I would like to get some opinions on the market value of a RV-6A slider. It is a 1996 model, 500 hours on the airframe, 1400 hours SMOH on a O-320 with high age, constant speed prop, no glass panel, old cessna radios, no panel gps. The airplane, paint and interior is in good condition. Thanks for the help.
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RV-6A Value
- Thread starter ten4teg
- Start date
woodmanrog
Well Known Member
Based on your information I would think between 40-50K would be reasonable.
Jerry Cochran
Well Known Member
Sounds pretty dated. If you paid $40k tho I think you'd be in good shape...The prop is a plus long as it's in good shape.
Good luck
Good luck
walkman
Well Known Member
I spent about 6 months last year carefully watching the market and calling people once ads disappeared. First, many if not most of the high priced 70k+ aircraft are not sold, just taken off the market. Second, fancy paint jobs including pseudo warbirds and special fade jobs etc do not add to the value and often detract as they are usually only attractive to the owner and may increase maintenance cost/effort to keep nice looking (in the eye of the owner) going forward. There seems to be no premium for tail/nose wheel or slider/tip up.
A basic 150hp -6 with about 1,000 hours in good condition, no damage history, basic but nice paint, metal prop, day/night VFR, steam gauges, xpdr, encoder, a single nav/com and some sort of decent handheld gps is about $40k. Engine time adjustments are figured at overhaul cost/TBO. Add 4k for o-360, add 4k for c/s, add the high average used price for extra avionics. No such thing as sweat equity in these planes, otherwise the would all be 200k. Make usual adjustments for identified issues, extra nice paint/interior, personal taste and remember it is a used plane not a new one and nothing's perfect.
I can send you my pricing spreadsheet if you like. Pm me.
I think based on what u have listed it is probably worth less than the others have mentioned. Old avionics aren't worth much, the engine time is a 6,000 reduction (check don George's price list), if the prop is in good shape it could partially offset that. I would hazard a very loose guess at anywhere from 35-40 depending on the condition of the interior and exterior, engine etc.
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Jerry Cochran
Well Known Member
Walkman,
We are on exactly the same page re pricing of 6's except I do it in my head and memory, no spreadsheet. But if you send me a copy of same I would love to see it.
Right now there are 2 -6's on Conroller with exotic paint jobs, probably costing $10 k that only maybe Salvador Dali could love. Prices keep going down, no takers...
One would have to price in a strip/repaint for another $8-9K to make any sense. Feel sorry for them.
.
We are on exactly the same page re pricing of 6's except I do it in my head and memory, no spreadsheet. But if you send me a copy of same I would love to see it.
Right now there are 2 -6's on Conroller with exotic paint jobs, probably costing $10 k that only maybe Salvador Dali could love. Prices keep going down, no takers...
One would have to price in a strip/repaint for another $8-9K to make any sense. Feel sorry for them.
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I guess that goes to show how personal paint is on an airplane. If it were me? I wouldn't repaint either of them. If anyone didn't like the paintjob after I flew in somewhere, i'd just point out that I didn't build it. If anyone did like it, i'd say "thanks very much!"
Also keep in mind, that red paint jobs are next to impossible to cover with anything but another red paint job (at least, not cheaply). So what you end up with isn't likely to be a massive difference from what you started with anyway.
walkman
Well Known Member
Lol I'm pretty sure I know which ones you are talking about. Personally I'm a huge Dali fan. In fact my two Siamese cats were named Picasso and Dali. Kandinsky was just too much of a mouthful.
I've gotten at least ten requests for my worksheet. I will clean it up then post a link to it. I did build one for -4s as well. It I'm not sure if I still have it. If I do I will include.
*********** Just PM me for a link if you want it. No -4 info any more. Remember its several months out of date and market conditions have likely changed.
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Mile High Relic
Well Known Member
Walkman, I look forward to seeing the spreadsheet when posted. I thought about doing something similar, but I'm not that comfortable cold calling people, even if it is to talk about airplanes.
I'd have thought the base number would be just a little higher, but it is hard to argue with evidence gathered directly from the sellers. I just don't recall seeing any O-360 C/S prop planes out there for $48K (after discounting the asking price). $55K seems about the base for that combination, assuming a normal paint job.
Maybe all this just confirms I paid just a little too much when I bought my 6. The seller thinks it sold a little too cheaply, so I guess were even. I'm actually very happy with the plane.
The red Dali plane isn't my favorite, but it isn't the as bad as the snoopy plane that was for sale last year. IMHO.
I'd have thought the base number would be just a little higher, but it is hard to argue with evidence gathered directly from the sellers. I just don't recall seeing any O-360 C/S prop planes out there for $48K (after discounting the asking price). $55K seems about the base for that combination, assuming a normal paint job.
Maybe all this just confirms I paid just a little too much when I bought my 6. The seller thinks it sold a little too cheaply, so I guess were even. I'm actually very happy with the plane.
The red Dali plane isn't my favorite, but it isn't the as bad as the snoopy plane that was for sale last year. IMHO.
rv-6a value
$ 35K for an average 1996 rv-6a seems very low. the insurance companys are not reflecting this decrease in value.
i know some cessna drivers have been forced to decrease the hull value (because of the decrease in market value)
what say you rv drivers who carry hull insurance? insurance requring you to lower your hull value because the market value has decreased??
just my thoughts on the subject and if you disagee ,i still respect your opinion.
.......my best to you all...lawrence...
$ 35K for an average 1996 rv-6a seems very low. the insurance companys are not reflecting this decrease in value.
i know some cessna drivers have been forced to decrease the hull value (because of the decrease in market value)
what say you rv drivers who carry hull insurance? insurance requring you to lower your hull value because the market value has decreased??
just my thoughts on the subject and if you disagee ,i still respect your opinion.
.......my best to you all...lawrence...
Jerry Cochran
Well Known Member
Consider this.
I believe in insuring my RV at the price at which I would sell it if a a guy came in and wanted it today... Insurance companies can give you a surprise if you understate the value as they can total it and give you a check for that amount.
Happened to a guy I know.
.
I believe in insuring my RV at the price at which I would sell it if a a guy came in and wanted it today... Insurance companies can give you a surprise if you understate the value as they can total it and give you a check for that amount.
Happened to a guy I know.
.
Sam Buchanan
been here awhile
True. And if over-insured, they may fix a wreck that you wish was totaled.
I tried to sell my similar RV-6A a while ago for around 40k. It's a 1999 RV-6A with an o-320-e3d but with a fixed pitch sensenich and a 30 foot paint job. I've put a pmag on it and I just put in a new MGL xTreme efis in it. The problem with it is that the builder put a midtime Lyc on it with spotty logs. Buyers see this and run away because there are so many planes from which to choose. I've resigned myself to selling it for what I owe ($25k). I guess my point is that it's worth whatever someone will pay for it, and many sellers just don't want to face that reality.
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RBD
Well Known Member
I couldn't agree more. As one who obsessively monitors the classifieds (you never know when the next super-deal will be posted), I've noticed that asking prices tend to fluctuate based on....other asking prices. Shocker, I know. Right now, I'd say that many of the RV-6(A) asking prices (high $40k's to mid $50k's) are really just about right; especially considering that the actual sales prices should be a few grand less.
RV-4 asking prices on the other hand, are high right now (RV-3's too, sheesh). Few people actually solicit advice like the OP has when listing their plane for sale, and instead (I assume) simply price their plane in relation to the current listings - who can blame them, really? This results in the aforementioned pricing fluctuations, as all it takes is one or two hopeful (read: unrealistically high) asking prices to drive up nearly all other asking prices. Looks like the average RV-4 asking price right is in the low $50k's. Maybe everyone has caught on to how well RV-4s fly (RV-3B + 1, right?
) and this is the new, true market price....but I highly doubt it, especially for 0-320 fixed pitch models. I suspect the average will come back down into the low to mid-$40s, which in this guy's opinion, is the real market value. If anyone stumbles upon another beautifully built 0-360 C/S RV-4 for less than $40k, let me know please.
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Mike D
Well Known Member
Mile High Relic hit on an important point. There is an education process that happens for both buyers and sellers. At some point the buyer comes to the realization that in order to get a well built and good looking plane, he is going to have to pay. Also many sellers think they have a diamond, but as they burn through the potential buyers hopefully they can take off the rose colored glasses.
Which leads me to a very important criteria for me. The build quality.
I can repaint a plane (but don't want to). I can easily redo the panel (and did). And most engines will have years on them if properly maintained. But it is very difficult and expensive to rebuild a plane.
I did not come to believe that build quality was a top criteria until I had spent a lot of money "browsing" the available planes. I saw a lot of @?&$. I have a friend who has spent a lot of money rebuilding what was on the surface a good looking plane. Paint has a way of becoming rose colored glasses for buyers.
So, for me, give me a well built airframe, a well maintained engine, and a fair price.
For the OP's question, it would be hard to give a price without pic's and some more info. But the prices mentioned are in the ball park. $40 - $50K sounds about right assuming build and engine are good.
Which leads me to a very important criteria for me. The build quality.
I can repaint a plane (but don't want to). I can easily redo the panel (and did). And most engines will have years on them if properly maintained. But it is very difficult and expensive to rebuild a plane.
I did not come to believe that build quality was a top criteria until I had spent a lot of money "browsing" the available planes. I saw a lot of @?&$. I have a friend who has spent a lot of money rebuilding what was on the surface a good looking plane. Paint has a way of becoming rose colored glasses for buyers.
So, for me, give me a well built airframe, a well maintained engine, and a fair price.
For the OP's question, it would be hard to give a price without pic's and some more info. But the prices mentioned are in the ball park. $40 - $50K sounds about right assuming build and engine are good.
walkman
Well Known Member
I found numerous aircraft that sold for around what I figured the price should be based on my calculations. I bought my airplane for less than two grand over my calcs. Something Americans don't do well, and seems to be counter-cultural, is negotiate
PM me if you want it. Remember, its quite out of date at this point. The market might well have bottomed out several months ago.
A $55k advertised price on a thousand hour VFR O-360 C/S and you can't get them down to $48k or so? I don't recall seeing any basic VFR 360 C/S airplanes at all however, all the 360 c/s airplanes seemed to be IFR and/or glass panel.
Personally I've thought that the fairest deal is the one where both the buyer and the seller both think they could have made the deal a little sweeter.
walkman
Well Known Member
depends on your definition of "average". I said $40k for a mid-time day/night vfr o-320 with a very basic panel.
walkman
Well Known Member
walkman
Well Known Member
This is my first experimental bird, and I will say I'm surprised how folks think that A/Ds, especially engine A/D's don't apply to them. One guy I talked to was outraged and offended because I told him his engine was basically a core because he had no engine log and couldn't tell me whether any A/D was complied with or even how many hours were on the airplane.
BTW I know where there is an average to slightly rough RV-6 with an IO-360 and new composite C/S prop, 155, gx-60, stec 50 that could probably have for $25-30k. It has been wrecked and rebuilt about 5 times through
walkman
Well Known Member
I couldn't agree more. As one who obsessively monitors the classifieds (you never know when the next super-deal will be posted), I've noticed that asking prices tend to fluctuate based on....other asking prices. Shocker, I know. Right now, I'd say that many of the RV-6(A) asking prices (high $40k's to mid $50k's) are really just about right; especially considering that the actual sales prices should be a few grand less.
RV-4 asking prices on the other hand, are high right now (RV-3's too, sheesh). Few people actually solicit advice like the OP has when listing their plane for sale, and instead (I assume) simply price their plane in relation to the current listings - who can blame them, really? This results in the aforementioned pricing fluctuations, as all it takes is one or two hopeful (read: unrealistically high) asking prices to drive up nearly all other asking prices. Looks like the average RV-4 asking price right is in the low $50k's. Maybe everyone has caught on to how well RV-4s fly (RV-3B + 1, right?
totally agree. In fact, I believe that condition flip-flopped. When I first was looking at buying a four, over the summer, they were priced at a good $10-15k below 6's. I had found a couple that were really nice at the $40ish mark. Then my g/f looked at the rear seat.....
Cadstat
Well Known Member
6A-Get an inspection
Low 50's but add 10% to make repairs and first conditional. I missed the run out mags and it cost me big time for over haul. Look too at the guy who built it and find a nearby RV owner to help with your pre buy. Even with the fresh inspection you can get burned. The best is a pre buy by a independant A&P then negotiate the price. And don't buy one you are afraid to fly home. My buddy is the 4th builder of a 6A and the plane still in only 50% finished. I would pay more to buy from the original builder.
Low 50's but add 10% to make repairs and first conditional. I missed the run out mags and it cost me big time for over haul. Look too at the guy who built it and find a nearby RV owner to help with your pre buy. Even with the fresh inspection you can get burned. The best is a pre buy by a independant A&P then negotiate the price. And don't buy one you are afraid to fly home. My buddy is the 4th builder of a 6A and the plane still in only 50% finished. I would pay more to buy from the original builder.
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Louise Hose
Well Known Member
I missed this discussion the first time around. (I'm not really interested in -A model discussions.) When I went to buy my -6, I was looking at the lower end of the price range (then around 60k). What I found were mostly airframes that had major issues. I ended up buying a very solid airframe (done by a well-known builder), prop, and engine (with decent logs) with a paint job that easily came back to life, but a completely run out panel and interior. The engine was mid-time but it's proven to be an awesome one!
Since buying my plane, the prices have dropped and I've had friends buy planes in the 50s and even 40s. Those planes had significant issues that would have kept me away from purchasing them. Most -6s were built back in the days before pre-punched/quickbuilt kits and the VAF support system. Many are very rough builds. So, unless you have inspected the plane, learning the selling price of a -6 doesn't really tell you much about the value of another -6. As others have said, it's the price you can get.
It depends on your mission (local joyrides vs. long xc) and your aptitude/interest in re-building the plane, but, from what I've seen, any xc, IFR -6 that doesn't have major squawks is likely to cost in the 60k+ range....or should. You can find a -6/A with IFR capacity in the 50k range but, most likely, you'll be needing $20k in the next couple of years to replace that old radio, vacuum pump, and round-gauges. And, I'd make sure I had a pre-purchase inspection by an experience RV guy like Randy Richmond to find the hidden, more serious issues. If you really intend to get lots of flying out of the plane, be very thoughtful and cautious in selecting a bargain.
walkman
Well Known Member
I have been inundated with requests for this spreadsheet.
The data is now very old, and market conditions have likely changed.
It is here for one more week, please don't mail me requests for it afterwards.
Thanks
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12196944/RV-6.xlsx
