|
-
POSTING RULES

-
Donate yearly (please).
-
Advertise in here!
-
Today's Posts
|
Insert Pics
|

10-15-2013, 06:01 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Perryville, MD
Posts: 93
|
|
Tom,
I'm looking forward to see what you decide on. I am currently leaning towards the -12 with Jab or UL. I don't see why so many are against going E-AB, I would rather have a plane with my own personal touches that set it apart from the others. Also being budget restricted I could choose alternate avionics, maybe older used Dynon or just standard gauges.
__________________
Joe Mikus
MSgt USAF Ret Avionics Tech
Perryville, MD
Student Sport Pilot
Future RV-12 Builder?
|

10-15-2013, 06:14 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: SC
Posts: 12,887
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeM
...I don't see why so many are against going E-AB, I would rather have a plane with my own personal touches that set it apart from the others. Also being budget restricted I could choose alternate avionics, maybe older used Dynon or just standard gauges.
|
It isn't that people have something against the -12 as an E-AB as much as they feel they have made the correct decision.
As for the alternate engine option, many of us have seen a number of engines come on to the market only to disappear along with large sums of money.
The thing that I have never understood about the new engine companies is why don't they sell their first X-number of engines at a greatly reduced price? This would get their engines into the marketplace and help them build time and experience.
What we have today are companies / individuals who come up with a better mousetrap and sell them at a price very close to the proven designs. The problem is that the new mousetraps often have teething issues which can and do often sink the companies. (The Egg Subaru engine is just one example.) The worst part about these "new" engines is that it is often up to the builder to sort through the issues at their own expense and often that expense includes dumping the new mousetrap and replacing it with a traditional engine. In the end, the builder ends up spending more, a lot more, than if they had started with the designer's recommendation.
For example, look at the Jabir engines. A lot of people had to perform top overhauls due to cooling issues. I know, I know; everyone keeps saying those have been addressed but no one has reimbursed the early adopters.
__________________
Bill R.
RV-9 (Yes, it's a dragon tail)
O-360 w/ dual P-mags
Build the plane you want, not the plane others want you to build!
SC86 - Easley, SC
www.repucci.com/bill/baf.html
|

10-15-2013, 11:13 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Delta Junction, AK
Posts: 68
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeM
Tom,
I'm looking forward to see what you decide on. I am currently leaning towards the -12 with Jab or UL. I don't see why so many are against going E-AB, I would rather have a plane with my own personal touches that set it apart from the others. Also being budget restricted I could choose alternate avionics, maybe older used Dynon or just standard gauges.
|
Joe,
I'm looking forward to see what I decide too!! I really am not attempting to 'Salt the mine' for Viking, Jabiru, or anyone else. To be completely honest the engine that intrigues me the most is the AeroVee Turbo. Exhale everybody. While it has an appealing price, the electrons are severly lacking, and it is more VaporWare-ish than the Viking. Will there be ANY flying examples in the near future? Not likely. In an RV-12? Even less likely. I do like the idea of an engine kit to go along with the aircraft kit and I do have experience with the flat Boxer style engines in both VW's and A&P class (exhale again guys) so that is not outside my comfort zone.
On the avionics front, I could build a straight E-LSA, get the pink slip and then break out the hole saw and start my modifications. I've done many avionics upgrades on aircraft and I would rather install the bits and bobs that I like to begin with and do the 40 hour fly off. As everyone will attest Avionics change rapidly so that is often the last thing purchased. Eliminating all (or most) fuses and wiring the aircraft with the Vertical Power VP-X is something I would really like to do. Also, I keep weighing VAL's remote mounted VHF against the Garmin GNC255. Will I need the extra panel space or an ILS? I am hoping not to ever need a Fire Extinguisher or an escape axe, but I will probably carry both.
I hope that the Viking does exceptionally well. The Jab's and Rotax's already do. The UL Power guys are right on their heels. This is primarily a mental exercise at the moment, and look on the bright side, if I don't pick wisely I won't be able to say that I wasn't warned, will I?
Cheers
Tom
P.S. I like the Avatar, but it is a bit hard to see the tail flashes. If it was the 318th there would be Mt. Rainer in the background, so, Minot, Otis? With the MD address I will go out on a limb and say 48FIS.
__________________
Tom
MSgt, USAF, Ret
N318RV Reserved
Gathering tools
Dues paid
There are 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand Binary and those who don't.
Last edited by ifixf15 : 10-16-2013 at 03:19 AM.
Reason: Omission
|

10-17-2013, 07:12 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Elkton, Md.
Posts: 1,652
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by joedallas
( not dollars to dollars )
|
It could very easily become a dollars to dollars comparison. I don't see any after market heads available for the 912? Apparently there is a need for cooler heads on the Jab? It is a great performer, I will give it that. Is it ready for the flight schools???
__________________
Wag Aero Sport Trainer built,sold and wrecked
N588DF RV12 #336 built, sold and alive and well in New York
N73DF RV12 #244 built, sold and alive and well in Florida
N91 RV RV9 I wish I could say I built this one! Mark Santoleri hit the ball out of the park on this gem.
Currently restoring a 1978 Citabria GCBC
|

10-17-2013, 08:19 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, TX (DFW)
Posts: 1,164
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave12
It could very easily become a dollars to dollars comparison. I don't see any after market heads available for the 912? Apparently there is a need for cooler heads on the Jab? It is a great performer, I will give it that. Is it ready for the flight schools???
|
According to the main Jabiru website (Australia), it says that the Jabiru's are flying in many flight schools around the world. Just to clarify- and again, I am not flying yet- but the Jabiru RV-12's that are flying, are not reporting any cooling issues. Pete at JabUSA has designed and included some very specific plenums that mate to the engine. They direct airflow directly to the cylinders and in some spots they have 'dams' installed to direct more air to given areas. In addition, there are two Naca ducts that must be installed into the sides of the cowling.
So in summary, I'm thinking the cooling issues are things of the past. No flying Jabiru RV-12 is reporting issues. But even more engine specific, there are numerous actual Jabiru-branded aircraft being delivered each month/year. I don't see how they could keep delivering factory aircraft to customers if there was still a known cooling issue. Just my .02-cents 
__________________
Gary Robertson
Arlington, TX
RV-12 Built / Sold / Flying
Currently Flying: Cessna Skyhawk 172
Rebuilding a true barn find J-3 Cub
|

10-17-2013, 03:06 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Spring Hill Fl
Posts: 734
|
|
Jabiru will be a good choice of many builders
From www.aviationsaftymagazine.com
The Jabiru 2200 and 3300
The engines closest in configuration to the Continental and Lycoming engines known, loved and loathed by thousands of pilots come from Australian manufacturer Jabiru.
Both the 85-horse 2200, a four, and the 120-horse 3300, a six, are horizontally opposed direct-drive engines?like a "traditional" Lycoming or Continental?but with much of the same sophistication of the HKS and Rotax mills.
For example, both Jabirus employ integral dual transistorized mags for ignition, an integral alternator and a single altitude-compensating carburetor feeding all cylinders. Fuel burn for the 2200 is just under 4 gph and under 7 gph for the 3300. Both are light
Oren's 3300 is performing beautifully
I think the Jabiru will be a good choice of many builders
It is what I will Use
Ditto To Gary
Quote:
Originally Posted by txaviator
According to the main Jabiru website (Australia), it says that the Jabiru's are flying in many flight schools around the world. Just to clarify- and again, I am not flying yet- but the Jabiru RV-12's that are flying, are not reporting any cooling issues. Pete at JabUSA has designed and included some very specific plenums that mate to the engine. They direct airflow directly to the cylinders and in some spots they have 'dams' installed to direct more air to given areas. In addition, there are two Naca ducts that must be installed into the sides of the cowling.
So in summary, I'm thinking the cooling issues are things of the past. No flying Jabiru RV-12 is reporting issues. But even more engine specific, there are numerous actual Jabiru-branded aircraft being delivered each month/year. I don't see how they could keep delivering factory aircraft to customers if there was still a known cooling issue. Just my .02-cents 
|
|

10-17-2013, 03:52 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Elkton, Md.
Posts: 1,652
|
|
If the same fit, finish and quality machine work that is displayed on the exterior of the engine follows through to the innards, it is a winner. As I have said, they are impressive performers.
__________________
Wag Aero Sport Trainer built,sold and wrecked
N588DF RV12 #336 built, sold and alive and well in New York
N73DF RV12 #244 built, sold and alive and well in Florida
N91 RV RV9 I wish I could say I built this one! Mark Santoleri hit the ball out of the park on this gem.
Currently restoring a 1978 Citabria GCBC
|

10-17-2013, 03:56 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 517
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by N941WR
While I like the Jabiru, on paper, I have to ask one question; have they solved the head overheating problems?
I have read too many ads for Jabiru aircraft with 300 hours and 100 hours STOH, or something similar.
|
Bill,
Personal experience with the Jab overheating?
Been looking for those ads you referenced, but no joy.
Tony
|

10-17-2013, 04:44 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Friday Harbor, Wa
Posts: 300
|
|
Try here
__________________
MRT890
120042 RV-12
N112XP
|

10-17-2013, 06:58 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Wilmington, NC
Posts: 517
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrt890
|
Michael,
I'm most happy to trade url's with you:
http://www.liquidcooledairpower.com/cj-overview.shtml
Just because somebody chose to make liquid cooled heads for the O-360 and O-540, do you suppose that means those engines had cooling problems?
Tony
|
| Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
|
| Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:23 AM.
|