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12-21-2014, 04:45 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: NOLA
Posts: 229
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Build on or replace?
Good Evening All - I'll cut to the chase.
I smeared the head of a 470AD4-7 on the VS-411PP (hinge bracket). I drilled the head and popped it out with a punch but could not for the life of me get the tail/shank out. I slowly drilled with a #40 bit a little at a time and trying to push it out after drilling a bit. I finally drilled through the rivet and ended up knocking/prying the shop head off with flush dykes. When the remnants of the rivet were finally removed, the shop head side of the hole seems to have a slight "countersink" appearance. The hole itself was not enlarged or mishaped from drilling. My question is: Can I replace with the same rivet? Replace with a slightly longer rivet to fill the slightly swollen hole? Start over? Below are some pictures of the empty hole and with a new rivet inserted. Thanks for all the help!
[IMG]  [/IMG]
[IMG]  [/IMG]
[IMG]  [/IMG]
[IMG]  [IMG]
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12-21-2014, 05:25 PM
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: X35 - Ocala, FL
Posts: 3,679
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Put the same size in or a half size longer.
__________________
Jesse Saint
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12-21-2014, 08:32 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
Posts: 9,035
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse
Put the same size in or a half size longer.
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I agree.
Same size will probably produce just a slightly thinner shop head but should still meet minimum spec.
__________________
Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.
Scott McDaniels
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
Hubbard, Oregon
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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12-21-2014, 10:23 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: 57AZ - NW Tucson area
Posts: 10,011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jesse
Put the same size in or a half size longer.
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AD4 (1/8) rivets don't come in half sizes do they?
Use the next size up...
__________________
Gil Alexander
EAA Technical Counselor, Airframe Mechanic
Half completed RV-10 QB purchased
RV-6A N61GX - finally flying
Grumman Tiger N12GA - flying
La Cholla Airpark (57AZ) Tucson AZ
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12-21-2014, 11:22 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
Posts: 9,035
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Quote:
Originally Posted by az_gila
AD4 (1/8) rivets don't come in half sizes do they?
Use the next size up...
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No, that is what rivet cutters are for..... 
__________________
Opinions, information and comments are my own unless stated otherwise. They do not necessarily represent the direction/opinions of my employer.
Scott McDaniels
Van's Aircraft Engineering Prototype Shop Manager
Hubbard, Oregon
RV-6A (aka "Junkyard Special ")
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12-22-2014, 04:59 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Dothan, Alabama
Posts: 1,487
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Whenever, wherever possible, use a hand squeezer. When you first start building, the hands are pretty weak. By the time you finish, you will not even think about squeezing a AD4 rivet.
__________________
Alton DeWeese
N526RV RV7A Tip Up, IO360 180 W/Hartzel BA prop.
Flying ~950 hours since Aug 2010
N4IDH
Construction Log
?The secret of getting ahead is getting started. The secret of getting started is breaking your complex overwhelming tasks into small manageable tasks, and then starting on the first one.?
?Mark Twain
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12-22-2014, 05:16 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: NOLA
Posts: 229
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Thanks
Thanks for input, I figured that would be the consensus but just wanted to verify.
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12-22-2014, 05:38 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,544
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For a part like this it is hard to beat the old C frame for setting a rivet. Support the spar with blocks etc to get it level and then using a hammer set the rivet. The beauty of using a hammer is that you can start with one small hit, take a look at the rivet, adjust, hit again, adjust etc, until you have the perfect shop head.
I use a hammer to back rivet many parts on the airplane, the firewall of the RV14 is a good example of where back riveting using a simple hammer works really well. Yes it is slower then using the rivet gun with a back rivet set but if you have to drill out a few missed rivets the time advantage is gone. In this case I do it free hand, using only the "set' from the C frame and not the frame itself.
Do not get me wrong, I do not use a hammer to set that many rivets on the airplane but sometimes it makes sense, and this may be one of those cases.
As always, practice on some scraps first.
There is a certain amount of pleasure in hand setting a rivet, and actually watching the shop head develop.
It is not that often that you can hit an airplane with a hammer, if feels good!
__________________
Tom Martin RV1 pilot 4.6hours!
CPL & IFR rated
EVO F1 Rocket 1000 hours,
2010 SARL Rocket 100 race, average speed of 238.6 knots/274.6mph
RV4, RV7, RV10, two HRIIs and five F1 Rockets
RV14 Tail dragger
Fairlea Field
St.Thomas, Ontario Canada, CYQS
fairleafield@gmail.com
Last edited by Tom Martin : 12-22-2014 at 05:42 AM.
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12-23-2014, 05:57 AM
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: NOLA
Posts: 229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Martin
For a part like this it is hard to beat the old C frame for setting a rivet. Support the spar with blocks etc to get it level and then using a hammer set the rivet. The beauty of using a hammer is that you can start with one small hit, take a look at the rivet, adjust, hit again, adjust etc, until you have the perfect shop head.
I use a hammer to back rivet many parts on the airplane, the firewall of the RV14 is a good example of where back riveting using a simple hammer works really well. Yes it is slower then using the rivet gun with a back rivet set but if you have to drill out a few missed rivets the time advantage is gone. In this case I do it free hand, using only the "set' from the C frame and not the frame itself.
Do not get me wrong, I do not use a hammer to set that many rivets on the airplane but sometimes it makes sense, and this may be one of those cases.
As always, practice on some scraps first.
There is a certain amount of pleasure in hand setting a rivet, and actually watching the shop head develop.
It is not that often that you can hit an airplane with a hammer, if feels good!
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Thanks Tom, I'll give the C Frame a shot!
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12-23-2014, 10:11 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Battleground
Posts: 4,348
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I drove all my main wing spar rivets with a C-frame. 1/8" rivets will set like butta'
__________________
Smart People do Stupid things all the time. I know, I've seen me do'em.
RV6 - Builder/Flying
Bucker Jungmann
Fiat G.46 -(restoration in progress, if I have enough life left in me)
RV1 - Proud Pilot.
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