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  #11  
Old 07-03-2020, 10:08 AM
Pilot135pd's Avatar
Pilot135pd Pilot135pd is offline
 
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Location: Vaca Moo Airport - TA37 in East TEXAS
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FinnFlyer View Post
From a RV-3 non-aerobatic pilot's perspective:

Start at 140 - 160 mph level.
Rudder neutral.
Pull back on the stick until it looks like you're at a 45 angle (probably more like 15 to 30 degrees in actuality).
Release back pressure -- neutral elevator.
Briskly but smoothly move the stick all the way to the left (or right).
Probably a novices biggest mistake is being hesitant about quickly moving the stick all the way to the left (or right).
Wait till the horizon is coming around and move the stick back to neutral to roll out to level.

Yes, rolls to the right are a bit harder, going against the torque of the prop.

When you have done this until you can easily see what's happening, you can start refining it.

A bit of rudder helps when rolling out.

Lower entry speeds -- the lower the entry speed the higher the nose have to be before applying aileron.

Rudder to assist keeping altitude in slower rolls.

I'm sure my "rolls" are not pretty from the ground -- but fun in the cockpit.

High entry speed and nose really high if you want the horizon to come around three times and not roll out in a dive

Finn
This is how you do BARREL ROLLS?
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  #12  
Old 07-03-2020, 01:05 PM
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donaziza donaziza is offline
 
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Location: Atlanta
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Pull back on the stick until it looks like you're at a 45 angle (probably more like 15 to 30 degrees in actuality).
Release back pressure -- neutral elevator.
Briskly but smoothly move the stick all the way to the left (or right).



Hi Finn, With all due respect sir, and maybe I'm all wet here---but this pretty much seems like a great way to enter a spin. Especially that part "Briskly, but smoothly move the stick all the way to the left"
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  #13  
Old 07-03-2020, 01:26 PM
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N804RV N804RV is offline
 
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Location: Mount Vernon, Wa
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I think this has gone into the realm of "maybe you should get some aerobatic dual instruction."

Here's a link to a good description of the basic (sometimes called "ballistic") aileron roll: http://www.dylanaviation.com/aerobat...-aileron-roll/
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  #14  
Old 07-03-2020, 04:14 PM
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mike newall mike newall is offline
 
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Gosh, I am so glad I didn't follow this thread after the first page.......
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  #15  
Old 07-03-2020, 06:08 PM
sandifer sandifer is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaziza View Post
Hi Finn, With all due respect sir, and maybe I'm all wet here---but this pretty much seems like a great way to enter a spin. Especially that part "Briskly, but smoothly move the stick all the way to the left"
Well... to dry off, you're gonna have to explain how to enter a spin with neutral elevator and your feet on the floor.
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  #16  
Old 07-03-2020, 08:29 PM
jrs14855 jrs14855 is offline
 
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Location: Lake Havasu City AZ
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Default ROLLS

For many years a horizontal roll on the longitudinal axis was called a slow roll. Some at IAC decided to rename this aileron roll.
Prior to that the term aileron roll was used to describe a Bob Hoover style roll with positive G thru out. There are two styles of barrel rolls. In the military a barrel roll was sort of a combination roll/loop maneuver with the aircraft changing heading 45 degrees. The IAC barrel roll was an invention of IAC. IIRC the nose described an arc around a point 22.5 degrees from the starting point.
It just came to me that the era of the IAC barrel roll was some 40 years ago.
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  #17  
Old 07-04-2020, 08:19 AM
FinnFlyer FinnFlyer is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pilot135pd View Post
This is how you do BARREL ROLLS?
Sorry. I guess it's an aileron roll

Finn
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  #18  
Old 07-08-2020, 01:47 PM
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skylor skylor is offline
 
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Default Barrel Roll Tip

I was taught that when performing a real barrel roll for fun (not a ~1g aileron roll referred to as a barrel roll) it helps tremendously to cheat a little and get the nose well above the horizon before starting the roll. A couple of mistakes that I think result in "dishing out" are 1. Rolling at too high of a roll rate during the first 1/4 of the roll when the airspeed is high, 2. Not unloading in pitch sufficiently when rolling past 60-70 degrees of bank.

Here is my version of the barrel roll:

Barrel Roll Video

Skylor

Last edited by skylor : 07-08-2020 at 01:51 PM.
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  #19  
Old 08-04-2020, 11:07 PM
KC10driver KC10driver is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donaziza View Post
There's another post here on doing decent aileron rolls. I'm gonna try em tomorrow. (Feet off the rudder pedals, but most importantly, no back stick, keep your hand open. Can someone walk me thru how to do a decent barrel roll? Mine are terrible, especially to the right. A lotta times, when I do them to the right, I pretty much go almost straight down. My left ones are better. I'm pulling back on the stick, while rolling say to the left, and then coming out so so, mostly not a very great so so. Don't know if I should be using rudders or not. I learned them 55 years ago in a T 28, but they were pretty bad then too. Supossed to be a great move for getting on the enemy's 6, so he hopefully flies by you while you're manuvering vertically.

Help
So I'm a little late to the party, but I copied this straight from a reg we use at work. The numbers of course for the RV are going to be different, but the description should at least help explain what you should be doing while flying the maneuver.

"4.36. Barrel Roll:

4.36.1. Pre-proficiency entry parameters are 400 KIAS using 95 percent rpm. Post-proficiency entry parameters are 300 to 500 KIAS, using 90 percent rpm - MIL power.

4.36.2. The barrel roll is a coordinated roll in any direction in which the nose of the aircraft describes a circle around a point. Choose a point on or slightly above the horizon and maneuver the aircraft to attain entry parameters in a wings-level attitude with the aircraft 30 to 45 degrees to the side of the selected point. Begin a rolling pull in the desired direction and use smooth control inputs to maintain a circular flightpath around the reference point. You should be (1) in 90 degrees of bank directly above the selected reference point, (2) in a wings-level inverted attitude when passing abeam the reference point at 180 degrees of roll, (3) in 90 degrees of bank directly below the selected reference point, and (4) in a wings-level upright attitude when completing the maneuver.

4.36.3. Another technique is to begin the maneuver by choosing a desired roll axis from which the barrel roll will be flown. Offset this roll axis the number of degrees that defines the size of the roll (normally 30 to 45 degrees). Pick a point on the horizon twice the degrees of the offset in the desired direction of the roll. For example, if selecting a 45-degree offset, pick a point 90 degrees off the nose.

4.36.4. Begin a coordinated roll and pull to fly the nose of the aircraft to be inverted at the point. Continue the coordinated roll or pull to fly the aircraft back to the original offset heading. You should be at 90 degrees of bank as the nose of the aircraft passes the original roll axis (both on the first and second half of the roll), and the degrees nose high and low at these points are defined by the number of degrees of the original offset. The ending airspeed should be approximately the same as the entry air-speed for a symmetrically flown maneuver, but symmetry is more important than finishing at entry airspeed..

4.36.5. Maintain positive G-loading throughout the roll. To gain energy, use higher power settings and/or light G-loading.

4.36.6. A barrel roll will require a forward distance of approximately 3 nm and 4,000 to 8,000 feet above."

Hopefully this helps!
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