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12-29-2011, 08:25 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Huntersville, NC
Posts: 138
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Who's got the fastest RV-4?
I think within the next couple of years, I'll be able to afford a higher time, $40k RV4. What I really want is a Rocket because of the cruise speed. But at the same time, they are easily $100k and the operating costs are higher at lower altitudes.
So, lets say I get a $40k RV4, put a 180hp engine on it with a composite CS 2 bladed prop, fast back, EVO wings, and some speed mods, is a honest 180 kts true possible? Faster?
Even if it ends up being an $80k RV-4 spent over time, it's still less than a Rocket, and will have a much lower operating cost. Doing it this way will allow me to get into a 4, fly the wings off it, and as time goes by and I save up do one thing at a time.
Anyway, just wanted to hear what some of you have done to your 4's and what kind of cruise speed is possible.
Steve
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12-29-2011, 08:32 AM
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fugio ergo sum
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Carlsbad, NM
Posts: 1,912
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Dave Anders
__________________
Larry Pardue
Carlsbad, NM
RV-6 N441LP Flying
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12-29-2011, 08:47 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: TX32
Posts: 1,891
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Speed is Life?
Steve,
Being a legacy RV-4 dude and having been blessed to fly over 130 different 4's and Rockets over the years I haven't met one I didn't like.
I have my own opinions on the subject. First things first: have you flown one yet? When you do you or you already have realized it is a wonderful compromise airplane. Speed, mild acro, low relative cost STOL. However comma, in my consulting business everybody asks the proverbial question, how fast does it go? I ask right back, how fast do you want to go? How much money do you have
The fastest 4 I know of is Dave Anders winged masterpiece, nearly 20 years of aircraft evolution in process. IO-360 angle valve by LyCon, several prop iterations and fastback/faired composite control surfaced. 240 MPH during the CAFE trials, pretty darn fast for a 210 MPH VNE design. My HR2 would do 215 Knots in level flight at 27 squared 24GPH, big tires, caked mud and all. All of the RV4 mods you can muster(fastback, big engine, prop) will give you around 180 KTAS at 8500'. Even a banged up 150 HP wood propped 90's vintage 4 will do 160 True at 8500'. Hard to beat the performance and value, of course Van said that when he penned the RV4 back in 1978...Sold me.
Questions?
Smokey
PS: The question I never hear? "How slow can you go"? When you live on a 1500' strip or like dog-fighting other airplanes (like I do) it is a real selling point. The answer: RV4 55 knots final approach speed, HR2: 62 Knots even slower with VG's. That is truly an amazing range.

Last edited by smokyray : 12-29-2011 at 08:58 AM.
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12-29-2011, 09:01 AM
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Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Wichita Falls, TX
Posts: 2,182
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve91t
So, lets say I get a $40k RV4, put a 180hp engine on it with a composite CS 2 bladed prop, fast back, EVO wings, and some speed mods, is a honest 180 kts true possible? Faster?
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Quite likely could.
JetJ01's fastback RV-4 has a carbureted O-360, Hartzell BA CS prop, James cowl, and it'll walk off and leave the RV-8 in my avatar behind. See this thread: http://www.vansairforce.com/communit...ad.php?t=74115 pics of JJ's plane on page 2 of it. He says it'll easily hit 180 kts.
(The RV-8 is equipped with ECI IO-360, 9.2:1 pistons, cold air induction, and Hartzell BA CS prop too).
__________________
Neal Howard
Airplaneless once again...
Last edited by Neal@F14 : 12-29-2011 at 12:06 PM.
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12-29-2011, 09:27 AM
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Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,082
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Good analysis Smokey. On my -4 I get 176 TAS at 8K DA burning 8gph. O320D3G 160hp with Hartzel CS prop, single Electroair EI, a heavy right wing and no other mods. Stalls at 51kts clean except when pulling g's in a turning fight. With a bigger engine you add weight requiring more HP and higher stall when pulling g's. Higher weight also takes away from the already low aerobatic gross of the -4. The tradeoff for a few extra knots is not worth it in my opinion.
__________________
Mike
JAMES AIRCRAFT.com
Flying - RV8 Hot Rod "Drone Killer"
Flying - RV8 "Look'n Good"
RV4 - FAST & FUN! Rebuilt, Flown, Sold
RV-7A Built, Flown, Sold
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12-29-2011, 11:06 AM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: TX32
Posts: 1,891
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JJ's FB4
Steve/Mike/Neal,
JJ and I have been friends for longer than I care to elaborate  He saw my 4 way back in 97' and since then has owned numerous RV's, several 4's amongst them. We both went the Rocket route and agreed many years ago that nothing flew better than a lightweight stock RV4. So when he started building his FB4 several years ago he had alot of corporate knowledge to build on. HR2 Fastback fuse, 0-360 carb/Hartzell BA. Dynon and garmin 496. The only place I disagree is the prop. I would have mounted a 3 blade Catto in lieu the Hartzell. (I like a light nose RV.) The BA is a great prop though...
That said...
180HP? Sure but a HP 0-320 or 0-340 does great as well for a few less lbs.
EVO wings? Not needed. Stock wings on a 4 work fine.
Composite prop. For me? Yes. C/S? How big is your wallet?
The Best RV4? Depends on YOU. ( consider the source that JJ and I are old crusty Fighter guys) We both agree we don't like the 8 (no offense 8 guys) and agree the Rocket is a better airplane if you want a "bigger 4"(John Harmon figured that out a long time ago). But as you mentioned Rockets are spendy $$$. So, best bang for buck? JJ's FB4. As Neal mentioned it's par excellence. Light, simple, fast and aerobatic. 182 Knots TAS at 8500' 8-9 GPH for under $60K. Questions?
Smokey
Of all the RV's I have flown which is my favorite?
You're looking at it!

My HR2
JJ's FB4
Last edited by smokyray : 12-29-2011 at 01:10 PM.
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12-29-2011, 02:23 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, WA USA
Posts: 908
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I was going to say,,,,
My -4 already does better then 180 knots in cruse at 10k' at 8.5-GPH or so,, but I normally choose to run at 160 knots at less then 7-GPH. You don't need no Evo wing! 180 to 200HP and a CS prop is nice though!
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12-29-2011, 04:41 PM
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Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 1,544
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Nobody "needs" an EVO wing but check out the numbers from my last fall flight to Taylor Texas, T74
A 214knot true airspeed burning 11.4 gph. 182knot ground speed with a 33 knot headwind!
The EVO wing in regards to this discussion is simply academic as the wing would not fit on a RV4 fuselage. 180 knots on a clean RV4 is most certainly possible but it will take a bit of work to make a clean aircraft and more then a bit of money in terms of the engine and prop to get those numbers. Again, nobody needs an EVO wing but check this out, my top recorded average SARL speed was at the 2010 Rocket 100 race, 238.6 knots burning 23gph.

__________________
Tom Martin RV1 pilot 4.6hours!
CPL & IFR rated
EVO F1 Rocket 1000 hours,
2010 SARL Rocket 100 race, average speed of 238.6 knots/274.6mph
RV4, RV7, RV10, two HRIIs and five F1 Rockets
RV14 Tail dragger
Fairlea Field
St.Thomas, Ontario Canada, CYQS
fairleafield@gmail.com
Last edited by Tom Martin : 12-29-2011 at 04:46 PM.
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12-29-2011, 04:49 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Victoria, BC, Canada
Posts: 3,932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve91t
Even if it ends up being an $80k RV-4 spent over time, it's still less than a Rocket, and will have a much lower operating cost.
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There's no "if" there... If you put all those mods on it, you *will* have an $80K RV-4, or more. And as for the operating cost, I think you're kidding yourself. Rockets fly just fine (and sip less gas) at reduced power settings. Of course, when you factor in that you're getting there significantly faster in the first place, even flying at "normal" Rocket power settings isn't lots more expensive.
Quote:
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Doing it this way will allow me to get into a 4, fly the wings off it, and as time goes by and I save up do one thing at a time.
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This is the real benefit to your chosen path. Another option, of course, is that you could just finance a Rocket, and start flying a Rocket *now*. 
__________________
Rob Prior
1996 RV-6 "Tweety" C-FRBP (formerly N196RV)
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12-29-2011, 05:28 PM
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Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Vancouver, WA USA
Posts: 908
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Martin
Nobody "needs" an EVO wing but check out the numbers from my last fall flight to Taylor Texas, T74
A 214knot true airspeed burning 11.4 gph. 182knot ground speed with a 33 knot headwind!
The EVO wing in regards to this discussion is simply academic as the wing would not fit on a RV4 fuselage. 180 knots on a clean RV4 is most certainly possible but it will take a bit of work to make a clean aircraft and more then a bit of money in terms of the engine and prop to get those numbers. Again, nobody needs an EVO wing but check this out, my top recorded average SARL speed was at the 2010 Rocket 100 race, 238.6 knots burning 23gph.

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To be clear I should have said nobody needs an Evo wing to reach Steve's stated goal of 180 knot cruse with an RV-4.
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