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09-06-2006, 01:41 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Clearwater, FL
Posts: 287
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I can see why
I can relate with the supplier on this product of starting the warrenty at the time of purchase. Lets say you buy Superiors cylinders. You finish your plane and fly it 31 months later. Six months later your have high oil consumption and low compression. It turns out you have corrosion in the cylinders from sitting for such a long time. If you were Superior would you want to pay to replace cylinders? I sure wouldn't.
Trying to keep track of when someones warrenty period begins and ends would be a nightmare as well.
Sure if you sold some electronic gizmo that will have little harm from sitting a year or two before being used, a warrenty that begins with first flight would have better odds of not turning up problems. Even then I'd personally have a time limit set on it.
__________________
Bruce Smith
Clearwater, FL
RV-7A Fuse
N27DB reserved
web.tampabay.rr.com/flrv7a
"Political correctness is tyranny with manners."
Charlton Heston
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09-06-2006, 02:53 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: AUSTRALIA
Posts: 749
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If you want to use Superior cylinders and have a 3 year warranty from the time of first flight then get Aerosport Power to build your engine with Superior cylinders. They will build an engine using Superior, Lycoming or ECI parts or a combination of the three and give a full warranty from the time of first flight.
Fin
9A Australia
Aerosport 0-320. Mainly ECI parts with a Superior sump and Lycoming pistions (I think).
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09-06-2006, 04:31 PM
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Senior Curmudgeon
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Dayton Airpark, NV A34
Posts: 15,420
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At least they get it
Great!!! Thanks for the info.
That puts Aerosport on the top of the list as far as I am concerned.
Other than physical damage (such as dropping them), cylinders are basicly subject to two things that will hurt them.
!. Wear---a normal part of life.
2. Corrosion/rust etc. AKA chemical damage
If "Super Silinder Mfg" makes a production run of 1000 units, and they sit on the warehouse shelf for a year before "Joe's Engine Shop" buys, oh, say 30 units so they can get a better price, and they then sit on Joe's shelf for another year prior to being put on an engine that I buy, should the warrenty be already 2/3 used up?????
Of course not, that is just plane stupid.
Yet, what is the difference if they sit for a year or two on my project????
Dont try to tell me that the "conditions" in my hanger are not "controled",
If the engine builder did his job correctly, the engine will be protected against the various forms of chemical damage lurking arround waiting to eat my engine from the inside out. Sealed intake and exhaust ports, breathers, and those cute little plastic "spark plugs" with the pretty crystals in them. This is what I am used to seeing as a minimum------all the way up to a full "Pickeling" if you tell the shop you need it.
If I had to choose an enging from shop "A" or "B" and the only thing different was the warrenty starting at time of sale or sign off, guess what would be the "deal breaker" ???
Please dont think this is an "attack" on Superior-----it is just my thoughts on how a company should do business IMHO. How I would run it if I was in charge.
Mike
Last edited by Mike S : 09-06-2006 at 04:35 PM.
Reason: more info
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09-06-2006, 05:13 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Round Rock, TX
Posts: 3,778
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ECI WINS!!!
Well... my research is complete and ECI wins! Nickel, if you shop around can be bought RIGHT. With P, P & FB, ECI has the meat to perform this. The company doing my work give a FULL TBO warranty on the five angle valve job. Plus, one year on the cylinder head and five years on the cylinder bore from ECI.
Thanks for all the info and discussion. You all are Great!
__________________
Reiley
Retired N622DR - Serial #V7A1467
VAF# 671
Repeat Offender / Race 007
Friend of the RV-1
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09-06-2006, 05:30 PM
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Eastern PA
Posts: 625
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I just took delivery of a new Mattituck TMX-IO-360. It is a Lycoming roller lifter parts kit but I opted for ECI Titan cylinders for the corrosion protection.
Jekyll
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09-07-2006, 10:47 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 11
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Just to clarify Superior's engine warranty policy for you all, the warranty doesn't start until 6 months after date of purchase, or when you first start the engine if that is sooner. The engines are all preserved, so corrosion should not be an issue for at least 1-2 years (according to the manufacturer of the material used for preservation). The three year 500 hr. cylinder warranty is a separate issue regarding cylinders purchased to replace current cylinders on Lycoming or Continental engines or for overhauling an engine. Cylinders on the XP engines are covered by the warranty on the engine. Hope this helps a little!
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09-11-2006, 06:55 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Victoria, Canada
Posts: 2,251
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ECI high CHT problem solved
After enduring high cruise CHT's (380-400F with 58Fambient), I finally took the bull by the horns (the files by the tangs).
I cleaned out the flashings in the cooling fins below the spark plugs on my ECI Titan cylinders. This was inspired by my look at the ECI IOX-340 at Van's homecoming. The fins were clean on this engine.
After several hours and lots of elbow grease, the job was done, the plugs were back in and I did some flying tests.
I normalized all of my temperatures to standard conditions (ISA) to remove the ambient temperature variable.
Before cleaning fins: average cruise at ISA~CHT 360F
After cleaning fins: average cruise at ISA~CHT 325F
This is a remarkable and dramatic reduction of 35F.
My CHTs are uneven, so I'm playing around with dams on the front cylinders. The dams don't seem to change the average much, but sure are effective at adjusting the relative temperatures.
I'll be passing these results along to Bart Lalonde.
Vern Little
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09-12-2006, 07:41 AM
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Join Date: May 2005
Location: Tuttle, Oklahoma
Posts: 2,563
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by vlittle
I cleaned out the flashings in the cooling fins below the spark plugs on my ECI Titan cylinders.
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Vern, can you explain what was "cleaned" out of the flashings? Are we talking grease/oil build up collecting dirt over time? I am trying to get a picture in my mind of what would collect in this space adequately enough to adversly affect cooling.
Any additional info would be appreciated.
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09-12-2006, 08:13 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Victoria, Canada
Posts: 2,251
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When I said 'cleaned out the flashings', I should have said 'removed the flashings'.
The flashings are extra material that oozes out when the cylinders are cast, blocking the airflow through the fins. On my cylinders, the only flashings were in the fins between the sparkplugs.
Vern
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09-12-2006, 08:19 AM
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Join Date: May 2006
Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Posts: 152
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Vern:
**My CHTs are uneven, so I'm playing around with dams on the front cylinders. The dams don't seem to change the average much, but sure are effective at adjusting the relative temperatures.**
There are two factors in CHT. Heat IN and heat OUT. The heat IN part of the equation is a result of the realtive mixtures of the cylinders--we want all of them producing the same HP and therefore the same heat. Before making ANY attempt to even out CHTs with baffling (the heat OUT part of the equation), one must be certain that the heat IN part of the equation is addressed. What is your GAMI spread? If it is more than about .4 gph, then you should seriously consider addressing that before spending time on the heat OUT portion. Otherwise, you could be chasing your tail.
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