VansAirForceForums  
Home > VansAirForceForums

- POSTING RULES
- Donate yearly (please).
- Advertise in here!

- Today's Posts | Insert Pics


Go Back   VAF Forums > RV Firewall Forward Section > Propellers
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Today's Posts

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #21  
Old 01-07-2012, 09:26 PM
gerrychuck gerrychuck is offline
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Moose Jaw, SK, Canada
Posts: 550
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hgerhardt View Post
Would you ever buy a car with a one-speed transmission?
I would if I could do everything I needed to in my car using only a 600 rpm power band...
__________________
Gerry Julian
Moose Jaw Saskatchewan
RV6A "Second Wind" C-GERZ (born N242UL)
O-360 A1A, Sensenich FP prop

Those who think any system is foolproof greatly underestimate the ingenuity of fools
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-30-2012, 09:37 PM
RV-7 2004 RV-7 2004 is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Blue Springs MO
Posts: 11
Default CS vs. FP

What is the price differential? If your mission is to go cross country isn't it better to just go fp? Formation flying does sound like fun though making me want to go with a 390 cs hotrod. It all comes down to money
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-31-2012, 04:31 AM
RV8R999 RV8R999 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: na
Posts: 1,457
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV-7 2004 View Post
What is the price differential? If your mission is to go cross country isn't it better to just go fp? Formation flying does sound like fun though making me want to go with a 390 cs hotrod. It all comes down to money
Don't let anyone tell you formation requires a CS - pure bunk!
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-31-2012, 05:03 AM
ronschreck's Avatar
ronschreck ronschreck is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,628
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV8R999 View Post
Don't let anyone tell you formation requires a CS - pure bunk!
OK, there's formation (A):



And then there's formation (B):



Neither requires a CS prop, but at some point between A and B you will wish you had one.

(How many times must we have this discussion?)
__________________
Ron Schreck
IAC National Judge
RV-8, "Miss Izzy", 2250 Hours - Sold
VAF 2021 Donor
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-31-2012, 07:00 AM
RV8R999 RV8R999 is offline
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: na
Posts: 1,457
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronschreck View Post
(How many times must we have this discussion?)
as often as is required...

Formation A = Saturday morning join up with friends for breakfast and a quick game of tail-chase... FP or CS does not matter as long as lead understands the performance limits.

Formation B = Airshow performers who need maximum performance...a niche at best.

If you are going from A to B and B's flight memebers all have CS then you probably should also. What if you go from A to B and B has all FP?
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 01-31-2012, 01:25 PM
ronschreck's Avatar
ronschreck ronschreck is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Gilbert, AZ
Posts: 1,628
Talking It's your airplane. Do what you want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV8R999 View Post
as often as is required...

Formation A = Saturday morning join up with friends for breakfast and a quick game of tail-chase... FP or CS does not matter as long as lead understands the performance limits.

Formation B = Airshow performers who need maximum performance...a niche at best.

If you are going from A to B and B's flight memebers all have CS then you probably should also. What if you go from A to B and B has all FP?
B=a niche at best or the best niche. It's up to you!

B, all with FP... You better be careful! You can all overspeed all your engines at once.
__________________
Ron Schreck
IAC National Judge
RV-8, "Miss Izzy", 2250 Hours - Sold
VAF 2021 Donor
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 01-31-2012, 01:44 PM
luddite42 luddite42 is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 454
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ronschreck View Post
B, all with FP... You better be careful! You can all overspeed all your engines at once.
Cool, wouldn't hurt a thing and would sound awesome.

Remember the 'French Connection' or the 'Red Devils'? Pretty top level FP prop formation aerobatics.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fXl4...B29C38037A3C1B
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 01-31-2012, 02:25 PM
smokyray's Avatar
smokyray smokyray is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: TX32
Posts: 1,891
Default No weapon too simple, for a brave man...

Age old question, same answer, it depends.

Post 9/11 my F16 Squadron had eleven RV4's (including mine) owned and flown by squadron pilots before we deployed to Iraq in 2002. It was so unique I wrote an article for Sport Aviation and somehow they published it! FP and C/S were well represented, six vs five. The FP airplanes were purchased that way mainly due to availability and budgetary constraints.
The guys flying them were full up modern combat fighter pilots who operated the airplanes safely but at the very upper edge of their envelope. Formation flying (tactical and non), short grass strips, day, night (NVG's), acro, dogfights (lots of dogfights!) didn't matter. The prop made little difference in planning and execution in every category except in glide ratio contingency planning. One pilot noted that his FP RV4 could glide 10 miles for every 5K feet lost in a power off glide. The C/S was less than half that. The F16 free of external stores will glide further. Note to self...

For guys making the choice, look at cost vs return for YOUR type flying and budget. C/S is a nice option but it requires money, more moving parts and is more expensive to repair. It's not a go-no-go. A good pilot can operate a FP RV in any arena with equal aplomb as a C/S, it just requires a bit of finesse.

Smokey

Of course we weren't doing doing loops to music at airshows...

Last edited by smokyray : 01-31-2012 at 02:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 01-31-2012, 02:55 PM
mike newall's Avatar
mike newall mike newall is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Yorkshire, England
Posts: 2,052
Default

When you consider that Van has always said that a fixed pitch propeller has been a challenge due to the large speed range, being able to use a C/S prop seems to be the obvious solution.

I know that some of the composite and wood props flex and give etc, however if you want to take advantage of the total performance that RV's give, I think the added expense and complexity of the C/S prop is well worth it.

However, that said, if your budget and chosen aims of the finished aeroplane tend towards FP - go for it.

My aeroplane partner, Mark, built a 7, FP. Great aeroplane, great build and finish.

He had offers for his, I wanted to sell half of mine when I finished mine and we ended up half and half in mine.

I have an IO-360, MT 3 Blade.

It looked like a perfect match - so I gave Mark a ride in mine.

I think the phrase rhymed with Clucking Bell when I opened her up on the runway...............

Ironically - one of the issues of the MT is that we seldom land fully fine - usually set to around 2500 rpm, gives a much sweeter flare and there is plenty of power in the event of a missed.

Horses for courses - it's just that ours is a whole lot more fun
__________________
"I add a little excitement, a little spice to your lives, and all you do is complain!" - Q

Donated in 2020
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 01-31-2012, 03:17 PM
SteinAir SteinAir is offline
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,473
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mike newall View Post
Ironically - one of the issues of the MT is that we seldom land fully fine - usually set to around 2500 rpm, gives a much sweeter flare and there is plenty of power in the event of a missed.
Set to 2500 RPM in the flair at idle (unless you're carrying a good bit of MP) should set the prop against the fine pitch stops anyway....except if you're prop is Couterweighted? Just curious!

Cheers,
Stein
Reply With Quote
Reply



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:42 AM.


The VAFForums come to you courtesy Delta Romeo, LLC. By viewing and participating in them you agree to build your plane using standardized methods and practices and to fly it safely and in accordance with the laws governing the country you are located in.