|
-
POSTING RULES

-
Donate yearly (please).
-
Advertise in here!
-
Today's Posts
|
Insert Pics
|

11-19-2011, 11:55 AM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: ____
Posts: 829
|
|
G500
For the same reasons as post #20, you might try an approach with a Garmin G500. I would think the total cost would be similar to the IFR Aspen.
|

11-19-2011, 12:40 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,473
|
|
I won't comment much other than to say the Stormscope will also interface with the GTN box (though not published, we have it working in several planes in other countries) as well as the Aspen. The GTS will interface with the GTN and I think the AFS as well as the Aspen.
I don't know the entirety of your requirements/mission, but given your list of equipment, I may be inclined to look at a G500 or a G900X. We know that both are legal in Brazil because we've sold a lot of both to Brazilian builders with IFR planes. A quick bit of math shows me that you're less than $10K difference to a full blown G900X.
Anyway, like others have said there are variables I don't know about so I can't really make specific comments at this time on brands.
Just my 2 cents as usual!
Cheers,
Stein
|

11-19-2011, 01:03 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brazil
Posts: 46
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteinAir
I won't comment much other than to say the Stormscope will also interface with the GTN box (though not published, we have it working in several planes in other countries) as well as the Aspen. The GTS will interface with the GTN and I think the AFS as well as the Aspen.
I don't know the entirety of your requirements/mission, but given your list of equipment, I may be inclined to look at a G500 or a G900X. We know that both are legal in Brazil because we've sold a lot of both to Brazilian builders with IFR planes. A quick bit of math shows me that you're less than $10K difference to a full blown G900X.
Anyway, like others have said there are variables I don't know about so I can't really make specific comments at this time on brands.
Just my 2 cents as usual!
Cheers,
Stein
|
Thank you! I agree with you but the problem with the $10k diference you told is that in Brazil $10k = R$17.800,00!
I keep in mind that it?s a single engine. So, flying IFR should be a exception. In other words, the airplane is for recreational purposes but it will be used to fly from the southeast to the northeast of Brazil. During this time, weather can change and become IFR. So, I need a IFR panel to, at least, land in a airport safely and do not having my plane apprehended and charged in $2k!
I was doing some arithmetic and the initial configuration is blowing my budget of $55k. So I started excluding GTN, stormscope, traffic and VP-X. In Brazil the avionics usually get overpriced in about 30% to 40%. In my count, it?s about $54k without the avionics I told above. I know fly IFR without a stormscope and a traffic in Brazil is suicide, but I?ll have to postpone the order of these avionics 
|

11-19-2011, 01:24 PM
|
|
|
|
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 2,473
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by cristianomc
Thank you! I agree with you but the problem with the $10k diference you told is that in Brazil $10k = R$17.800,00!
I was doing some arithmetic and the initial configuration is blowing my budget of $55k. So I started excluding GTN, stormscope, traffic and VP-X. In Brazil the avionics usually get overpriced in about 30% to 40%. In my count, it?s about $54k without the avionics I told above. I know fly IFR without a stormscope and a traffic in Brazil is suicide, but I?ll have to postpone the order of these avionics 
|
You don't necessarily have to give up! You just have to get creative on what you purchase when and how. I think that $55K could get you pretty close to what you want. For example:
G500+SVT
GTS800
SL40
GTX327 (remote mounted)
GMA240
GTN650
Sorcerer with Servos
EMS-D10 with probes for Engine Monitor
I get a total of around US$58K before the Garmin rebates of $4K and you're down to around US $54K. I don't know what the current exchange rates are, but I think there definately is some room to work with here. There are a lot of other configurations floating around in my head that would work, but that's just one example. I'm pretty sure we could some up with something that'd be both legal and workable with your budget. Things like the SVT could be purchased later, that'd shave off some money right there. The Autopilot could start out as something like a VSGV and be upgraded to a sorcerer quite easily later (that'd save some money as well).
Cheers,
Stein
|

11-19-2011, 01:40 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Delaware, OH (KDLZ)
Posts: 4,196
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynonsupport
If it's a backup EFIS, then it can be the primary autopilot, and spending big money to get 100% independent EFIS and autopliot is a bit of overkill. This whole airplane is a lot of overkill!
|
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. However, many folks that fly IFR aren't of the same opinion.
It's only overkill if your butt isn't in the seat when/if the EFIS craps out, which could be due to power, component failure, or sowftware glitch. Fortunately, with most of the popular EFIS, this is exremely infrequent. However, I'm personally aware of incidents with all the vendors in which the screen locked up or had to be reboot inflight.
I don't know about you, but if I'm in IMC conditions, I would prefer to have an independent AP to keep the wings level with I deal with the issue and to determine what needs to be done.
I'll agree that if you only fly VFR, then it isn't a big deal. I think it is a prudent system design choice if you fly IFR.
It's all about risk management. Do you accept, transfer, or mitigate the risk? Each option has a cost, along with positive and negative attributes.
Each builder has to make a decision in which of these are more important to them.
As far as the rest of the gear being overkill, as the OP stated, most of that was government mandated.
bob
|

11-19-2011, 02:07 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Woodinville, WA
Posts: 1,499
|
|
Cristian,
The SkyView has a USB port (3 actually). We went that way since every PC around has USB, but many require a converter to use an SD card. If you really want to use an SD card on SkyView, you can plug in a USB to SD converter.
We didn't put it on the face of the product since it meant we'd have to make the product bigger. One interesting thing with SkyView is that all data is internal, we don't need anything plugged in to USB to operate, you just plug it in when you want to update.
If your goal is "easy to fly" I think one issue you'll have with any EFIS is that your panel is actually very complex. You need to set the baro in both the Aspen and the EFIS you choose. You do your flight planning in the GTN. There are going to be a lot of things that make this airplane less integrated than a lot of other planes around, since you have two EFIS systems. As much as it pains me to say it, I think Stein is right that you may be better off with a system like the Garmin G500, since you actually need some certified stuff in the plane, and once you have that need you might as well go with a really well integrated system.
Bob,
The OP has an Aspen in the plane. Effectively, his experimental EFIS IS the autopilot, since his main EFIS is the Aspen and is totally independent of the experimental EFIS. I don't think you really mean to say that an airplane is not IFR unless it has two independent EFIS units AND an independent autopilot?
If you could only have one thing working in your plane, would you want it to be your EFIS, or your autopilot? I ask because you can get an EFIS cheaper than an autopilot.
A Dynon D6 is $1600 and runs an independent code base from SkyView. So if you use SkyView, the Servos plus a D6 cost $3,100. Now your backup is a full EFIS, not just a wing and altitude hold (which is all the TruTrak can do when your EFIS is offline). I don't think you can buy any dual axis competing autopilot for $3,100 anywhere, much less one that comes with a free EFIS.
Personally, if I'm in the soup and my EFIS goes blank, I'd rather have a second EFIS, not just an AP. Given what I know about SkyView though, I'd trust myself to a dual SkyView AHRS / Dual screen setup anyday, where failures are handled gracefully and automatically.
|

11-19-2011, 03:32 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brazil
Posts: 46
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteinAir
You don't necessarily have to give up! You just have to get creative on what you purchase when and how. I think that $55K could get you pretty close to what you want. For example:
G500 .................................................. ................... $13,989.00
GTS800 (2 antennas) ................................................ $8,989.00
SL40 .................................................. .................... $1,745.00
GTX327 (remote mounted) GTX-32 .............................. $2,289.00
GMA240 GMA-35 .................................................. ..... $2,649.00
GTN650 .................................................. ................. $9,839.00
Sorcerer with Servos +autotrim .................................... $8,100.00
EMS-D10 with probes for Engine Monitor JPI EDM 730 ....... $1,696.00
TOTAL (in USA) ... $49,296.00 in Brazil (+30%)..$64,084.80 (tooooooo much!)
I get a total of around US$58K before the Garmin rebates of $4K and you're down to around US $54K. I don't know what the current exchange rates are, but I think there definately is some room to work with here. There are a lot of other configurations floating around in my head that would work, but that's just one example. I'm pretty sure we could some up with something that'd be both legal and workable with your budget. Things like the SVT could be purchased later, that'd shave off some money right there. The Autopilot could start out as something like a VSGV and be upgraded to a sorcerer quite easily later (that'd save some money as well). Garmin is not offering rebates for international customers! Feel free to send me msg. I?d love to have this panel but..... my customs are too severe. I don?t know a store that work with parceling or financing with good rates.
Cheers,
Stein
|
..........
|

11-19-2011, 03:39 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Brazil
Posts: 46
|
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by dynonsupport
Cristian,
The SkyView has a USB port (3 actually). We went that way since every PC around has USB, but many require a converter to use an SD card. If you really want to use an SD card on SkyView, you can plug in a USB to SD converter.
We didn't put it on the face of the product since it meant we'd have to make the product bigger. One interesting thing with SkyView is that all data is internal, we don't need anything plugged in to USB to operate, you just plug it in when you want to update.
If your goal is "easy to fly" I think one issue you'll have with any EFIS is that your panel is actually very complex. You need to set the baro in both the Aspen and the EFIS you choose. You do your flight planning in the GTN. There are going to be a lot of things that make this airplane less integrated than a lot of other planes around, since you have two EFIS systems. As much as it pains me to say it, I think Stein is right that you may be better off with a system like the Garmin G500, since you actually need some certified stuff in the plane, and once you have that need you might as well go with a really well integrated system.
Bob,
The OP has an Aspen in the plane. Effectively, his experimental EFIS IS the autopilot, since his main EFIS is the Aspen and is totally independent of the experimental EFIS. I don't think you really mean to say that an airplane is not IFR unless it has two independent EFIS units AND an independent autopilot?
If you could only have one thing working in your plane, would you want it to be your EFIS, or your autopilot? I ask because you can get an EFIS cheaper than an autopilot.
A Dynon D6 is $1600 and runs an independent code base from SkyView. So if you use SkyView, the Servos plus a D6 cost $3,100. Now your backup is a full EFIS, not just a wing and altitude hold (which is all the TruTrak can do when your EFIS is offline). I don't think you can buy any dual axis competing autopilot for $3,100 anywhere, much less one that comes with a free EFIS.
Personally, if I'm in the soup and my EFIS goes blank, I'd rather have a second EFIS, not just an AP. Given what I know about SkyView though, I'd trust myself to a dual SkyView AHRS / Dual screen setup anyday, where failures are handled gracefully and automatically.
|
Thank you!
I?m in doubt because you?re right, this panel isn?t integrated. But to get a integrated Garmin, money is the problem. So we go to non-TSO and then reliability isn?t the same, plus itegrability. There is another thing: to add things later is more expensive, so getting everything now is better. But, again, the budget... my plane will be ready in march 2012, but I need the avionics by february, at max. So, no time to get more money! What a mess 
|

11-20-2011, 03:32 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 1,069
|
|
Seems that in these "comparison" threads Dynon skyview typically seems to be least favored for an IFR mission. Is there any particular reason as to why this is, or is it just personal preference..
(sorry if this is hijacking the treads original question)
__________________
Ryan Allen, CFII
RV7 N612RA, flying since july 2012
E-170/175
RV10 Tail Kit complete, Wings 90%, fuse on order
Acro Sport 2, building
|

11-20-2011, 05:41 PM
|
 |
|
|
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
Posts: 211
|
|
have you done both?
Quote:
Originally Posted by miyu1975
Seems that in these "comparison" threads Dynon skyview typically seems to be least favored for an IFR mission. Is there any particular reason as to why this is, or is it just personal preference..
(sorry if this is hijacking the treads original question)
|
+1
How many actually have flown the full new Skyview and AFS? Only those people have the experience needed to give a real world answer to this.
__________________
Gus Bisbal
RV7
Obsession only exists when someone else isn't doing it too.
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:55 AM.
|