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  #21  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:19 PM
Mike S's Avatar
Mike S Mike S is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Dayton Airpark, NV A34
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Default Welcome to VAF!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Try2Fly View Post
+1 From a non pilot new member!!

Juan, to VAF.

Good to have you aboard.

I am in Calif, or would offer you that ride...... but I suspect it wont take long for someone closer to make an offer.
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Rv-10, N210LM.

Flying as of 12/4/2010

Phase 1 done, 2/4/2011

Sold after 240+ wonderful hours of flight.

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  #22  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:27 PM
E. D. Eliot E. D. Eliot is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: San Pedro
Posts: 1,013
Default Flight Schools

Will buy the RV-12 in great numbers - mark my words. This is exactly what is needed for flight schools.

Kudos to Van's for this offering. I expect that the 'improvements' to the seats, etc will add value also. Hope that the 'improvements' will be certified and available to those of us who are building the kit. What say you, Van's??? You knew that this was coming.
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  #23  
Old 10-11-2012, 06:40 PM
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boom3 boom3 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Sumner, WA
Posts: 722
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I think this is great news! I'd love to see some flight schools with them. I do wonder how they would do sitting outside in the rain for months though. I love my tip up 7A but it's not really great for wet operations. Maybe the 12 seals up a little better. We've probably all rented a leaky 152 a time or two but those things have been outside for thirty years.
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  #24  
Old 10-11-2012, 07:39 PM
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chevy chevy is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia, QLD
Posts: 41
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I love that paint scheme... The RV-14 and now this... Well done...
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  #25  
Old 10-11-2012, 07:47 PM
rjtjrt rjtjrt is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Australia
Posts: 775
Default

An excellent move.

I wonder how flight schools will react to fuel splashing effect on window?
Vans now will have an even less compliant customer group than us to deal with!
John
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  #26  
Old 10-11-2012, 08:25 PM
Peterk Peterk is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,378
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rjtjrt View Post
An excellent move.

I wonder how flight schools will react to fuel splashing effect on window?
Vans now will have an even less compliant customer group than us to deal with!
John
Van's did say they are going forward with the lessons of the 200 "beta testers" that have paved the way. I am surprised that they are going ahead with the tank in the cockpit without consideration for wing tanks. How many of the 200 actually remove their wings and trailer them around as originally expected. Twenty gallons in your cockpit is a pretty healthy trade-off for a gimmick unused.
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  #27  
Old 10-11-2012, 08:31 PM
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rvbuilder2002 rvbuilder2002 is offline
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Hubbard Oregon
Posts: 9,035
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike S View Post
Scott, what are the requirements for working on it, and for signing the annual?
An S-LSA RV-12 can be maintained and inspected by a holder of a Repairman/Maintenance certificate for fixed wing aircraft (specific certification is issued for different types such as weight shift, powered chute, etc.) or an A&P with Rotax specific training.
Use of an S-LSA aircraft for compensation or hire requires that 100 hr inspections be done just as they are for part 23 aircraft. If it is for personal use only, only a yearly condition inspection is required.

You can take a 120 hr class to obtain the Repairman/ Maintenance certification.
The reason an A&P needs Rotax specific training is because via the ASTM's that S-LSA aircraft are certificated under, the FAA gave the manufacturers the authority to specify what level of certification is required for maint, repairs, and inspections. Rotax is a manufacturer, and in all of their documentation they specify that a mechanic must have factory specific training (so an A&P technically has to get Rotax training for each level of work that he will do).
This engine service training does not apply to anyone with an E-LSA RV-12, because it is an experimental category aircraft, so Rotax's stipulations do not apply (though I feel it is still a very good idea... the majority of the engine questions I see asked here on the forum, wouldn't be asked if the person had gotten proper training for maintaining the engine).
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  #28  
Old 10-11-2012, 09:29 PM
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Skykingbob Skykingbob is offline
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Bealeton Virginia
Posts: 557
Default It's Incurable!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RVguy View Post
Thanks Mike, glad to be here. Been lurking for about a year now and finally posted today. I have got to admit, this site and the whole idea of building a Vans aircraft is becoming quite an obsession. I made an offer on a partially completed 7 empennage today on the VAF classified and am crossing my fingers eagerly waiting a reply. Hec, Im even dreaming about this stuff....lol
Steve,

Welcome to VAF! Sounds to me as though you have been bitten by the RV Bug! There is no antidote and you simply have to live with the symptoms (uncontrolled drooling when looking at RV photos, random dreams of RV building, increased involuntary grinning reflexes, obsession of thoughts of how your gonna "make it happen", and addiction to VAF forum)....yes its a chronic condition Rx.....read two posts at night.....and log on again in the morning

YOL BOLSON STEVE!!!
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Yes I paid my =VAF= membership dues!
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  #29  
Old 10-11-2012, 09:40 PM
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WingedFrog WingedFrog is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 863
Red face Here comes the party spoiler!

The news of an RV-12 S-LSA for sale is good for all RV-12 E-LSA builders and owners. As I was learning to fly while I was building an RV-12, I struggled with my transition training because of a lack of RV-12 availability for hire and training.
I am not an Industrial Engineer and therefore cannot rate the RV-12 design regarding it's adaptability to cost effective industrial production. What I remember of the two very plaisant years I spent building one in my workshop is the time consuming aspect of some tasks like metal fabrication, deburing and fiber work on the canopy and cowling. My question therefore is: based on the current design, is it possible to produce the RV-12 at a competitive price and have a profitable business model? Based on the lower building time of 600 hours, the labor cost at $50/hour is $30K, add this to the cost of the kit, painting and you hit the $115K announced. Unfortunately this does not include the cost of investing into a facility and business overhead.
I believe that VANs will quickly get under pressure to create changes that make the kit easier, cheaper and faster to build. Will such an evolution be compatible with the E-LSA status? Will it be compatible with the tools and skills of an amateur builder? I also doubt that an all riveted metal S-LSA is the way of the future, just look at the top selling models: they are mostly composite.
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  #30  
Old 10-11-2012, 10:24 PM
RVguy RVguy is offline
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Lewiston, NY
Posts: 35
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skykingbob View Post
Steve,

Welcome to VAF! Sounds to me as though you have been bitten by the RV Bug! There is no antidote and you simply have to live with the symptoms (uncontrolled drooling when looking at RV photos, random dreams of RV building, increased involuntary grinning reflexes, obsession of thoughts of how your gonna "make it happen", and addiction to VAF forum)....yes its a chronic condition Rx.....read two posts at night.....and log on again in the morning

YOL BOLSON STEVE!!!
Thanks for the warm welcome Bob...Great to be here.
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