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07-08-2014, 12:16 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 3,947
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Test pilot
I read the AC but still have a question. Can the QP take the plane up for it's first test flight solo without the BP?
I agree minimal crew is best. To me, low time pilot with transition training, I don't feel qualified to be my own test pilot. I would prefer a qualified test pilot fly the first hour. Then we fix the issues and go up together till I'm comfortable. I read it to be BP solo or BP and QP. Did I misread?
__________________
Larry Larson
Estes Park, CO
http://wirejockrv7a.blogspot.com
wirejock at yahoo dot com
Donated 12/03/2019, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
HS SB, empennage, tanks, wings, fuse, working finishing kit
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.
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07-08-2014, 12:24 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: 57AZ - NW Tucson area
Posts: 10,011
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock
I read the AC but still have a question. Can the QP take the plane up for it's first test flight solo without the BP?
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That is no different from now... any person (with a PP cert. IIRC) can fly the 40 hours off solo.
If there is just one pilot, the existing rules apply... BP, QP and OP are not applicable. 
__________________
Gil Alexander
EAA Technical Counselor, Airframe Mechanic
Half completed RV-10 QB purchased
RV-6A N61GX - finally flying
Grumman Tiger N12GA - flying
La Cholla Airpark (57AZ) Tucson AZ
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07-08-2014, 12:31 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillL
One question: does it place any additional restrictions or requirements on the pilot in phase I that do not already exist?
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If using the program, you must be current (90 day passenger carrying, flight review kind of stuff spelled out in "7. Determining Applicant Eligibility") and qualified (category, class and endorsments as necessary for aircraft).
Basically, it doesn't really place any additional restrictions except perhaps 61.57(a) (the 90 day currency for passenger carrying). I hope this helps.
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07-08-2014, 12:34 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Central IL
Posts: 5,516
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeGiron
If using the program, you must be current (90 day passenger carrying, flight review kind of stuff spelled out in "7. Determining Applicant Eligibility") and qualified (category, class and endorsments as necessary for aircraft).
Basically, it doesn't really place any additional restrictions except perhaps 61.57(a) (the 90 day currency for passenger carrying). I hope this helps.
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Yes, it does, thanks for a quick response and for your efforts in protecting our safety balanced with our rights as pilots. I sent a "for" note/comment to Ms Rogers as I had no intelligent comments to the substance of the proposal.
__________________
Bill
RV-7
Lord Kelvin:
“I often say that when you can measure what you are speaking about,
and express it in numbers, you know something about it; but when you
cannot measure it, when you cannot express it in numbers, your knowledge
is of a meager and unsatisfactory kind.”
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07-08-2014, 12:36 PM
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Rochester Hills, MI
Posts: 879
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock
I read the AC but still have a question. Can the QP take the plane up for it's first test flight solo without the BP?
I agree minimal crew is best. To me, low time pilot with transition training, I don't feel qualified to be my own test pilot. I would prefer a qualified test pilot fly the first hour. Then we fix the issues and go up together till I'm comfortable. I read it to be BP solo or BP and QP. Did I misread?
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My understanding: The AC does not address or change solo flight during Phase 1. It only comes into play when a second pilot is desired during Phase 1.
The minimum qualifications for the second pilot (OP vs. QP) depend on what flight tasks the BP has (or hasn't) done.
__________________
Dennis Glaeser CFII
Rochester Hills, MI
RV-7A - Eggenfellner H6, GRT Sport ES, EIS4000, 300XL, SL30, TT Gemini, PMA6000, AK950L, GT320,
uAvionixEcho ADSB in/out with GRT Safe Fly GPS
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07-08-2014, 12:38 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by az_gila
That is no different from now... any person (with a PP cert. IIRC) can fly the 40 hours off solo.
If there is just one pilot, the existing rules apply... BP, QP and OP are not applicable. 
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This is correct. If one pilot is in the plane, the "existing rules" apply.
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07-08-2014, 12:40 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DGlaeser
My understanding: The AC does not address or change solo flight during Phase 1. It only comes into play when a second pilot is desired during Phase 1.
The minimum qualifications for the second pilot (OP vs. QP) depend on what flight tasks the BP has (or hasn't) done.
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Good understanding. But don't forget the AIRCRAFT also has a list of tests that must be completed (by anyone) and the BP must complete their list of maneuvers before the QP qualifications descend to the OP quals.
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07-08-2014, 12:45 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock
I read the AC but still have a question. Can the QP take the plane up for it's first test flight solo without the BP?
I agree minimal crew is best. To me, low time pilot with transition training, I don't feel qualified to be my own test pilot. I would prefer a qualified test pilot fly the first hour. Then we fix the issues and go up together till I'm comfortable. I read it to be BP solo or BP and QP. Did I misread?
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The reality is anyone can take it up for the first flight (or flights) solo. Because of this, we don't call them the QP, but in fact, that's probably who would do it. Then you, the BP hop in with the QP and fly the bird till you're comfortable.
Last edited by MeGiron : 07-08-2014 at 01:00 PM.
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07-08-2014, 01:11 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Estes Park, CO
Posts: 3,947
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Test Pilot
Quote:
Originally Posted by MeGiron
The reality is anyone can take it up for the first flight (or flights) solo. Because of this, we don't call them the QP, but in fact, that's probably who would do it. Then you, the BP hop in with the QP and fly the bird till you're comfortable.
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Thanks. That's what I was hoping to hear.
__________________
Larry Larson
Estes Park, CO
http://wirejockrv7a.blogspot.com
wirejock at yahoo dot com
Donated 12/03/2019, plus a little extra.
RV-7A #73391, N511RV reserved (2,000+ hours)
HS SB, empennage, tanks, wings, fuse, working finishing kit
Disclaimer
I cannot be, nor will I be, held responsible if you try to do the same things I do and it does not work and/or causes you loss, injury, or even death in the process.
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07-08-2014, 02:07 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Columbia, SC
Posts: 804
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YES ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by wirejock
I read the AC but still have a question. Can the QP take the plane up for it's first test flight solo without the BP?
I agree minimal crew is best. To me, low time pilot with transition training, I don't feel qualified to be my own test pilot. I would prefer a qualified test pilot fly the first hour. Then we fix the issues and go up together till I'm comfortable. I read it to be BP solo or BP and QP. Did I misread?
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Page 15 Scenario 2.
"Another pilot tests the aircraft ..."
".... though highly recommended, this pilot need not be a QP ..."
More comments
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When I initially heard about this, I was one to "push back". Asking the question "What problem are we trying to solve?"
Over time as I realized more of what is happening in the "real world" and looked at the data, I became more open to the concept.
I still think that good use of the EAA Technical Advisor and Flight Advisor Programs along with good transition training would go a long way if everyone would use them.
As a result of this AC, I expect that there will be more "two pilot" flights during Phase I. I just hope that that everyone really takes to heart the spirit of what is being attempted here....
Do things that reduce risk.
I also suspect that many of the QP's will pass on having a second pilot on the first flight. Their call.
Where the MOST VALUE will come in (in my opinion) is after the first eight (8) hours and completion of the ITP. Hopefully this will lead to more in depth testing of the increasingly more complex systems that are being installed in our planes.
And if it leads to pilots who are more "at one with" their planes by Phase II and pilots who really feel at ease with their increasingly Advanced Cockpits, then this indeed will be a (very) good thing.
James
__________________
James E. Clark
Columbia, SC
RV6 Flying, RV6A Cowling
APRS
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