Eliminating Bendix D2000/3000 Magnetos

[mannanj]

Originally Posted by walkman

I was glad to hear you were done and working well.

I'm half inclined to leave my mag off until its time to run up and the depart just for that low speed idle improvement.

I did have a question about the block off for the drive gear. Other than the mag drive gear itself, is there anything else to remove? Like a pilot bearing etc? If so, how did you remove it? How did the block off work for you?

I'm beginning to think my issue was/is "morning sickness".

I certainly hope it's not the "morning sickness" associated with a sticky valve stem.

Nothing else to remove. Robert makes a block-off plate that covers the empty hole where the mag used to be. Centered and bolted to that plate he has a machined dowel that fits into the pilot shaft hole in the crankcase. That dowel is the same dia. as the pilot shaft on the mag gear/impulse coupling and stems the oil flow from the hole in the crankcase that oils the pilot shaft. Without this dowel, you would have a fairly large oil hemorrage out that orfice.

Robert recommends Ultra black RTV to seal the bolt that holds the dowel but I refuse to use RTV anywhere near my engine, so I used proseal.

Hope this helps.

[walkman]

Originally Posted by mannanj

I certainly hope it's not the "morning sickness" associated with a sticky valve stem.

That is exactly what I fear.

[Lionclaw]

I'm getting ready to swap the D3000 on my H2AD engine over to a single mag. It appears that the one used on the 360 is the D4LN-3000, while the mag on the H2AD is the D4RN-3000.

Therefore, it would appear that the H2AD engine needs the S4RN-21 or S4RSC-21. Can anyone confirm this? Is anyone able to shed some light on the differences between the S4RN and the S4RSC mags?

I'll probably call a magneto shop to help me out, rather than going at this blindly. If anyone has already blazed this trail for the H2AD, advice would be appreciated.

[airtractor8]

Originally Posted by Lionclaw

I'm getting ready to swap the D3000 on my H2AD engine over to a single mag. It appears that the one used on the 360 is the D4LN-3000, while the mag on the H2AD is the D4RN-3000.

Therefore, it would appear that the H2AD engine needs the S4RN-21 or S4RSC-21. Can anyone confirm this? Is anyone able to shed some light on the differences between the S4RN and the S4RSC mags?

I'll probably call a magneto shop to help me out, rather than going at this blindly. If anyone has already blazed this trail for the H2AD, advice would be appreciated.

Hello Andy

I made some enquiries with a Mag shop in Iowa a year or so ago about doing exactly what you have in mind to my H2AD. I asked the same questions as you. Turns out he has done a few conversions over the years for H2AD owners. Below is his email response to my questions.


Over the last 20 years I have traded with users of the 0-320h2ad with the D-2000 into an experimental single S-1200 magneto. There are no right hand units configured for that application. The 1200 has many of the same drive end dimensions as the D-2000 and can be installed and make work. It will require a new harness from the mag to plugs which I can make. First I will need to send you the model 1200 to install and the wires length will be determined by you. Then I can make up a new harness for the mag. The magneto's that I have built for the H2AD does not use an impulse just a direct drive. Everyone used the electronic ignition to start the engine. I am not sure that an impulse can be made to work with the mag because of the angles it will need to set at when installed.
Now for what it will cost you to go to one S-1200 and replace the D-2000; what I would send you is one overhauled experimental magneto with drive plate and harness. This is a package price of $1270.00 which includes the cores.
best regards,

Arn-Air
ARNOLD KESSELRING
PH 712-651-2255
arnair@iowatelecom.net


He seemed like a nice guy and was happy to answer my questions.

Cheers
Graham

[Sam Staton]

I also have had to deal with this conundrum. I elected to follow the same path Andy did - full dual EFII. The cost of the conversion is either more than or close to (don't remember exactly) the cost of adding a second ECU to the system. While I have not flown my engine yet (Robert says my system should ship Monday), I feel much more confident about this system than a hybrid with one electronic and one converted mag. Just one opinion, and worth everything you paid for it. YMMV!

Sam

[crabandy]

Here's a pic of the block off plate for the dual mag.




I'll start by saying that I like mags, I almost bought a lightspeed and I almost bought an electroair. G3i, pmag and other EI companies didn't offer options for the dual mag engine. Read the install manuals and talk to the companies and find out which is the best choice for your application. For me and my o-360-A1F6D variant I chose the dual EFII for the crank sensor, block off plate, installation and price. The longer duration of the inductive ignition spark was just a bonus to me.
I was originally going to use my dual mag, until I found out I needed to replace the AD'ed condensors and harness. I decided to use a single EFII and have a single bendix mag converted and several months later after I put in an order for the converted single bendix mag I changed my mind again.
When I thought about maintenance 500 hours from now on the "special" mag, $$ for aviation plugs/wires, and the price of the special mag/harness vs the dual EFII I chose the dual EFII.
I originally wanted a mag because I didn't want to "complicate" things with a redundant electrical system. For me this thinking was only because I really didn't understand electrical systems, electronic ignitions etc (Not that I understand electrical systems, I've just borrowed know how from the smart guys). In the long run the redundant electrical systems (dual batt or alt when building) aren't complicated and allow a basic architecture to make use of the new EFIS's and electronics. I spent 60-80 hours comparing electrical systems/aux alts/backup batteries/ignition systems. Looking back now I think using the single mag on the dual mag accessory case was complicating things.
For me the hard part was making the decision to let go of the mag and use the dual EFII. Easy part so far was installation. I've only ran the engine 3times so far, after I richened the idle screw correctly it runs very smooth and idles well in the low 500 RPMs with a lightwieght Catto. I'm anxious for a first flight and see what kind of LOP performance I can get with the EFII. Using a newer product always has it's risks, but for me the benefits of dual EFII outwieghed the risks. Time will tell and I will try to post more results as I get them.

[mannanj]

I have over a year and just guessing, over 50 hrs. on my EFII dual/redundant electronic ignition system now. I have a fuel injected engine and have done Don Rivera's Airflow Performance spray nozzle flow matching which adds to the ability to lean the engine more before it starts missing. The added spark duration really helps ignite the leaner mixture.

I have nothing but praise for Robert Paisley's system. It has performed flawlessly and drops the fuel flow considerably. I'm burning a gallon, sometimes 1.5 gal. less than before. Starting that fuel injected engine is a piece of cake now.

Adding the system including the aux battery was pretty much a wash weight wise, adding a couple of pounds. That Siamese mag, wires and the aviation RHM-38E plugs were heavy. I like the NGK auto plugs of the electronic system and they cost a LOT less!

I realize everyone has their own opinion and everyone thinks what they have is better than anyone else's, but I believe it would be hard to find a better system than Robert's. He uses the best proven components and I'm sure that time will tell as his ignition spreads further into the aviation world and matures.

I don't think you will go wrong with EFII.

[walkman]

I'm curious for those of you who have gone to dual electronic ignition from Robert, did you go with dual ECUs or a single ECU?

Mannan, formation Saturday? Looks like we might be able to put up a 4-ship (finally).

[crabandy]

I went with the full dual, 2 each of SDU Brain Box-Flywheel Pickups-Manifold Pressure Sensors. It's only another 1 lb or so and makes me feel a whole lot better about redundancy.

[walkman]

Originally Posted by crabandy

I went with the full dual, 2 each of SDU Brain Box-Flywheel Pickups-Manifold Pressure Sensors. It's only another 1 lb or so and makes me feel a whole lot better about redundancy.

Are you running Fuel Injection, or just 2 ignition setups? Dual ECU would be my path for dual EI, but only one ECU can run the fuel system.

18 months ago I talked to Robert about it and he mentioned a way to shunt the FI functions to the other ECU in the event of a failure of the primary. Curious as to if/how that works in real life.