How to speed up RV-4 building

Camillo · #1 10-20-2012, 11:36 AM

Hallo. My mind is again towards the RV-4 project.
I saw a partially built kit and I felt in love.

I ordered the preview plans set and heard some builder time to build. Too much for me, since I am now working hard and can't dedicate too much time on the project.

Does somebody offer a prepunched fuselage kit to speed up building? I already built a QB RV9A (2000 hours work) and don't want to cheat. Simply, just trying to save some time.

Thanks.
Camillo

David Paule · #2 10-20-2012, 11:56 AM

The closest thing to that is the RV-8.

Dave

Ironflight · #3 10-20-2012, 03:01 PM

There is an RV-3 advertised for sale that is pretty far along, and the pictures look good....do you need another two-seater?

rbibb · #4 10-20-2012, 03:40 PM

There is no pre-punched fuselage kit for the RV-4 I'm aware of. Also, compared to the RV-9 the RV-4 is a lot more work in terms of laying put and drilling the skins, etc. All in all if you want to build one fast buy one already built or partially built.

All in all building a -4 requires a it more patience and planning than a pre-piunched kit. The wing skins are prepunched but the underlying structure (ribs, spar) isn't so you have to be careful to make sure things line up and proper edge distance maintained, etc. Of course you have to build a simple jig to hold things while you are drilling, etc.

Bottom line is the RV-4 isn't a fast build kit and needs to be approached as such. If you are too much in a hurry you will surely get frustrated.

But it is not hard to build - just lots of repetitive tasks that need attention to detail. More attention that the pre-punched kits because you have to actually locate the holes and not just ream to size.

But its a great airplane and worth every minute of it. Probably be best bang for buck for a 2 place RV IMHO.

Richard
RV-4 N144KT

Camillo · #5 10-20-2012, 03:45 PM

Thank-you.
I think I will end ordering the kit.
Will see how long it will take.

rv4swede · #6 10-22-2012, 12:48 AM

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neumanno · #7 12-30-2012, 11:07 PM

Hi all, long time reader here, first time poster. While I have not built a plane yet I have always been intriqued by homebuilt airplanes and definately see myself building one of the RVs as soon as I can afford it. After a LOT of reading on here about the different models and differences between them its a toss up between an RV-8 and HRII with the favor going to the HRII (sometime in the near future hopefully..just doing my homework

, BUT like the OP I am concerned with the unavailability of a QB RV-4 and finding the time to finish a slow build working full time sounds very difficult. Now I in no way want to "hire" someone to build me a plane, I very much want to build my own plane to be used for my own recreation. I have read a few lengthy threads here regarding the 51% percent rule so I am pretty familiar with it, and also saw quite a bit of resentment towards professional building assistance. Now, when you order a QB kit arent you essentially receiving professional building assistance? I cant imagine ordering a QB kit is in any way frowned upon here right? Couldnt someone wanting to speed up the -4 building process hire someone experienced to say bring a -4 kit to the build level that you would receive a QB -8? Do you think it would be cost effective for someone to do this given that most of the parts are not prepunched? Also, is a Vans QB kit considered 49% or a smaller percentage of total work?

Thanks,
Oliver

BSwayze · #8 12-30-2012, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by neumanno

Hi all, long time reader here, first time poster. While I have not built a plane yet I have always been intriqued by homebuilt airplanes and definately see myself building one of the RVs as soon as I can afford it. After a LOT of reading on here about the different models and differences between them its a toss up between an RV-8 and HRII with the favor going to the HRII (sometime in the near future hopefully..just doing my homework

, BUT like the OP I am concerned with the unavailability of a QB RV-4 and finding the time to finish a slow build working full time sounds very difficult. Now I in no way want to "hire" someone to build me a plane, I very much want to build my own plane to be used for my own recreation. I have read a few lengthy threads here regarding the 51% percent rule so I am pretty familiar with it, and also saw quite a bit of resentment towards professional building assistance. Now, when you order a QB kit arent you essentially receiving professional building assistance? I cant imagine ordering a QB kit is in any way frowned upon here right? Couldnt someone wanting to speed up the -4 building process hire someone experienced to say bring a -4 kit to the build level that you would receive a QB -8? Do you think it would be cost effective for someone to do this given that most of the parts are not prepunched? Also, is a Vans QB kit considered 49% or a smaller percentage of total work?

Thanks,
Oliver

Oliver, welcome to VAF!

It's an interesting idea... to have someone bring an RV-4 kit to a QB stage for you. Whether or not this will still fall under the 51% rule isn't something I can answer for you. The current QB kits as ordered from Vans do qualify under the 51% rule. Nobody around here frowns on the QB kits, that I know of. Many have been built or are currently under construction.

Here's the problem with your idea, as I see it. The difference in price between a standard kit and the QB kit is essentially the labor cost to pay the crew to put it together for you. This work is done outside the U.S., obviously for much less than it could be done for here. Trained, experienced crews who do this work all day, every day, get it done quickly, efficiently and in a cost-effective manner, making a QB kit a pretty good value.

With your RV-4 idea, none of that is the case. I'm going to assume that you would hire someone locally, and that person (or persons) would be partially assembling a kit for you that isn't pre-punched. Jigs are required, and more time for layout, etc. They don't do this all day, every day. The efficiency isn't there. Neither is the economy of scale. They're going to put a LOT of hours into this work, and you're paying the bill. The bottom line? I can't possibly see how you could get this done in a cost effective way. My strong hunch is, you'd be better off just ordering a QB RV-8. Unless money is no object to you. Or future resale value.

BigglesRV7A · #9 12-31-2012, 01:39 AM

Camillo,

There is a father / son team doing fast builds and it was discussed in another thread on the RV3B. Worth a look if your really interested in speeding up the process.

Here is their link: http://www.rvbuilder.com/

Cheers, Greg (RV-7A M1B)

Clouddancer · #10 12-31-2012, 04:31 AM

Camillo

Altough we (I'm building together with a friend) bought the airframe almost finished from another builder, we found that the systems and all the small things (like Erik stated before) will still eat up alot of time. This is especially true if you start altering the original layout from Vans. I can tell, because we did and still do quit some modifications ..and we like it, because it's what "experimental" is all about for us, BUT IT REQUIRES ADDITIONAL TIME. You will spend alot of time thinking about the layout, the best options and to check that you do not build a flying trap that will mess up later on. This is not RV-4 specific, but the plans of the RV-4 leave more room for interpretations than later models.