|
-
POSTING RULES

-
Donate yearly (please).
-
Advertise in here!
-
Today's Posts
|
Insert Pics
|

08-27-2013, 11:17 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Auckland New Zealand
Posts: 35
|
|
Video RV-7 Aerobatics in New Zealand
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=0Bpd6LHSQyM
It's only been a short time since I started Aerobatics in my RV, and seems every nice day I look to the sky wanting to go upside-down. I find different things to do each time, and there is so much to learn. RV's are SO MUCH fun.
|

08-28-2013, 05:28 AM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Daleville, AL
Posts: 343
|
|
right hand hammer!!!!!!
Des,
I can see you've got the bug too. Great video and nice flying. This is the first time I've seen a hammerhead (stall turn) to the right in an RV. Look forward to more.
Bill McLean
RV-4 slider
Alabama 
|

08-28-2013, 09:26 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 664
|
|
Do you have inverted fuel/oil? Looked like your drew a brief negative line during one of those Cubans. Inverted systems opens up acro options for you, but I'd recommend a double lap belt with different anchoring points if you're doing any sustained even -1G figures. If so, learning to do level "slow" rolls (roll on a level line without deviating from heading/altitude) is a good exercise and satisfying when they start to click.
Since you clearly have interest in working on acro, some notes on the hammer - Apply progressive right rudder as you slow near the top. Prop slipstream will yaw the left wing low as speed slows, which was happening here. Keep that wingtip in position right up to the point of the kick. And having some right rudder input before you kick left will give you some additional left rudder authority for the pivot. Also, you'll want to apply right aileron earlier during the pivot to keep from torquing (rolling left) off plane during the pivot. This is what was causing the wings to be off perpendicular halfway through the pivot. Do you have a metal prop? If you so, you may want to apply a little more forward stick as you pivot due to the gyroscopic pitch reaction of left rudder input. This forward stick is also important in high-performance planes to help with torquing issues.
Looks like you may not have full power applied during the hammer? That will help the pivot, but also requires more precise inputs of rudder, elevator, and aileron to do a good pivot. Also, most folks tend to kick early for fear of tailsliding. Slowing down to that sweet spot, and accurately gauging when to kick (but not kicking late) each time really helps with a nice tight pivot. Learning this timing is best done with help of someone knowledgeable from the ground. Of course, for just fun messin' around hammers, little of this matters. Acro can as much or as least technique-intensive as you want. Just make sure it's fun. Keep it up. Cheers.
Last edited by sandifer : 08-28-2013 at 09:41 AM.
|

08-28-2013, 02:14 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Auckland New Zealand
Posts: 35
|
|
Thank you Eric. That makes so much sense to me. Right rudder going up until the kick, and right aileron with elevator to keep everything straight. I have only been up with 1 person who understands hammer turns in RV's, and that slowed down my turn from the 60knots I was originally taught to not being able to read the speed. I have not experienced a tail slide probably because I don't use right rudder on the way up and the left wing already starts to drop, then torque brings the nose around at very low speeds. However I would like to prepare and try a tail slide to know what it feels like. If my controls are locked Rudder Aileron and Elevators, is it safe to do in the RV's? As I start applying right rudder going up, then at the speeds I am kicking in, it is possible to tail slide, so should I intentionally try one?
I have a half raven system, with an Aquasump, and it takes about 7 seconds negative before I need to come out. Enough for what I want. Also about to do me 100 hours and looking at buying Crows harness, which many RV owners recommend. Thanks Eric for the comments.
|

08-28-2013, 02:17 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Auckland New Zealand
Posts: 35
|
|
Right hand Hammer Head. Need to play with these more. The way I was taught was to pull power before the turn, otherwise I will be fighting the torque. Not sure if this is right, but will go up and practise more. Eric reminded me to focus on looking out the window at where the wing tips are cutting the scenery and apply the correct inputs. Just having FUN :-)
|

08-28-2013, 03:21 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 664
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by RV7DES
However I would like to prepare and try a tail slide to know what it feels like. If my controls are locked Rudder Aileron and Elevators, is it safe to do in the RV's?
|
I would strongly recommend against playing around with tailslides in an RV. They were not designed for it. Vans would say don't even think about it. Lots of people have damaged their tail surfaces (and flaps) doing either inadvertent, or intentional tailslides...not so much in RVs, but other types. I've never heard of anyone tailsliding an RV, intentionally or otherwise. The risk with the tail surfaces is having them slammed against the stops. But even if you hold the stick and rudder firmly, the tail surfaces weren't designed for reverse airflow. Neither were the flaps. No reason to try it.
But here's what I would recommend to help get a feel for what's happening without tailsliding - tape a piece of yarn about 8" long to the aft end of your wingtip (acro pilots traditionally look at the left wingtip). On the upline into a hammer, watch the yarn. When you get very slow, it'll start to flicker, and if you keep going, it'll eventually go limp and quickly reverse direction. Avoid that. If you get caught with it starting to go limp, the best thing you can do is apply full power (but you should already be at full power) and fully deflect the elevator aft and fully apply left rudder and hold the controls tight. This will cause the airplane to swap ends without too much backward sliding. Pull power as it swaps ends, and then neutralize the controls, or you'll be spinning. Unlikely you'll hurt anything doing this. Have you had advanced spin training? Highly recommended before playing with the edges of the envelope like this.
No need to let it go this far though. Play around with kicking at different stages of the upline, before the yarn really starts flickering hard. You're way late if it actually starts going slack. You'll eventually get a feel for what produces a nice turnaround. Again, one session of knowledgeable ground critiquing will do more for you than weeks/months of playing with this stuff on your own. This yarn thing is just one way to get a feel for things. Once you do, you shouldn't need to keep it on the airplane. The real reason aerobatic pilots have yarn or string (typically tied to their sighting device) is to know the instant the airplane starts backwards so they can apply the elevator one way or the other to cause the airplane to swing a certain way when deliberately doing tailslides. Same thing for reversing aileron on some airplanes when doing torque rolls.
But some people do use the yarn to time the hammer pivot. They kick when the yarn starts to flicker a certain way. There are several ways to gauge the timing of the kick, and some are aircraft-specific. Kicking at 60KT will cause what we call a 'fly-over' rather than a tight pivot. A 180 HP RV at full power has a high enough power-to-weight ratio to make the ASI fairly useless for timing a quality hammer pivot. Some airplanes will buffet at the top due to the tightening slipstream. In the Pitts, I use a certain amount of right aileron deflection (with no roll reaction) to gauge my vertical speed and kick at just the right time (almost dead stopped).
As far as right-rudder hammers go, unless you are flying an engine that turns the opposite direction, they're fairly pointless, and they'll never look as good as a pivot that goes in the direction of slipstream yaw. Going against it is just fighting what the airplane really wants to do. But those who are hellbent on doing hammers in the "opposite direction" will likely need to reduce power slightly. Another thing that helps here is "sliding" your upline a little to provide additional rudder authority at the top. You, for example, would make a very slight bank to the right as you pull vertical. This will require you to make a left rudder yaw correction upon reaching the vertical upline in order to cause the airplane to fly vertically in yaw. This left rudder correction will be held on the way up, and "slide" the airplane to the right. Then when it comes time to kick right, you have additional right rudder authority. I'd recommend forgetting about it, but if you're having fun with those...well that's the whole point.
So, since you've got some negative G capability, try working on doing rolls where you start and end in level flight, with no heading deviation, and your G meter indicates a precise +1/-1G after you're finished and in level flight. 
Last edited by sandifer : 08-28-2013 at 03:48 PM.
|

08-28-2013, 03:25 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: 20km outside of Zurich, Switzerland
Posts: 468
|
|
Thats correct!
Hi Des
Thats correct, pull power before the turn, otherwise I will be fighting the torque
In switzerland you need a aerobatic licence to do legaly stuff like this. We learnd it exactly this way, on the right hammerhead turn, pull the power when you apply full right rudder.
Have fun and fly save, regards,
__________________
Dominik
RV-7A, TMX-IO-320, FM-150, Sensenich FP
Flying since 28. April 2016
|

08-28-2013, 03:50 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: NC
Posts: 664
|
|
Last point on the right rudder hammer - right rudder (in Lycomings) causes a forward gyrocopic pitch reaction, so you need a little aft stick during the pivot rather than the forward stick you'd use during a normal left rudder hammer.
|

08-28-2013, 04:45 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Auckland New Zealand
Posts: 35
|
|
I would strongly recommend against playing around with tailslides in an RV. Good I needed that advice. Keeping from the inadvertent situation, especially if I am adding right rudder before the kick. I have a tuned Lycon IO360 that puts out more than 200hp with a Hartzell C/S . I normally set at 25/25 or 24.5/24.5 for aeros. Seldom use full power, or should I with this configuration in the hammer head?
Looking back you gave me a lot of good advice in March this year before my first competition thanks Eric.
Have you had advanced spin training? I don't know of anyone teaching it in NZ. Will ask some questions, not the sort of thing to do in the RV, and there aren't many 2 seater machines that are suitable.
try working on doing rolls where you start and end in level flight. Now you have touched on a challenge. Still not good at these, but getting there. Slowing down the roll co-ordinating ailerons, rudder and elevator. Very hard. :-)
|

08-29-2013, 01:44 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 54
|
|
For advanced aero's and spin training you need to have a chat with Richard Hood, Grant Benns or Wayne Ormrod ex Ardmore. If you need an intro let me know.
Not sure if the guys are -7 rated but an aircraft could be arranged I'm sure.
Plenty of folk around to help if you would like.
I could help also but I'm at completely the other end of the country and fly the -7 quite a bit.
NZ Aerobatic Club here also http://www.aerobatics.co.nz/
|
| Thread Tools |
Search this Thread |
|
|
|
| Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:06 AM.
|