a slight take off of the sticky, I'm in the panel planning stage and I would like to put everything, space allowing, on the panel behind the panel, ground forest, fuse blocks, D9 panel, ect, then fabricate a 14X7 swing out picture frame to mount the Dynon 10" com, intercom, AP, and Baro knob panel onto. My main concern is being able to change out a fuse in flight, and not having to go contortionist under the panel....EVER....well, almost not as often as almost never ever..........
Click to expand...

I am at the same stage and also interested in ideas.
 
Before I started hinging the panel for inflight access, I'd ask the question - why are you changing a fuse in flight? What is so important that if the fuse blew, you had to chaneg it to land? And how can you ensure that the cause of the short isn't still there, so the second fuse won't blow?

If you have flight-critical fuses, you might consider putting them in a separate panel that is easily reachable.
 
Sub Panel

bret said:
Show me your SUB panel, just a slight take off of the sticky, I'm in the panel planning stage and I would like to put everything, space allowing, on the panel behind the panel, ground forest, fuse blocks, D9 panel, ect, then fabricate a 14X7 swing out picture frame to mount the Dynon 10" com, intercom, AP, and Baro knob panel onto. My main concern is being able to change out a fuse in flight, and not having to go contortionist under the panel....EVER....well, almost not as often as almost never ever..........
Click to expand...

Here's what I've done on a tip-up RV-7A. The sub-panel was constructed by placing .040" 2024 T3 Alum between two 3/4" plywood forms (with rounded corners) shaped to the desired sub-panel shape. The 1/2" metal edges were then slowly hammered over the plywood edges, allowing compound curves. The top edge was formed "UP" so it could be mounted to the lower edge of the panel. The lower edges were formed in the opposite direction (so they face towards the firewall). A brace (to the next forward bulkhead) was added near the throttle cable mounting area to make the sub-panel more rigid.

In my case, the panel was re-made from the stock panel, allowing more total height, or more length below the sidewall decks, so that the air vents could also be mounted on the sub-panel. LED switch lighting was also added (flat strip above the switches) where the sub-panel mounts to the panel.

Hope this helps....

Paul, note that I don't have any circuit breakers of fuses accessible during flight on my panel. All fuses are ONLY accessible while on the ground. I like my electrical design to be more like my car, but with enough redundancy so that if anything fails, I can still safely get to my destination ....


PICT1455.jpg
 
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I think you were asking about the sub panel behind the main panel, but if not, please disregard.

I put everything except the VPX and the ground tabs on the sub panel. The ground tabs are on the inner firewall.

For my tipup I had to make sure I marked the inner edge of the tipup frame on the sub panel. That's what most of the blue tape is for.

I made white paper cutouts of each piece and taped them to the sub panel and then drilled the units in place. You can see some of the white and the tape.
You have to make sure to allow space for the connector plugs and attachment flanges. Some are quite large.

I removed the support ribs and used the radio tray as a replacement sub panel support.


8468088f-60ac-4efd-ba8a-870421d7e786_zpsjwk8fgzp.jpg




DSCN1096_zps253ee23f.jpg
 
Sub Panel

bret said:
Show me your SUB panel, just a slight take off of the sticky, I'm in the panel planning stage and I would like to put everything, space allowing, on the panel behind the panel, ground forest, fuse blocks, D9 panel, ect, then fabricate a 14X7 swing out picture frame to mount the Dynon 10" com, intercom, AP, and Baro knob panel onto. My main concern is being able to change out a fuse in flight, and not having to go contortionist under the panel....EVER....well, almost not as often as almost never ever..........
Click to expand...

I guess I misread your question when I posted above. Here's what I did for the mounting all the fuse blocks and black boxes in N924RV.

All fuses are located on the front deck ribs. All the avionic boxes are mounted on the shelf over the rudder peddles as well as the batteries. The front deck has been modified with access panels to allow full access to the rear of the radio stack, fuses, and all other electronics. The pictures below are from various stages of construction.

Wiring%20Left%20Bay.jpg


P3100056.jpg


Wiring1.jpg


N926RV%20Access%20Panel%201.jpg


Hope this helps....
 
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Great thread!

Hi Guys,

This is a very timely thread for me, too .. I've just finished fitting the forward deck and am beginning to figure out where to put everything.

Keep posting photos!
 
Agree with Paul about an inflight reset/replace of a blown/popped fuse. In the airline world an inflight reset of a breaker is only checklist directed or at the captains discretion due to safety of flight reasons. On the ground maintenance resets all breakers with a logbook entry for tracking. I had a checkpilot relay a personal experience where they reset a breaker inflight that caused a small fire back in the day that he's never forgot :eek: our policy is leave it out and check it out.
 
Thanks for the pics guys, My plans are to do something similar to post 6, so ok, no replacing fuses and no wiring repairs on final, I get it, just trying to design a no under the dash to fix stuff plan, just getting started with wiring, fun stuff!
 
another question, who has the flap switch on the stick and who has it on the dash, I understand it is more wiring with it on the stick, just looking for some pros and cons.....
 
I have flaps switch on the panel. I feel a certain amount of nervousness at the thought of anything on the stick that could cause damage if bumped in turbulence such as flaps and starter. I know you can have a defeat switch on the panel or other fancy ways of trying to ensure it doesn't get inadvertantly activated, but I never had a problem with reaching for flaps on the panel. That said, build it like you want it. If you think you would like it, just minimize the risks.
 
My flap switch is just left of the throttle on the sub panel.

I use the VPX flap software so I only have to bump the switch once for 10 degrees, again for 20 and a third time for 40 degrees. One bump up and the flaps fully retract.

I like the fact that I don't have to hold my finger on the flap switch.

The switch is very convenient when I have my hand on the throttle during takeoff and landing.
 
My flap switch is on the stick. The switch is Off in the middle, Momentary for flaps down and On for flaps up. My system (VP-200) also has a "flaps inhibit" based on a configurable airspeed. The flap motor automatically switches off at the end of its travel as well. This switch configuration works great for go-arounds and circuits, however I would consider the end of travel shutoff mandatory.

My RV-4 had the switch on the panel; I prefer the switch on the stick. YMMV.
 
bret said:
another question, who has the flap switch on the stick and who has it on the dash, I understand it is more wiring with it on the stick, just looking for some pros and cons.....
Click to expand...

Both. On the stick for me, and on the panel for flying from the right seat. Requires a flaps relay, but I wanted one anyway.
 
Flaps, trim, starter and radio flip/flop and autopilot disconnect on the stick with Composite Designs 3 way relay and PHAviation up stop limit switch to be installed on the flap below the actuator. Co-pilot stick will have a panel switch to disable all buttons on the right side.

One hand flying, the other is throttling or mixing.
 
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bret said:
another question, who has the flap switch on the stick and who has it on the dash, I understand it is more wiring with it on the stick, just looking for some pros and cons.....
Click to expand...

I did both. The panel switch is right near the throttle and I always use it. I am typically trimming the elevator while the flaps go in on downwind and using the hat switch would require me to trim after flap extension. I don't see ever using the stick based flap switch and may change it to a low speed elevator trim switch. I made a voltage reducing circuit for this.

quite a bit more wiring/fab for dual switches. In addition to the standard relays, I recommend an isolation component in the circuit in the event that both switches are simultaneously activated you don't create a short. You have a 50% chance of that happening on polarity reversing motor controls. In this case, using one switch disconnects the other from the circuit.
 
Modified panel and sub panel

I don't have time right now to post pictures but I highly modified my sub panel to accommodate accessories. I used a composite panel with inserts for everything. I believe the structure is stronger than stock. The mods allow for access to everything by removing the EFIS screens.

I know some have put access panels in the front skin. Personally, they ruin the great looks of the front of the RV. Also, after talking to a couple of guys that have installed them, they said the actual access to components is somewhat limited and they wouldn't do it again.

Regarding putting the flaps on the stick, don't do it. There is too much going on and accidental activation is too real of possibility. Especially in turbulence. Not good. The caveat to that is if you are using the VPX you can set them to an airspeed value to prevent activation. Flaps on the stick could cause issues in the event of a critical go around. Activating the flaps on the stick, while controlling in a critical phase of flight is just not worth it. Put the flaps right next to the throttle so both can be activated with one hand.

I'll put some pictures up later of the mods I made.
 
bret said:
another question, who has the flap switch on the stick and who has it on the dash, I understand it is more wiring with it on the stick, just looking for some pros and cons.....
Click to expand...

More wiring? I don't think so, IMO. The flap motor wire run is relatively short if going to a relay in the floor. From there, it receives connections from the stick and power/ground from the panel.

If using the Infinity grip, the flap switch is momentary down/off/up. You can achieve the same thing with a panel switch but I like the idea of keeping my non-flying hand available for other tasks. I can also type with all my fingers and thumbs, so maybe that has something to do with the decision. :D
 
Bret,

I initially thought the hinged shelf was a cool idea. As I started working on it I decided in my configuration I would be creating a bunch more work. I finally decided to just mount my fuseblocks on the sub-panel. I don't have any of my G3X boxes yet. Those will come later. I guess its possible that I may decide later to add the hinged shelves, but for now I'm trying not to get side tracked on any more customizations than I already have.
 
I have three 12 slot buss fuse units mounted on subpanel, 13 switches on l corner, and working on a .250 T6 plate. it will swing open with the hinge on the R, I will have an 8X15" opening to the subpanel, I am going to set up my Dynon like on their home page, ( when I have the funds...) It sounds crude and weird right now but I think it will be ok. going with the 3M carbon fiber 3D wrap......sounds better than sticker ;-)
 
panels, etc

I have an RV6A slider which was recently finished and has flown somewhat more than 50 hours. I did three things to make life easier. I extended the bottom of the panel about an inch lower to have extra room for switches, throttle, and various controls. I put all of the critical electronics on pull circuit breakers and put addition circuits protected by fuse in a sub panel behind the Dynon 180 in my main panel. The fuses are for non essential items such as fans, etc. Between the panel and the firewall, I built shelves to mount avionics boxes which can all be removed from underneath. Everything is connected with plugs. I give credit to Jason Smith at Aerotronics for the plug layout and wiring the panel.
I don't like crawling under the panel too often and there are still things that need access from above. To address that, I put four inspection panels just to the rear of the firewall in front of the windshield. I do not take credit for the idea, but it has worked really well for maintaining the avionics. The inspection panels are sealed by gaskets made in place and have many screws to hold them with uniform pressure. They have not leaked
My experience with stick controls is that you should fly a lot so that they are instinctive. If you don't, the panel is a good place to put switches that are not used too often, like flap controls. When it is turbulent, your thumb on the top of the stick will bounce places you don't expect. This is personal opinion.
I have many pictures with details, but don't have a URL to insert them here. Send me a pm or email if you would like some.
 
Everything on the Sub-Panel

A rather dark photo of the panel. Dynon Skyview D1000, Garmin GDU-375.

2bfee73518e64c.jpg



Construction photo showing the whole sub-panel with the front panel removed

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Some Close Ups:

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Fuse Panel folds down. Custom map box fits in above the fuse panel but below the Safety Trim control box.

P7200375.JPG
 
Related - Modular Radio Rack

Thanks! You might be interested in looking at THIS post. Several photos of the radio rack module I made that fits through the hole in the sub-panel visible in the photos I posted to this thread. All wiring from the radio rack module terminates in a 25-pin D-sub (audio cables) and a 50-pin D-sub (everything else).
 
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Another idea or two

I used backplates with nut plates on them to keep from having to try and hold a washer and nut behind the sub panel while mounting remote boxes. Also tried to keep all hex head screws pointing toward the cabin for easy access through the EFIS holes. Shown is a plate with 4 nut plates, but sometimes I used two pieces with 2 nut plates each; also used Z channel to span over box on front of sub panel. Double sided tape can be used to keep the backplates on if desired.

2z5llop.jpg


I also made slide on tabs with nut plates for things like the VP-X box so that it would "hang" onto the rib flange while I inserted the screws (eliminating holding the box at the same time as trying to get a screw started).

30sf4gj.jpg
 
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