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  #31  
Old 11-19-2012, 06:32 AM
David-aviator David-aviator is offline
 
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Location: Chesterfield, Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n761tj View Post
Avblend is a single component, thin mineral oil. It was created in the 1950's.

Some people swear it helps with valve sticking. If it works for you great!

I have tested it thoroughly for wear and corrosion protection and it only hurts performance because it thins the oil reducing the oil film thickness. The thinner oil is what gives them the claim of better fuel economy. It evaporates in about 5 hours in most aircraft.

Camguard is comprised of 11 high performance additives and is 100% active with no diluents. We offer demonstrable proof of performance in rust and corrosion protection, deposit control (the only product to do so), wear reduction and seal conditioning/protection.

Avblend sponsors Sean Tucker, which is fine.

It took Mike Busch 2 years to test Camguard for himself. He is not on our payroll.

You should look at both companies data and judge for yourself.

Ed
Thank you, I will.
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  #32  
Old 11-19-2012, 08:17 AM
n761tj n761tj is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketbob View Post
Yep. I have a friend that mixes Phillips Tropartic with X/C and is working with an engineer from Phillips who regularly samples his oil. Troparctic is high in ZDDP, is that what you are concerned with? As I understand it the newer diesel oils are made to work with particulate filters and have to be low in ZDDP to avoid getting ash deposits in them.
The Tropartic has slightly reduced ZDDP but the highest metallic content is from the overbased detergents and is thus the biggest problem. It is interesting that a Phillips engineer would would gamble with his friends life by promoting the use of an ash containing oil in an air-cooled aircraft engine. The oil may test just fine even after the engine fails due to catastrophic preignition caused by metallic ash deposits in the combustion chamber.

Ed
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  #33  
Old 11-19-2012, 08:25 AM
n761tj n761tj is offline
 
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Originally Posted by 6 Gun View Post
Bought a 182 from up north that used Exxon 15-50 and two cans of avblend every 25hrs oil change had cyl in 400hrs so I started to wonder what went wrong in my thinking heres what happened . Cold engine 15w oil when cold add two cans of avblend maybe 5w maybe 10w on take offf when you need the best protection dont get it till engine gets hot.looked at msds sheet and seen that avblend was 99% mineral spirits and hydrofluoric acid .You might want to see whats in Cam guard before you run it. they have some nice T shirts though.
Bob
Avblend is 99% thin mineral oil (0W) not mineral spirits a solvent (charcoal lighter fluid) and 1% ether (starting fluid). Where did you get the hydrofluoric acid, one of the most dangerous compounds around?

Ed
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  #34  
Old 11-19-2012, 10:07 AM
N427EF N427EF is offline
 
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Default Thanks Ed

Ed, thank you for posting here and sharing your expertise.

Quote:
I dislike air/oil on aircraft because of the chemical activity of the blow-by gasses and aircraft engines produce a lot of blow-by. ANY blow-by returned to the sump is bad.
I was just considering an air/oil separator installation, maybe not such a good idea. I have heard the same story before but coming from you, it carries more weight.
I may be dropping Avblend in favor of Camguard now.
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  #35  
Old 11-19-2012, 10:30 AM
David-aviator David-aviator is offline
 
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Originally Posted by N427EF View Post
Ed, thank you for posting here and sharing your expertise.



I was just considering an air/oil separator installation, maybe not such a good idea. I have heard the same story before but coming from you, it carries more weight.
I may be dropping Avblend in favor of Camguard now.
Ernst,

I suspect your concern is a dirty bottom skin from the breather. I went the separator route with a previous airplane and it never worked well, seemed like the blow by took a lot of stuff with it not withstanding the separator feature. Also, the separator can needs regular service as it does capture water and other junk coming out to the engine. I can not imagine plumbing it back into the crank case.

What seems to work reasonably well with regard to keeping the bottom skin kind of clean is routing the breather exit just above one of the exhaust stacks. The hot pipe probably super vaporizes the breather stuff and there is less mess on the bottom skin.
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  #36  
Old 11-19-2012, 10:50 AM
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DanH DanH is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n761tj View Post
I dislike air/oil on aircraft because of the chemical activity of the blow-by gasses and aircraft engines produce a lot of blow-by. ANY blow-by returned to the sump is bad.
Thank you Ed. Serious question; would you judge CamGuard to be an adequate prophylactic against that chemical activity?
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  #37  
Old 11-19-2012, 11:19 AM
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rocketbob rocketbob is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n761tj View Post
The Tropartic has slightly reduced ZDDP but the highest metallic content is from the overbased detergents and is thus the biggest problem. It is interesting that a Phillips engineer would would gamble with his friends life by promoting the use of an ash containing oil in an air-cooled aircraft engine. The oil may test just fine even after the engine fails due to catastrophic preignition caused by metallic ash deposits in the combustion chamber.

Ed
He's been flying his rocket for a number of years with a 50/50 mix of Troparctic and X/C, and probably averages 120 hours/year. When the formulation changed for Troparctic they (Phillips) had him dial the ratio back a bit. I will ask him tonight but he has had absolutely no problems with the oil mix itself. I've seen the inside of his 540 and its clean as a whistle, but he has had a few cases of sticking valves. I know several other people that have run full synthetics with few problems.
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Last edited by rocketbob : 11-19-2012 at 11:22 AM.
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  #38  
Old 11-19-2012, 11:34 AM
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Mike S Mike S is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n761tj View Post
I dislike air/oil on aircraft because of the chemical activity of the blow-by gasses and aircraft engines produce a lot of blow-by. ANY blow-by returned to the sump is bad.

Ed
And if the captured fluid is not returned to the crankcase????
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  #39  
Old 11-19-2012, 12:04 PM
n761tj n761tj is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanH View Post
Thank you Ed. Serious question; would you judge CamGuard to be an adequate prophylactic against that chemical activity?
This is ong thing that Camguard does very well. It quashes the chemical activity of the reactive species found in the blow-by.

Ed
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  #40  
Old 11-19-2012, 12:19 PM
n761tj n761tj is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketbob View Post
He's been flying his rocket for a number of years with a 50/50 mix of Troparctic and X/C, and probably averages 120 hours/year. When the formulation changed for Troparctic they (Phillips) had him dial the ratio back a bit. I will ask him tonight but he has had absolutely no problems with the oil mix itself. I've seen the inside of his 540 and its clean as a whistle, but he has had a few cases of sticking valves. I know several other people that have run full synthetics with few problems.
Why have you seen the insides of his engine?

If the engine was so clean why did he have valve sticking? Ash deposits in the guides?

Did it look as clean as our certification engine? Note valve guide
http://aslcamguard.com/wp/wp-content...ion-Engine.pdf

Have you looked for combustion chamber deposits? The main issue.

I find it improbable that this was a Phillips (company) sanctioned endeavor.

Ed
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