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  #1  
Old 08-18-2021, 05:46 PM
RV701775 RV701775 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Boston, MA
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Default Below Flush 426-4 Rivets

When dimpling my rear VS spar, I noticed that the heads of the 426-4 rivets sat slightly below flush in the hole after dimpling. I contacted vans and they replied that this would not allow the rivet to set correctly and the parts should be replaced.

When setting the rivets I used a Cleveland dimple die (CAT 426-4). The rivet sits about .007in below flush. Does anyone else use these dies and are their -4 rivets below flush as well? Is this normal and do the rivets set ok?

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  #2  
Old 08-18-2021, 05:49 PM
TASEsq TASEsq is offline
 
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The dimple dies are not sub structure ones? “SS” stamped on the body?
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  #3  
Old 08-18-2021, 05:55 PM
RV701775 RV701775 is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TASEsq View Post
The dimple dies are not sub structure ones? SS stamped on the body?
No, CAT 426-4 is all they say. When ordering them it was just a standard dimple die from Cleveland.
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  #4  
Old 08-18-2021, 06:39 PM
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wirejock wirejock is offline
 
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Default Substructure dies

Not likely they are #4 Substructure dies. I suggest trying someone elses #4 flush dies.
It's rare, but possible, the dies were not correctly fabricated.
I hope it wasn't a huge expensive part.
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  #5  
Old 08-18-2021, 07:02 PM
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PaulvS PaulvS is offline
 
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How thick is the spar material? If it's .040 or .032 then it may be that the dimples were not made with enough pressure. The shoulders in the photo appear a bit rounded and not crisp. That's if the dies themselves are not faulty.

As others have suggested, I'd try another set of dies, even though Cleaveland's have a very good reputation. Yardstore.com are not that expensive and it doesn't hurt to have more than one set of dies.

Also, you could try the dies you have in some thinner scrap material to verify the holes are being dimpled with enough pressure.
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Last edited by PaulvS : 08-18-2021 at 07:06 PM.
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  #6  
Old 08-18-2021, 07:22 PM
Doug Rohrer Doug Rohrer is offline
 
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Location: Bowling Green, KY
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Who sells the SS dimple dies if not Cleaveland?
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  #7  
Old 08-18-2021, 08:36 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
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Location: Hubbard Oregon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulvS View Post
How thick is the spar material? If it's .040 or .032 then it may be that the dimples were not made with enough pressure. The shoulders in the photo appear a bit rounded and not crisp. That's if the dies themselves are not faulty.

As others have suggested, I'd try another set of dies, even though Cleaveland's have a very good reputation. Yardstore.com are not that expensive and it doesn't hurt to have more than one set of dies.

Also, you could try the dies you have in some thinner scrap material to verify the holes are being dimpled with enough pressure.
Or even if it isn't .040 or .032 material, it could still be that the dimples aren't fully formed. This is a common new builder error.

What tool are you using to do the dimpling?
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  #8  
Old 08-18-2021, 08:51 PM
RV701775 RV701775 is offline
 
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I tried it with a Avery hand squeezer and then a main squeeze and c-frame. I tightened it to a point where there was some deflection in the yoke. If the rivet sits .007in below flush, is it really going to cause an issue during riveting? One would think the material will flex under the rivet set anyways. It seems to me it is pretty difficult to screw up a dimple with a hand squeezer. I cant imagine the squeezer set is improperly formed. Do the photos I posted seem abnormal from other builders experiences?
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  #9  
Old 08-18-2021, 09:12 PM
ryane67 ryane67 is offline
 
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Location: Lake Orion, MI
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This thread has me doubting how well I've been dimpling, and questioning what is considered 'flush'.

what's a good way to measure how flush or not a rivet sits? Is it only applicable to after it's been set or before?

I just went and drilled/dimpled (with drdt2) a few scraps of .032 and the 426-3 and 426-4 rivets seemed to be recessed a bit before they were set, but once set, pretty well flush, but again, unsure of the best way to measure.
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Last edited by ryane67 : 08-18-2021 at 09:15 PM.
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  #10  
Old 08-18-2021, 10:31 PM
BobTurner BobTurner is online now
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvbuilder2002 View Post
Or even if it isn't .040 or .032 material, it could still be that the dimples aren't fully formed. This is a common new builder error.
g?
This^^. Its pretty difficult to hit the C frame, or lean on the drdt-2, too hard.
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