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  #11  
Old 12-04-2012, 03:29 AM
Maj. Woody Maj. Woody is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 32
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Wow this thread has really got me thinking...almost wondering if the risks of a low wing plane with no doors is worth the risk. I remember when Charlie Hillard lost his life when his Sea Fury flipped over on landing. Landing in a cornfield is more than likely going to flip you over. How about ditching! Can the canopy be opened under water or will the forces be too great. On land I would worry most about a post crash fire and no way to escape. Can the canopy be jettisoned prior to touchdown? If so, will the strike the tail? Lots of new things for an aspiring RV owner to think about.....
Dom
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  #12  
Old 12-04-2012, 05:48 AM
foka4 foka4 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Ankeny, IA
Posts: 210
Default Unlatch canopy on touchdown?

It's SOP in many aircraft to pop the door open on short final in an emergency landing. I wonder if unlatching the canopy on or just before touchdown would be helpful. You could hold the latch open (while holding the canopy closed) with your left hand after you're done pulling power. If it seems a nose-over is imminent, you could toss the canopy open.

Its doubtful you'd remember to do it when your mind turns to mush in a real emergency, but it might be a reasonable item to include on an emergency checklist. If you have a passenger, unlatching the canopy might be a good task to offload to them.

I don't know - it might be a dumb idea, but its something to think about.

M
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  #13  
Old 12-04-2012, 06:21 AM
Mopar591 Mopar591 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SW Louisiana
Posts: 119
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I am building a -4 and I have been thinking about this really hard. I have looked at installing explosive bolts and also the explosive Actuators under the canopy rail that could be used to "blow" the canopy off quickly in an emergency. I don't even know where I could get such hardware and I have been looking into other options.
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  #14  
Old 12-04-2012, 07:04 AM
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Ironflight Ironflight is offline
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Dayton, NV
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Before you commit a lot of effort to (safely) installing explosive bolts, canopy pushers, and ejection seats, you might ask the question "just how many folks have died BECAUSE they couldn't get out of an RV-4 after a flip?" Finding out the actual risk involved with a potential problem is the first step in comparing that risk to OTHER risks that you might be buying in to with a fix.

No, I haven't done that research, but I can't recall hearing of such a case in the past ten years that I have been involved in RV's....
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  #15  
Old 12-04-2012, 07:10 AM
Mopar591 Mopar591 is offline
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: SW Louisiana
Posts: 119
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Very true, the fire risk seems to be the biggest threat. I will be flying with my wife and don't want Her stuck inside. I will be Installing a fire suppression system. It's extra weight, but it's cheap life Insurance.. Last thing i want is to burn alive because Im stuck in a canopy that may be in soft dirt or mud.
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  #16  
Old 12-04-2012, 09:11 AM
RVFlyer RVFlyer is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Rockwall, TX
Posts: 103
Default Be findable (my new word for the day)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neal@F14 View Post
I also know someone who rolled his RV-4 over on a soft field landing. He needed help to get out of the plane. Fortunately his buddy saw it happen and ran to help him get out of the plane.
One thing that my primary instructor taught me 25 years ago and I share with all of my students....don't crash any further from the farmhouse than you want to crawl with a broken leg or two. Similar strategy on this issue....try to make sure someone finds you ASAP.

I've thought about this a lot. Here in Kansas everyone says "look at all the places you can go if the engine fails". True, but in the RV I seriously worry about ending up in a field, upside down, with the roll bar buried part way. It makes dodging power lines and mailboxes on country roads look like a very reasonable option. Not to mention someone will find you pretty soon on a road. In a field, maybe not.
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  #17  
Old 12-04-2012, 12:00 PM
WAM120RV WAM120RV is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Coventry. England
Posts: 614
Default Risk???

Ironflight is right...... how many accidents have resulted in an upside down 4 with the person trapped inside?

Yes, of course its possible, but before stir up a lot of fear, do the research and establish if there is a problem...... I would be interested in the results. I think its much more likely in an A model with a nose flip. What tends to happen with 4's is the gear collapses under the wing if its banged in.

While the flip over in the 9 is a cause for concern for me, I have never worried about this in a 4. The brakes are not powerful enough to induce this.
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  #18  
Old 12-04-2012, 12:28 PM
Warren Moore Warren Moore is offline
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 28
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Steve, not so sure about the RV4 brakes not being strong enough. Was flying my -4 into Kern County ap. first in a gaggle of about 10 rv's. Misjudged the speed and floated too far, really didn't want to miss that first turn off and force the guys behind me to go around (who wants to be that guy!). At just above a normal taxi speed i put the brakes on hard and the tail came right up and fast! An -4 will go on its nose with overally agressive braking.

As you know the rv4 canopy is attached with soft pop rivets to allow it to be jetttisoned. I'm thinking about re-designing my canopy hold-open bar as it is pretty strong, as most I have seen are, and might defeat the purpose of the soft rivets. i want the option of jettisoning the canopy, and have it come off cleanly.

Warren Moore
RV4
hooks - houston.
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  #19  
Old 12-04-2012, 02:19 PM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: 8I3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ironflight View Post
"just how many folks have died BECAUSE they couldn't get out of an RV-4 after a flip?"
I don't want to be the first to find out.

I had a friend who has since passed flipped an RV-6 in an off-airport landing due to a mechanical malfunction. No fire but he had to dig his way out and cut his hands up on the way out. In a muddy plowed field the airplane sank to where he had about a foot of space to crawl through.

Just ordered a Gerber E-Tool Folding Shovel which should fit nicely in one of the compartments the Rocket has within easy reach. Seems to be a good idea.
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