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11-27-2012, 11:35 AM
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 421
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Quote:
Originally Posted by txaviator
I can't stress enough though, that when breaking the edges, it is a VERY VERY subtle bend. Nothing major.
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I'm the guilty party here. So when you broke your edges, did you see an actual slight line in the skin? Or am I doing too much pressure? I should say that both Avery and Cleaveland make excellent tools and I am happy (sort of) to give them my money for the quality I receive...that said....I watched the EAA video, and they show a line and then talk about how that can be buffed out later.
I haven't gone far with this process yet. And this is the first thing that I have found rather intimidating in the build process. I get the concept, the idea and the process. It's just the result that has me wondering if I am doing to much breaking, or if it is really required at all?
The Cleaveland tool should arrive shortly and I will scrap my scrap....some more!
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11-27-2012, 12:41 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Arlington, TX (DFW)
Posts: 1,164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cactuspilot
I'm the guilty party here. So when you broke your edges, did you see an actual slight line in the skin? Or am I doing too much pressure? I should say that both Avery and Cleaveland make excellent tools and I am happy (sort of) to give them my money for the quality I receive...that said....I watched the EAA video, and they show a line and then talk about how that can be buffed out later.
I haven't gone far with this process yet. And this is the first thing that I have found rather intimidating in the build process. I get the concept, the idea and the process. It's just the result that has me wondering if I am doing to much breaking, or if it is really required at all?
The Cleaveland tool should arrive shortly and I will scrap my scrap....some more!
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Yes! You will see a slight line, most definitely. Part of this is the slight bend/break of the skin, and some of what you see will be a line formed by nylon roller residue (if using the Avery style tool I used).. But yes, you WILL see a faint line, which should be perfectly straight down the edge where you 'broke' the skin.
This part is tough to explain, but it takes a pretty decent amount of tool pressure to create the SUBTLE bend. Just be sure that when pulling the tool toward you, that you keep the face of the tool flush against the outer edge of the skin. Again, this is using the hand-held 'puck' style tool. The vice-grip version is a completely different animal, in terms of describing its use. I loved the results from the puck style tool.
__________________
Gary Robertson
Arlington, TX
RV-12 Built / Sold / Flying
Currently Flying: Cessna Skyhawk 172
Rebuilding a true barn find J-3 Cub
Last edited by txaviator : 11-27-2012 at 12:44 PM.
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11-27-2012, 01:39 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Marshall TX (KASL)
Posts: 1,783
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I was very happy with the vice-grip style tool. For ME (then a first time builder), the key to that was NOT to "pull" it towards me. Instead, one hand held the tool and the other hand turned the roller part manually. VERY precise control resulted from that method, compared to "pulling" and "running off the edge." It is just a small amount slower. Either tool works with the right technique though.
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11-27-2012, 01:49 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: La Feria Texas
Posts: 3,822
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I never got beyond the "pulling" phase, should have tried the push system. My problem was learning to control it in such a way that it did not run off the edge constantly. Unlike the nylon rollers, the vise grip type tool takes very little pressure to get the right bend, in the beginning I was using too much pressure on the rollers. Also don't try to "force a bend" with this tool, let the rollers do all the work and do not try to twist the tool to make a bend.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill_H
I was very happy with the vice-grip style tool. For ME (then a first time builder), the key to that was NOT to "pull" it towards me. Instead, one hand held the tool and the other hand turned the roller part manually. VERY precise control resulted from that method, compared to "pulling" and "running off the edge." It is just a small amount slower. Either tool works with the right technique though.
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11-27-2012, 02:26 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 1,647
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XOverZero
G'Day rgmwa: Also have the Cleaveland tool and will very soon be doing this step. Could you please clarify just a bit...were you able to gradually increase the break angle on the top skin with this tool, according to the plans (seems maybe not possible)? Or, did you disregard that part and simply made the break uniform over its full length?
Thanks in advance,
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XOZ: I used the tool as normal to put a uniform break on both sides of the top skin. Then to increase the break over the rear portion as shown in Fig 1, Page 10.02, I did what I said not to do in the previous post - applied more downward/rotational force to progressively increase the break toward the end of the skin. You could also use the normal wide-mouthed pliers type of tool to do this if you have one.
The main trick with using the Cleaveland tool is to adjust the gap betwen the rollers so that it is not so tight that it becomes difficult to drag along the edge, nor so loose that it doesn't form the break properly. Then make sure you hold it firmly against the edge so that it doesn't slip off.
__________________
rgmwa
RV-12LR 912ULS
120346
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11-28-2012, 06:13 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 421
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UPDATE -
I received the vice-grip rollers from CT and tried those today using the instructions provided and they did a much better job for me. I am pretty happy with the bottom skins now. The trick does seem to be to get the right clamping force and it does leave a very slight, but consistent line and the overlap seam is very tight. I would post pics but I don't have the pic posting process down just yet.
Thanks to all for your advice and counsel.
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12-08-2012, 07:03 AM
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: MILAN, MICHIGAN
Posts: 2
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Breaking Edges of Skins
Regarding edge breaking of skins, I'm building RV number three and have found the Cleveland tool the best one, by far, for this job. A neater joint will be formed if the edges are so formed.
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12-08-2012, 07:27 AM
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: Boone, Iowa
Posts: 342
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XOverZero
G'Day rgmwa: Also have the Cleaveland tool and will very soon be doing this step. Could you please clarify just a bit...were you able to gradually increase the break angle on the top skin with this tool, according to the plans (seems maybe not possible)? Or, did you disregard that part and simply made the break uniform over its full length?
Thanks in advance,
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Always practice on scrap first, but I would recommend doing it all uniform first, then sequentially tightening up the tool and re-rolling the parts that you want more of a bend. Keep in mind that on most surfaces the bend should be so slight that it's barely noticeable. This is often overdone. Use a razor blade to see when the skin edge is just leaving the blade edge, and that is all you need. The object is only to keep the skin tight against the other skin in between the set rivets, not to create a crease.
-Mike
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12-08-2012, 02:23 PM
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Davenport, IA
Posts: 1,390
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The Cleaveland tool if used correctly beautifully breaks the edge on the skins. There will be NO line or crease. The break is almost imperceptible. Using a flat surface, as suggested by Mike, such as a razor blade shows your progress.
From my blog.....
"To use this tool, open up the set screw and close the jaws. Then put the tool on the edge of the piece to be broken with about 20% of the roller engaging the skin. Then tighten the set screw just enough to get the rollers to touch the metal. Then open the jaws and close them with edge guide (roller collar) against the edge of the material. Then just pull the tool along the edge without twisting it down. The tool does the work and only bends about 3/16ths inch of the edge down. If the tool does not pull along easily, you have it too tight. Remember, you are not putting a large bend in the edge, but a slight bend (2 degree) on the very edge. The tool does that without having to twist the tool. If you twist the tool down while pulling on it, you will put a crease about 5/8ths inch in from the edge where the inner edge of the tool is. That is not where the break is supposed to be."
And I add......If you make three passes with the tool, with it slightly loose to start and then tightening it ever so slightly between passes, you will have more control of the tool. And always ensure the collar on the tool remains against the skin edge.
Last edited by MartySantic : 12-08-2012 at 02:28 PM.
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08-24-2014, 11:50 PM
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Switzerland, Europe
Posts: 199
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straigten
Quote:
Originally Posted by cactuspilot
The one I did break looks like ****. I mean it is on the bottom, and I guess it lies a little flatter - I really didn't break it that much and paint will fix all....but I really don't want to do any more edge breaking if I can help it.
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My F-1282R looks exactly the same. Like **** 
The edge has become wavy over a length of about 23" and the more I try to fix it the worse it gets. I consider to re-order that part, although it's gonna be very pricy, above all to properly crate and to ship it safely to Europe.
Unless there is a way to get the edge straight again. I was using the Avery "hockey puck" tool which I am not blaming. It was me, learning that technique on a precious A/C part. If only I had ....
I still have hope that somebody can point me to a less expensive solution rather than re-ordering.
Thank you !!!!!
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