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Prebuy madness....

brianwallis

VAF moderator
Names and dates have been changed to protect the guilty.... Mechanic gets a phone call to do a prebuy on an aircraft. Aircraft looks great on youtube... The next phone call was actually a confession that he or she had purchased the aircraft. The buyer was an A&P. He or she was not available to go get it or do the inspection. "Aircraft had hit a bush but has been repaired and is a nice aircraft. THE AIRCRAFT HIT A BUSH (and lots of other stuff) ON IT'S WAY TO THE CRASH! The usable parts of the aircraft are the data plate, wheels and some misc items. The aircraft had been put back together to look nice but the handful of metal in the suction screen and lots of other items were the death knell of the aircraft. Guys, please don't ever buy an aircraft unseen no matter how good the records or pictures look. Go find a mechanic if you have any questions whatsoever!! Anybody else out there have some horror prebuy stories? I know there have to be some good ones!!
Best,
Brian
 
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Flew out to PA from NE to pick up a RV-6a. During my pre-flight (before I paid the guy) I sumped the tanks and pulled out black, rusty water crud. :eek:

The "pilot" used an old metal 55 gallon drum to pump fuel and the hose has deteriorated and water and rust had collected in the bottom. There were NO filters of any kind on the farm hand crank pump. :eek:

I rented a car and drove home. Now when I go to look at a plane I get a round trip ticket. ;)
 
On the small uncontrolled field where I did my tailwheel training, there was a neglected (certified) plane in the grass tie down area. It looked really bad. One day I came out, and it was up on blocks. Next day it was sitting on the same tires but they now had air in them. The owner spent a few days doing work on the plane. (Unknown if the owner was an A&P, but most likely not) The airport manager came by and I asked what was going on. The manager said that he had not seen the owner in almost 10 years.

Well the owner started it up and ran it hard for 20 min. A old time instructor walked up and asked his intentions. He was going to take off and transport the plane for sale. We could not convince the guy to have it looked at by an A&P. Whoever bought that plane better have it checked out.

All sorts of neglect can be covered with some armor-all and a rattle can of paint.

I still think of that plane every time I visit that field.

But, heck, maybe sitting in the Houston humidity and heat for 10 years had no effect on the plane and it was perfectly fine. Or maybe the mud dabbers protected it with their nests. Hey, it was certified so it must be safe. ;)

Buyer beware.:eek:

In another story, a business acquaintance bought a beautiful, newly painted, certified plane. It was checked by the current owners A&P and the annual was signed off. Next annual and the new owners A&P found massive corrosion of the main spar. That was the end of that plane. It never flew again. But it took 5-years, and many inspections, for the new owner to come to terms with the situation before he sent the plane to the salvage yard.

I was lucky. I had essentially bought the plane sight unseen and had a mechanic (and an RV builder) check it out before handing over the check. But I was heavenly invested in the plane without knowing the condition. It turned out to be a great deal.
 
Ferry story

Years ago Commander Aircraft engaged me to pick up a 112 from London Ontario and ferry it to Oak City where they were going to refurbish it and sell it on. I was to stop nr Chicago and show it to the prospective buyer on the way.

Excluding the story about being stopped for smuggling and the aircraft being impounded for 24 hrs in Port Clinton Oh (which is another story altogether)...

The aircraft was "fresh out of c&a" and supposedly ready to go. I was told it was IFR equipped. It looked like at least the first leg would be IFR in standard Ohio summer 1 mile in haze and ceiling indeterminate.

Dropped off in London, airplane looks a bit ratty but hey, so does my plane. On my preflight I notice the tanks are half full, hmmmm, oh well I'm in a hurry. I mention I'm filing an IFR, the seller says something like "ummmm, I'm not sure I'd fly it IFR".

Decided I'd go around the patch before I left. Take off, hit the gear handle, nothing....jiggle it a few times, gear finally comes up. Ok, maybe the motor is a little old and tired. On final, go to put the gear down......nothing. Ok now I'm sweating a little. How would a gear up landing look before I'd even flown it 5 mins? A little more jiggling and the gear comes down.....slooooooowly....then 3 green, touch and go, and I'm off as the gear slowly groans its way back into the wells. Glad I had my brand new handheld lowrance GPS and my handheld radio. All the gyros started to spin like mad after 10 mins and the radios were almost useless!

Clear in at port Clinton (long customs story omitted) and then off to chitown to meet the customer. Get there, he's a no show. So, waiting in signature while they fill me up and I check weather. Line guy comes in "is that your commander on the ramp?" When I answer yes he says, ominously, "you'd better come see this". On the ram they had 4 or 5 pickle buckets lined up under the wings to catch the fuel pouring out as fast as they'd pumped it in. Well, I figured it would stop when it got down to the tabs, which is where the fuel was when i picked it up. Now I know why.

Took off again, Decide to head to Cincinnati LUK because of weather on the direct route. Nearing Cincinnati it's getting dark. About 3 miles out I decide to turn on the lights. Hit the switch....BANG.....FLASH......fizzzzzzzzz.....

I got lights alright, just flashy smelly smokey ones behind the panel!

Finally get it on the ground, park it, call the factory. "Come and get this pile of junk, I'm not flying it an inch further"

I understand when the factory pilot got it to the factory the mechanics there opened up the airframe and showed the pilot corrosion bad enough that he turned white when he saw it.
 
Once drove all the way to Kansas to buy a Breezy. The Cub wings turned out to be homebuilt plywood wings, the fuselage welding was "improved" with a nice fairing of Bondo over each joint, and the 150 hours on the Franklin apparently referred to time spent under water.

Another trip...off to a well known airpark community in Florida to bring home a 75% GlaStar project. Everything was fine except the wings and tails, which are conventional riveted aluminum much like an RV. I swear the guy had set all the rivets with a roofing hatchet. Never before and never since have I seen rivet work that bad.

There were more, but my favorite was close to home. My buddy Ron asked me to go with him to look at a nice little aerobatic airplane. Turned out I knew the seller from previous adventures roadracing motorcycles; great guy, but sure to have pushed the airplane to its limits. Well, the airplane was nice, and my two buddies made a sort of handshake deal, subject to spouse approval and a good night's sleep. The seller said he would fly a little demonstration before we went. So, we watched him strap in and fire up. About 10 seconds later one of the motor mount bolts fell out of the cowl. It had broken cleanly at a worn spot.

No, Ron didn't buy it.
 
I have travelled across a few states to look at an airplane that the "owner" didn't own; "It's OK, I have a licence to sell used cars in Minnasota" I was told.
Well, we had a nice trip to Mt Rushmore and the Black Hills on the way home, so I guess it was a salvaged weekend.
 
A happy outcome

I actually bought the IO-360 for my RV-8 off of Ebay! :eek:

Insane! you would think, but a phone call and a little background on the seller convinced me he was a stand-up guy, and the engine was sound. 250 trouble-free hours later, I still am happy with my find.

Amazing how unscrupulous someone could be to try to sell a wreck as an airworthy airplane.
 
Once drove all the way to Kansas to buy a Breezy. The Cub wings turned out to be homebuilt plywood wings, the fuselage welding was "improved" with a nice fairing of Bondo over each joint, and the 150 hours on the Franklin apparently referred to time spent under water.

Another trip...off to a well known airpark community in Florida to bring home a 75% GlaStar project. Everything was fine except the wings and tails, which are conventional riveted aluminum much like an RV. I swear the guy had set all the rivets with a roofing hatchet. Never before and never since have I seen rivet work that bad.

There were more, but my favorite was close to home. My buddy Ron asked me to go with him to look at a nice little aerobatic airplane. Turned out I knew the seller from previous adventures roadracing motorcycles; great guy, but sure to have pushed the airplane to its limits. Well, the airplane was nice, and my two buddies made a sort of handshake deal, subject to spouse approval and a good night's sleep. The seller said he would fly a little demonstration before we went. So, we watched him strap in and fire up. About 10 seconds later one of the motor mount bolts fell out of the cowl. It had broken cleanly at a worn spot.

No, Ron didn't buy it.

....Darwin, and his band of gene-pool removal guys:)

Best,
 
Flew up to look at a Hiperbipe armed with the knowledge that the glue joints in some aircraft were subject to age related failure. Opened up the wings and sure enough, the master ribs and corner blocks were separated from the skin and spars. When shown this, the owner didn't seem phased at all and even admitted he'd never removed the inspection covers in the 10 years he owned the airplane. In any case, he didn't think that this was an issue, and he sure wasn't going to adjust his asking price for something as trivial as a complete rebuild of 4 wings. Needless to say, I walked away from that one. This airplane would pop up from time to time on the forums and I told several perspective buyers about the problems I found. Last I heard it was destroyed in a ground loop during a demo flight (!) for another potential buyer.
 
When shown this, the owner didn't seem phased at all and even admitted he'd never removed the inspection covers in the 10 years he owned the airplane.

Amazing how this seems to happen over and over.
I once was brought a FlyBaby for an annual condition inspection. I asked the owner if he had covers for the inspection holes that I would have to cutout of the wing covering. He said he didn't want them cut out. The aircraft had been through 5 annual condition inspections without the holes being cut.
I told him that I could not inspect the aircraft without cutting the inspection holes. He reluctantly found some covers.
 
I was shocked too Mel. What’s even worse is that these were sheet metal covers held on with screws... no cutting of fabric required, just 10 seconds with a screwdriver.

He was an old time ag pilot who flew the airplane from his back yard when he needed to work out some aggression. He seemed to almost brag about the number of Stearmans and Ag Cats he crashed in his career, so I guess it’s no surprise he took such a light view of a condition inspection.
 
I've heard stories of guys finding tools or BAGS of fasteners marked WR_ALC still sitting in planes (C-130's and C-5's) that could have only been left at the previous Depot Maint interval, 5-10 years previous....
 
Back when the C-141's were being run through WR-ALC there was the story about a filter bypass light coming on during an engine run. Filter pulled and stuff found that didn't look normal. Turned out to be the remains of a mattress used in the fueltank. It was used to cover the structure inside the tank while workers were in the tank doing maintenance.
 
Mattresses are used in the wings for more than protection of the structure... I know several stories where certain employees used to "earn extra income" (if you get my drift) up in the wings.
 
Back when the C-141's were being run through WR-ALC there was the story about a filter bypass light coming on during an engine run. Filter pulled and stuff found that didn't look normal. Turned out to be the remains of a mattress used in the fueltank. It was used to cover the structure inside the tank while workers were in the tank doing maintenance.

Not REMOTELY surprised. First time I went into the hayloft (above the rear cargo door) on a C-5 there were two mechanics sound asleep up there. Wife's dad used to work 130's and said a guy fell asleep on top of the center wing, rolled over and fell down onto a work stand....
 
I've heard stories of guys finding tools or BAGS of fasteners marked WR_ALC still sitting in planes (C-130's and C-5's) that could have only been left at the previous Depot Maint interval, 5-10 years previous....

I've seen tools, rags, dorito bags, nuts, bolts, etc pulled out of fuel cells.

There was a box wrench left in the engine bay of an F-18 that went un-noticed for 2-3 days. In that time, the jet flew 6-7 times, combat sorties from the boat. When the missing tool was discovered to be AWOL the jet was torn apart and they found the wrench in the wing root area on the opposite side. The crazy thing, is that there is no path through the structure to get from where the tool was left, to where it was found, and that part of the jet hadn't been opened up since two phase inspections prior. :eek:

Mattresses are used in the wings for more than protection of the structure... I know several stories where certain employees used to "earn extra income" (if you get my drift) up in the wings.

Intakes of fighters are a good place for those same kinds of shennanigans. Buddy of mine got great FLIR footage a few years ago. He was sitting on deck at night waiting for a fuel hose, playing with the FLIR pod when he noticed something unusual. He could see the fan blades down the intake of one motor, but something was unusual about the other one (jet was parked facing opposite him). Upon zooming in he had a clear shot of exactly what was going on, as there were two people, and two pairs of feet. After capturing several minutes of priceless video, he had a flight deck chief plug into the interphone and had them go "FOD check" the intake.
 
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Tool Control

We took it very seriously in the AF. As a young airman, I was just at the end of my shift one day, working in the rotodome on an E-3 AWACS. For whatever reason, a very small socket came off my wrench and somehow found it's way into one of the struts (the legs that hold the rotating dome). Well, I heard it clank it's way down...but only about half way. Since I couldn't turn in a complete CTK to the tool crib, I got the honor of staying over, de-paneling the strut, panel by panel, until I retrieved my socket. For anyone who's ever tried to get coin slot fasteners out, you know that I had the sheet metal guy standing by to drill out several of them...lol Man, that was a long day. First and last time. A tool left in an aircraft can kill you faster than anything if it ends up in the right place.
 
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