RV-3: Phase 1 Tweaks

[sandifer]

Originally Posted by pierre smith

How would you rate it as an aerobatic mount? Can you do crisp 4 point rolls in her? 8 points maybe?

If you've flown a Pitts, how does Jr. compare in control response and roll rate?

Crisp point rolls? Oh yeah...but that's a pilot factor. Can do as many points as you like. Bob Hoover did nice crisp 16-pt rolls in the Shrike.

With inverted systems, I think an RV is more capable than a Super Decathlon, and handles much nicer. An RV will do almost everything a Pitts will do, but it just doesn't have the roll rate or quite the power-to-weight ratio. Depending on the model, Pitts' roll between about 180-240 deg/sec. I'd guess the RV-3 is in the 130 deg/sec. range. Probably the only non-gyroscopic maneuver I wouldn't do in an RV that I would in the Pitts are outside and vertical up snaps. Except for gyroscopics (which I wouldn't do in an RV either), all other aerobatics is just a combination of loop, roll, spin, and snap maneuvers. An RV will do many combinations of these figures to perfection in skilled hands.

Most aerobatic airplanes are a lot more capable than 99% of the pilots who fly them. A pilot might quickly learn to push the limits of an airplane's performance capabilities, but he/she will not so quickly push the limits of peformance PLUS precision. A pilot only truly needs to move to a higher-performing mount when they can extract total performance and do it with a high-degree of precision. Most don't work hard enough to ever get to this level, regardless of aircraft type. There are very few pilots in the world (I'm not one of them) who can do that even in a Pitts, even though the modern carbon monoplanes far exceed the performance of the Pitts.

[highflight42x]

flaps reinforcement: There was nothing in the plans for how to reinforce or fair the .020 lower inboard flap skin with the fuselage, so I took a piece of .040 2024-T3, riveted to the fwd flap spar as shown, and overlapped the last few fasteners on the aft end of the flap rib for stiffness. The trick is to make the riveting flush on the inside where the reinforced flap skin contacts the fuselage when flaps are up, but 040 is not thick enough to allow flush rivet on the outside as well, which I left round-head.



air-scoop: note the eyeball blower vent on left side of panel. The air scoop is just fwd of that. Plenty of air blast through - I'm sure someone could do a much better job with a less obtrusive scoop in that position.



- Steven
700 RV3 hours
(plus 2.5 more yesterday!)

[GusBiz]

Paul,

This may seem like a silly question but would the IO-375 or IO-360 go on the -3B?

Would that be just too much get up and go?

It would be kind of a Rocket -3 but if your looking for an aircraft with amazing performance and isn't $180k with a brand new engine then the -3B with the IO-360 would be kind of cool.

Is thqat an option?

[Flyguytki]

Gus, I think the big problem with going with a larger engine is you would most definatly go beyond VNE of the Airframe. Paul had stated earlier that even with the 0320 he has to throttle back to not exceed VNE, and as we all know once you go beyond VNE your kinda on your own. Now I have never looked very detailed into the 3 but is there anyway you could beef up the airframe to potentially increase VNE?

-david

[Ironflight]

Great pictures Steven - I had decided we'd do some reinforcement on the flap, and now I know how I want to do it!

On the bigger engine....I personally don't think I'd go any bigger without a balanced tail (like has been done on a beautiful RV-3 called "Hack Job" out in New Mexico. I can't remember what he has for an engine, but he did a beautiful job on a custom tail.

Yes, we can go over red line right now with the -320. No need for more for our purposes....

Paul

[Subwaybob]

Um, this may be off of the subject a little but is that underwear in the "Power, Mixture" levers? It looks like it and if so what the heck are you doing in your 3? Secondly, how much room is really in there?

All valid questions....

Originally Posted by highflight42x

- Steven
700 RV3 hours
(plus 2.5 more yesterday!)

[highflight42x]

Nope, not under-dundies, but a Rambo headband ... you know, Top Gun, Sierra Hotel and all that. Essential for dogfights - and oh, that's the radar-tracking gunsight on the canopy bow. When you get your -7 built, check 6 often Bob, I'll be a-lookin' to put the pipper on ye (aye laddie, you've awakened the Merciless Celt in me ...)

- Steven
700 RV3 hours

[highflight42x]

Now, to the worthwhile question - yep, the -3 cockpit is snug. I am 175lbs, 6', and it's just right for me. No room to move around, though. Three hours airborne in there, and I'm ready to take it off (yes, you don't "climb into" an RV3, you "put it on and wear it". No joke.)

- Steven
700 RV3 hours

(P.S. That's not REALLY a gunsight on the canopy bow, it's my micro-GPS. Had you worried there, didn't I, eh??) ("Safety-brief all dogfights, discuss all offensive and defensive maneuvers, and never take on an ex-Air Force or Navy guy, or he'll eat your lunch for you. (And don't even THINK about doing it with an ex-MARINE - he'll take you out, your extended family, your neighborhood, your hometown ... ").

Peace.

[rvmills]

Steven,

Hope you don't mind another Bob rolling in to offer mutual support to a fellow Bob, but...

This is too good to pass up!

Totally looks like underdundies...it coulda been a great story!

A Rambo headband? C'mon, Rambo's headband had blood on it, and it was torn from an OD green t-shirt! That thing's paisley!

Truth be known, I might turn tail and bug out from a guy that's wearing that...gotta be pretty dern tough to wear that in a fight!

"Snap guns", now "chaff, flares, out of burner, ready to pitch back in if the threat turns hard". Thanks for letting an intruder into the fight...all in fun brudda! (Oh, and I like the looks of your 3!!)

Paul, thanks for allowing a little furball into your thread...the content of that is great to learn from!

Cheers,
Bob

[David Paule]

Originally Posted by David Paule

On ventilation - would it make sense to install a vent on the fiberglass canopy fairing right behind the forward frame bow? In some photos, it looks like one of Van's NACA scoops would fit right there, especially on the starboard side. The fiberglass to fiberglass bond would be easy and secure.

Perhaps an eyeball outlet could be fitted directly to the inlet. It might be high enough to get out of any disturbed air flow from the cheeks, and would certainly be direct.

Hah! I just noticed SK-59, which describes the same inlet in that same position but with a different outlet.

I haven't even gotten my kits yet and I'm learning that you've got to read EVERYTHING!

Anyway, there it is....

Dave

Update --
I was reading "27 Years of the RVator," and it has a bit on this that's worth mentioning. It says that this position doesn't work very well. But adding a couple vortex generators ahead of the inlet works. Then on an RV-4, a better position is on the lower fuselage below the cheeks, but didn't define the exact location. This was on page 176, if you have the book.
Dave